Caveman 2 Cosmos (ideas/discussions thread)

[rightfuture]

Check out this Mod that has work done to integrate seasonal changes of the map, probably using the Fall From Heaven Script.

World History Mod development thread
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=262780
by kevinman4404

He claims to have completed:
Wintermod/Icemod: 95%
on this concept.

This theory could be used for interesting seasonal changes (Spring, Summer, Fall, Winter); would love to see leaf changes in fall, around globe.
-as well as (Wet (Rainy/Flood) season / Dry) time of year for a precipitation script (could add El NINO like weather effect, Gulf Stream temperature changes)
-as well as (Ice Age/Global Warming) or hurricane frequency increasing models.
Maybe it could be collected as a
-Weather Mod
group of scripts - (I would love to see hurricanes, tornados, rain, thunderstorms, ice storms, dust storms, wind storms, Santa Ana like winds (spreads forest fires in dry areas) and other forms of interesting global and civilization affecting weather: (floods, fires, freezes, sinkholes, mudslides, earthquakes, etc.) disasters inspired like Sim City

I would try to recruit Kevinman4404 to the cause of working on C2C, his mod ambitions are very similiar, and both have a good bit of separate work done. Kevinman4404 could use some C2C ideas/scripting on the World History mod to complete his goals. He has made a good bit of progress on his own - just check out his thread - and he is struggling to complete parts and make time.

@anyone interested - It would be nice to get some other mod makers interested in contributions to C2C , even if it is minor and occaisional (as they have their own distractions), A few comments /ideas from someone like Afforess Zappara, or Glider (who have already contributed in part) would be awesome dream team material; (I understand if they are focused elsewhere, would love just a thought here or there)

I love C2C! Thank you everyone on the team! and everyone else who cares!

 

[Hydromancerx]

I like the idea of rock slides and sinkholes.

 

[rightfuture]

How about avalanches, hurrricanes (I was displaced by Katrina), droughts, flooding, windstorms, lightning, hail, meteorites, falling satellites, tsunami's, and shifting rivers.

 

[exacta]

How about avalanches, hurrricanes (I was displaced by Katrina), droughts, flooding, windstorms, lightning, hail, meteorites, falling satellites, tsunami's, and shifting rivers.

I remember in the Gods of Old mod that shipped with BTS certain disasters like tsunamis could be called upon by a prophet if you worshiped a certain god.. Maybe something similar could be added, but instead of the religious prophets you would need Weather Control?

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

There are already events that do many of these things. One big problem is that these things are all to short for even a single turn. Even the Martian invasion of Earth in the closing quarter of the 19th century would only be a fraction of a game turn. Which is why I am working on an such an event where you get to clan up afterwards but don't get to fight the war.

 

[rightfuture]

Wasn't it Fall from Heaven that had moving storms? Maybe a storm could be a moving unit, that could be countered by things like reinforced construction or building with concrete.
Storms could either be single events or ongoing issues, like a hurricane working it's way across a landscape.

Fire control buildings could work against raging fires that moved across landscape.

I think the Extra Mod by Chiyu integrated ALL of the plausible Civ 4 scenario material for all Civ IV expansions.
There are a lot of good ideas in that MOD.

 

[Koshling]

Wasn't it Fall from Heaven that had moving storms? Maybe a storm could be a moving unit, that could be countered by things like reinforced construction or building with concrete.
Storms could either be single events or ongoing issues, like a hurricane working it's way across a landscape.

Fire control buildings could work against raging fires that moved across landscape.

I think the Extra Mod by Chiyu integrated ALL of the plausible Civ 4 scenario material for all Civ IV expansions.
There are a lot of good ideas in that MOD.

C2c has moving storms. It's a game option

 

[rightfuture]

Could that system be expanded on?
Hurricanes could be just randomly bigger moving storms. Category 1-5 affect x tiles. Maybe that game option could be expanded upon for a line of thunderstorms or hurricane weather. I would love to see more rain moving across landscapes. Repeat storms/droughts could change climate, which had major immediate effects on civilizations.
Could code from a random map script like perfect world be used to string out a line of these storms, or a random spiral for a hurricane? Spawning tornados could come off of it. I love interesting moving weather that could spice up gameplay. Storms could stay as events too for flash events. Weather prediction could bring some modern/future era revelations that could impact civilizations. Especially for Hurricanes.
For a civilization in drought, a line of thunderstorms could be salvation. The right set of storms could also be devastating.
Windstorms like the Santa Ana Winds could blow forest fires to destroy cities. Fire is very useful in warfare also and can cut both ways with the whims of weather.
Maybe someone could worked on an Expanded Weather system, that combines events and moving storms to simulate weather effects on civilizations, units, and warfare??

