Caveman 2 Cosmos (ideas/discussions thread)

[strategyonly]

That's not suppose to happen.

But for INland lakes and stuff, it looks very realistic, especially around the state i am from.

 

[CivDad]

Well, These could be optional modules. Plus, There are also Fey, Netherworld, and Underworld techs.

 

[Hydromancerx]

But for INland lakes and stuff, it looks very realistic, especially around the state i am from.

Lakes are fine but oceans it should not be.

Well, These could be optional modules. Plus, There are also Fey, Netherworld, and Underworld techs.

See the C2C Modmods sub-forum. I think one of them is doing magic fantasy stuff.

 

[strategyonly]

OK you C++/Python experts . . .

Is there anyway you can get the Automate Hunt in the action area, WHEN attached to a GG? would be nice, rather than moving him manually all the time


btw i FINALLY made it Sed Life for the 1st time (1st) since the tech changes

 

[Koshling]

OK you C++/Python experts . . .

Is there anyway you can get the Automate Hunt in the action area, WHEN attached to a GG? would be nice, rather than moving him manually all the time


btw i FINALLY made it Sed Life for the 1st time (1st) since the tech changes

Not easily. Stacks have a single AI, which is always the AI of the lead unit. The AI is also (highly) dependent on a single priority ordering as to which unit leads in a stack, and GGs have a higher priority than hunters, so a stack with both will always operate as a GG (AI-wise). Since the auto-activity orders just work by invoking the AI, you only get ones supported by that stack's (lead) AI.

We'd need to change quite a lot to get the stack to show all possible automations (and then run with the appropriate unit as stack leader once chosen). It's not a trivial change.

 

[draz]

I'd never let the AI control a GG unit anyway; for hunters at least the automated hunting is not perfect when it comes to situational awareness (I've lost a few that could've easily been avoided via manual movement, for example after they ended a turn in a desert tile when there were enemies within attack range). Losing a great commander over something like that would sting even more than it normally does.

 

[Koshling]

I'd never let the AI control a GG unit anyway; for hunters at least the automated hunting is not perfect when it comes to situational awareness (I've lost a few that could've easily been avoided via manual movement, for example after they ended a turn in a desert tile when there were enemies within attack range). Losing a great commander over something like that would sting even more than it normally does.

Funny you should mention that case - it's one I plan to address in he first week after V25 is released - the AI is currently not handling terrain damage well at all - it knows it is expensive to move through, and that it can't stop to heal in it, but once it decides it can't stop to heal it doesn't look or somewhere it can - it just carries on exploring regardless, with the result that unless its exploration happens to takes it out of the terrian damage region before it's too late, it dies.

 

[strategyonly]

Also if i want to have the AI build more units of a certain type, is changing the AIWeight higher a better way to go or not??

 

[AIAndy]

If this was in a "units" area, whats the difference between the 2 and are both necessary to have there??

			<PropertyManipulators>
			  <PropertySource>
			    <PropertySourceType>PROPERTYSOURCE_CONSTANT</PropertySourceType>
			    <PropertyType>PROPERTY_CRIME</PropertyType>
				<GameObjectType>GAMEOBJECT_CITY</GameObjectType>
				<RelationType>RELATION_SAME_PLOT</RelationType>
			    <iAmountPerTurn>5</iAmountPerTurn>
			  </PropertySource>
			  <PropertySource>
			    <PropertySourceType>PROPERTYSOURCE_CONSTANT</PropertySourceType>
			    <PropertyType>PROPERTY_CRIME</PropertyType>
				<GameObjectType>GAMEOBJECT_PLOT</GameObjectType>
				<RelationType>RELATION_SAME_PLOT</RelationType>
			    <iAmountPerTurn>5</iAmountPerTurn>
			  </PropertySource>
			</PropertyManipulators>

The first applies to the city if the unit is in one, the second applies to the plot.

 

[Koshling]

Also if i want to have the AI build more units of a certain type, is changing the AIWeight higher a better way to go or not??

Yes and no. It will make it build that unit more, but in general it's A bad idea and will tend to distort things you didnt intend.

 

[strategyonly]

Yes and no. It will make it build that unit more, but in general it's A bad idea and will tend to distort things you didnt intend.

the real reason i am asking is because, now that we got the Bandits Hideout working, its not building the 2 early units, Thief and Rogue like its supposed to, it builds everything else in mass quantities but not those 2 for some reason??

 

[Koshling]

the real reason i am asking is because, now that we got the Bandits Hideout working, its not building the 2 early units, Thief and Rogue like its supposed to, it builds everything else in mass quantities but not those 2 for some reason??

Dunno, ut I wouldn't use the aiweght really. If you have saves where the ai has the buildings but doesn't build the units I can look into it after v25 is out, since I plan to spend the next month just on ai stuff anyway.

 

[JosEPh_II]

the real reason i am asking is because, now that we got the Bandits Hideout working, its not building the 2 early units, Thief and Rogue like its supposed to, it builds everything else in mass quantities but not those 2 for some reason??

@SO
I really believe part of the problem is the lifespan of the BH. It's attached to only 1 Civic Banditry. Once the AI adopts the next Civic Conscription it's lights out on getting the AI to build the BH.

I had been playing around with making Conscription, Standing Army, and Vassalage to all allow the BH. In that game the AI began to produce a few Rogues. That game had progressed well into the Classical era and almost every AI was using Conscription by then. I did not see the AI build any Ambushers. I was and it's how I noticed the 1st Rogues starting to enter my land.

