Cain's 9/9/9 plan

[Core Imposter]

Cain admitted today that some would pay more under 9-9-9, but he completely lied or misunderstood as to why. He said those that would pay more are those that chose to buy new goods rather than used goods. It ignores that by design, most people at the low-to-middle end would pay more (especially familes with children and a mortgage). Can't wait to buy used food to save on my taxes. Does Godfather's pizza count?

And if he admits that the way to save taxes is to not purchase new items, isn't that going to hurt our businesses rather than be stimulative?

Cain is definitely bringing people together. Both liberals and conservatives are reaching agreement that he is a businessman that does not understand how taxation works. The plan is a bad joke.

 

[say1988]

The problem with cap gains is that you have to pay them every time your sell or trade. Even if you trade one stock for another without selling anything, you have to pay captain gains. It just discourages people from trading. If they can work this out, I really think it should be treated the same as income.

That doesn't make any sense Getting a $100,000 return on one transaction will be (and should be) equally taxed as a $100,000 return on 50 transactions, you just pay your transaction fes. If you lose on one transaction it is subracted from your gains on others with regards to taxes, it is cummulative. Though, if anything, they should actively discourage very short term investment.

 

[Antilogic]

your president did promise a more united states of america when he ran. but his soaring rhetoric of unity and cooperation problem may have meant a dogged willingness to cross the aisle 90% of the time though.

We could have a long talk about this, and it's probably already been had in another thread or two. But I don't think the definition of compromise is letting the opposition take everything. And there is a huge double-standard when it comes to lefties compromising and righties compromising in America.

That doesn't make any sense Getting a $100,000 return on one transaction will be (and should be) equally taxed as a $100,000 return on 50 transactions, you just pay your transaction fes. If you lose on one transaction it is subracted from your gains on others with regards to taxes, it is cummulative. Though, if anything, they should actively discourage very short term investment.

I always figured a bigger deterrent to active day-trading were the fees charged by the brokers, but that depends on who you bank with. It's better to invest for the long-term anyway... trying to constantly flip stuff short-term is exhausting, and doesn't always beat the market averages (unless you have some excellent inside information or a bit of luck).

 

[MagisterCultuum]

My dad says that since his income depends heavily on the profits earned by the CPA firm that bought him out he realizes that the 9/9/9 plan would be quite bad for us, but that he still supports Herman Cain because he knows that there is no chance that his plan could pass.

 

[Quackers]

It must be disheartening to elect your candidate into office and then realise he can only pass a small part of his agenda. In the UK the governing party can legislate anything they wish and undo any past act of parliament. Despite all this, the media endlessly bleats on about backbench rebellions but I've never seen one put a stop to new policy. The party whips keep them in check.

 

[dirtyparrot]

So, how is this plan supposed to reduce unemployment or improve the economy? Presumably his plan should at least target one if not both of those things.

 

[JollyRoger]

So, how is this plan supposed to reduce unemployment or improve the economy? Presumably his plan should at least target one if not both of those things.

To me it does neither. It makes giving money to shareholders tax deductible, but does noy allow for a deduction on what you spend on labor, thus possibly making the unemployment situation worse.

The way to avoid the sales tax is to purchase used items, thus hurting the economy in that there is a disincentive to consume from new production.

 

[Cutlass]

So, how is this plan supposed to reduce unemployment or improve the economy? Presumably his plan should at least target one if not both of those things.

It's the same old same old Supply Side Reagaonics trickle down fraud. They like to pretend that if the rich had more, then the only thing that could possibly happen is that they invest it.

 

[Integral]

So, how is this plan supposed to reduce unemployment or improve the economy? Presumably his plan should at least target one if not both of those things.

I've never understood this complaint, and I've never understood candidates pitching their tax plans in terms of "stimulus".

Tax policy ought to reflect long-run incentives, not be used for short-term stimulatory effect.

But hey, that's just like my opinion man.

 

[Cutlass]

I've never understood this complaint, and I've never understood candidates pitching their tax plans in terms of "stimulus".

Tax policy ought to reflect long-run incentives, not be used for short-term stimulatory effect.

But hey, that's just like my opinion man.

Long run incentives would begin to have effects in the nearterm as well.....

 

[Integral]

Sure, but we shouldn't be focused on near-term stimulatory effects. We can't overhaul the entire tax code every time there's a recession, in the same way that we can't have a permanent tax cut or permanent increase in government spending in every recession either.

 

[Core Imposter]

A national 9% sales tax would be a terrific incentive to thrift and thus capable of generating a recession from a good economy. You could also have a terrific cultural impact, whole segments of the population will essentially never buy a new good again and will be branded with a scarlet P for Poor.

We will also have a great time with a new black market upon which new goods will be sold as used.

Will restaurants be able to serve leftovers at a discount?

Will there be any tax in empowerment zones? Does this mean all the Walmarts will be moving to the hood?

 

[Integral]

Um...my old state (TN) had a 9.75% sales tax. I didn't see mass starvation or anything like that.

 

[Cutlass]

Um...my old state (TN) had a 9.75% sales tax. I didn't see mass starvation or anything like that.

Well, the problem with that is it's tax + tax. So in some states the sales tax really would be approaching discouraging. But would also be approaching the point where tax avoidance becomes a big issue.

 

[amadeus]

I'd rather see no taxes collected during the year and then everyone mailed a bill on April 15th. The only reason anyone has ever opposed this is precisely the reason I'm for it: people would actually find out how much they were paying.

 

[JollyRoger]

Tax policy ought to reflect long-run incentives,

The long-term incentives reflected in the Cain plan are to reduce labor costs and to shift consumption from new production to old production. Of course, those making money on the stocks of companies that do business in a better tax environment overseas are going to get by tax free.

 

[Cutlass]

Sure, but we shouldn't be focused on near-term stimulatory effects. We can't overhaul the entire tax code every time there's a recession, in the same way that we can't have a permanent tax cut or permanent increase in government spending in every recession either.

That's the political fallout of GHW Bush's failed reelection bid. Politicians cannot risk being seen to be doing nothing these days.

 

[Incodcito]

A national 9% sales tax would be a terrific incentive to thrift and thus capable of generating a recession from a good economy. You could also have a terrific cultural impact, whole segments of the population will essentially never buy a new good again and will be branded with a scarlet P for Poor.

We will also have a great time with a new black market upon which new goods will be sold as used.

Will restaurants be able to serve leftovers at a discount?

Will there be any tax in empowerment zones? Does this mean all the Walmarts will be moving to the hood?

I thought that once... until I realized that the vast majority of the western world has some form of a National Sales tax. Maybe the US would experience a one-off recession from introducing it, but I think that would be it.

:sigh:

Of course, don't take this people as meaning I support the 9/9/9 plan, I don't. I support a 16% NST with exemptions.

I also support new higher tax brackets for people earning above the current threshold for the current highest bracket up to 40%.

Finally, I support hikes for corporate taxes. Use that money to bring the debt to a more reasonable level, along with upgrading the failing infrastructure.