At the same time I had upped the iweight on Merc Camp and Stables and as soon as I did that my neighbors started building and sending a bunch into my empire. You and Hydro were upping the iweight on the Mercs at that time too.

JosEPh

 

[strategyonly]

@SO
I really believe part of the problem is the lifespan of the BH. It's attached to only 1 Civic Banditry. Once the AI adopts the next Civic Conscription it's lights out on getting the AI to build the BH.

I had been playing around with making Conscription, Standing Army, and Vassalage to all allow the BH. In that game the AI began to produce a few Rogues. That game had progressed well into the Classical era and almost every AI was using Conscription by then. I did not see the AI build any Ambushers. I was and it's how I noticed the 1st Rogues starting to enter my land.

At the same time I had upped the iweight on Merc Camp and Stables and as soon as I did that my neighbors started building and sending a bunch into my empire. You and Hydro were upping the iweight on the Mercs at that time too.

JosEPh

OK, thx, good info on that.

 

[BlueGenie]

I'd be careful with using the iWeight like K says. iWeight would supersede the extra cost associated with most of those units and the +crime/turn the building gave. I believe "forcing" the AI to build those +5 and +6 cost units can cripple it if it didn't consider those costs before building them.

As for the Thief, Rogue, and Ambusher units it does not really matter that the BH can only be built in Banditry Civic as by the time Conscription comes into play they are really obsolete due to everyone having access to Mercs and mounted Mercs, and shortly thereafter Assassins. Besides the Ambusher is not relying on BH, it's relying on Poison Crafter's Hut so not having Banditry matters less there, rather not at all. Building Ambusher's require only the Poison Crafter's Hut and not having reached Matchlock or Alchemy technologies yet, Civics don't matter. Could be the AI wasn't building Ambushers because it didn't have Poison though.

Cheers

 

[charlesb96]

I am in the Middle Ages and have 15 Great Commanders, 5 of which have reached level 22, the highest they can go. After the advent of flight and the ability to shift these Generals very quickly to a needed battle front, I really do not need 15 of them. Is it possible to have a tech allow Great Commanders to be retired and become Great Military Instructers or use them to build the Corporations like for a newly recieved GG?

Also is it possible to make promotions given by building to be purchaced by any unit in the city, not just those build there? Any old unit should be able to walk into a city and BUY bamboo armor, not just those units built there. And you should be able to retrain old units for all other promotions given by the building or World Wonder, like Pankration for Hellenic Monastary.

 

[Thunderbrd]

Also is it possible to make promotions given by building to be purchaced by any unit in the city, not just those build there? Any old unit should be able to walk into a city and BUY bamboo armor, not just those units built there. And you should be able to retrain old units for all other promotions given by the building or World Wonder, like Pankration for Hellenic Monastary.

For most of those, their actually going to soon be free on entering the city. Costs are under consideration but for now free does make some sense from at least one angle of consideration and as the coding is currently, its already possible to do this, so we're considering utilizing this method for perhaps all of such free promos given by buildings.

I am in the Middle Ages and have 15 Great Commanders, 5 of which have reached level 22, the highest they can go. After the advent of flight and the ability to shift these Generals very quickly to a needed battle front, I really do not need 15 of them. Is it possible to have a tech allow Great Commanders to be retired and become Great Military Instructers or use them to build the Corporations like for a newly recieved GG?

Interesting idea... goes along with some thoughts I've had about making the permanent bonus specialists possibly capable of being subtracted from the city and added back to the map as its form of GP... Just thoughts at the moment, no plans. I may look into your idea as well eventually since I think there's some good merit there.


IRT the Banditry discussion: It seems to me the appropriate trick to employe would be a coding solution. Get the ai to value the strengths of those units (primarily the hidden nationality and invisibility features) a bit more so that its held in greater value than the loss of gold amounts to. With the loss of gold considered, the ai is probably understandably reluctant to build them.

 

[Koshling]

I am in the Middle Ages and have 15 Great Commanders, 5 of which have reached level 22, the highest they can go. After the advent of flight and the ability to shift these Generals very quickly to a needed battle front, I really do not need 15 of them. Is it possible to have a tech allow Great Commanders to be retired and become Great Military Instructers or use them to build the Corporations like for a newly recieved GG?

I think this should be a promotion that comes late in the tree, wherein the promotion(s) gives them the abilitty to perform some 'settling' action(s) such as settle as military instructor, or create military academy, etc. (or other special buuildingsg that can only be produced in this way potentially). If they can do it inhertly it makes life too easy and you'd never make that choice at the start, whereas now you have to weigh the in-field benefit of the GC against using the GG directly at creation to found something. By making it a late promotion you force the player to stick with their initial choice of GC and make it successful first.

This would require outcomes enabled by promotions, but I suspect that's either possible now, or very easy to add.

 

[strategyonly]

UPDATE Version 25 is available 2 Aug 12, 10:00 a.m.

 

[charlesb96]

Interesting idea... goes along with some thoughts I've had about making the permanent bonus specialists possibly capable of being subtracted from the city and added back to the map as its form of GP... Just thoughts at the moment, no plans. I may look into your idea as well eventually since I think there's some good merit there.

I suggested this long ago as it makes sense. When you capture a city, you should be able to remove those specialists and move them back to your military, production, science, whatever, center. Nazi Germany did it in WW2 taking scientists from captured countries back to work on their V1 and V2 projects. However they should be a special kind of GP, not able to bulb any techs but only settle as a bonus specialist in a city.