 

[Koshling]

Could that system be expanded on?
Hurricanes could be just randomly bigger moving storms. Category 1-5 affect x tiles. Maybe that game option could be expanded upon for a line of thunderstorms or hurricane weather. I would love to see more rain moving across landscapes. Repeat storms/droughts could change climate, which had major immediate effects on civilizations.
Could code from a random map script like perfect world be used to string out a line of these storms, or a random spiral for a hurricane? Spawning tornados could come off of it. I love interesting moving weather that could spice up gameplay. Storms could stay as events too for flash events. Weather prediction could bring some modern/future era revelations that could impact civilizations. Especially for Hurricanes.
For a civilization in drought, a line of thunderstorms could be salvation. The right set of storms could also be devastating.
Windstorms like the Santa Ana Winds could blow forest fires to destroy cities. Fire is very useful in warfare also and can cut both ways with the whims of weather.
Maybe someone could worked on an Expanded Weather system, that combines events and moving storms to simulate weather effects on civilizations, units, and warfare??

Possibly, but I'm not sure the current storm implementation is where I'd start from. It represents storms as terrain types and uses a slight modification of the forest spreading code to cause the storm tiles to move around. This is problematic as a general approach since it cannot coexist with other terrains, so storms are confined to unadorned ocean tiles. However, it's hard to get the storm represented graphically any other way, so limtations in the underlying capabilities of the civ4 graphics engine make it hard to do properly.

 

[EldrinFal]

Possibly, but I'm not sure the current storm implementation is where I'd start from. It represents storms as terrain types and uses a slight modification of the forest spreading code to cause the storm tiles to move around. This is problematic as a general approach since it cannot coexist with other terrains, so storms are confined to unadorned ocean tiles. However, it's hard to get the storm represented graphically any other way, so limtations in the underlying capabilities of the civ4 graphics engine make it hard to do properly.

It's too bad it can't somehow be done as a Unit.

 

[Nevets_]

I was just thinking about that.

Storm Units that are non-hostile so they can move through spaces occupied by cities/units. They damage any unit that ends the turn in the same square, and have a chance of pillaging improvements. I don't use the terrain damage system but maybe they could affect that too. Storms that end their turn in peaks are destroyed, and hills have a moderate chance of destroying them, plains/deserts/etc. a very small chance.

Hurricanes spawn on tropical ocean squares that have a coast square east of them. They move west, with a chance of moving towards the closest pole. Every turn they end in an ocean square they have a chance of gaining the next hurricane promotion which increases the damage they do / chance they will pillage improvements and eventually makes them pillage improvements in adjacent squares too. Every turn they end on a land square they lose a promotion, hill square is 2 promotions, peak is 3. If they lose the last promotion the disappear. Once the storm passes into a high enough latitude it starts losing promotions every turn until it disappears.

Blizzards could spawn spawn on a temperate/sub-arctic square and move towards the poles, with a chance of moving east / west. The storm spawns with a random number of promotions: The first promotion turns adds a 'snow' feature to any land square they pass over, the second adds a chance to add the snow feature to any adjacent squares, the third increases the chance. The fourth promotion gives the storm a chance to pillage improvements, the fifth increase the chance. There is a random chance each turn the storm disappears.

Snow terrain features would give -2 -2 , and would increase movement cost by +1. A Weather tech would reduce it to -1 -1. There is a 50% chance Snow 'melts' and disappears each turn. If there was a way that snow could 'disable' a cart/mud/road/paved route (but not highway/railroad,etc.) but not pillage it that would be really cool, and workers could have a 'remove snow' action.

 

[rightfuture]

A line of thunderstorms could be a terrain free moving set of units that uses a linear mathematical formula like a map script for random generation that morphs aross the map like fractal weather formulas. Simply use a spiral version of that formula to spin out rain for a hurricane, you could theoretically use a smaller version of the random map script for creating spiral galaxies from final frontier or final frontier plus modpacks. The forumla could simply shrink or degrade over turns and evaporate. The math seems complicated but it is just a line forumla plus a random element to break it up a little.

I really really like the idea of more rain moving around the map. Weather is interesting and would mix up game play a little.
I started a thread and if anyone is interested we could discuss it more there.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=439763

 

[plasmacannon]

If, the Storm was built as a randomly generated Air unit, with a limited range (lets say 10) and a speed of 1.
It would move slowly for a 10 turns, then, dissapate.
Could increase the Speed to 2 after Astronomy.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Possibly, but I'm not sure the current storm implementation is where I'd start from. It represents storms as terrain types and uses a slight modification of the forest spreading code to cause the storm tiles to move around. This is problematic as a general approach since it cannot coexist with other terrains, so storms are confined to unadorned ocean tiles. However, it's hard to get the storm represented graphically any other way, so limtations in the underlying capabilities of the civ4 graphics engine make it hard to do properly.

Well Dune terrain has almost nothing on them so you could in theory add a sandstorm script to them and have it generate in only that terrain.

The same could be said for blizzards which could mostly move around on barren ice terrains.

 

[plasmacannon]

Well Dune terrain has almost nothing on them so you could in theory add a sandstorm script to them and have it generate in only that terrain.

The same could be said for blizzards which could mostly move around on barren ice terrains.

This is what I mentioned somewhere else in the forum to do with alligators. Have them spawn only on flood plains near a river and remain there. And Snakes spawn in jungles and marshes.
Or if, the current alligators/crocs could spawn on inland lakes. Having them dominate the oceans, especially, the arctic oceans, is odd.
Is there a way to limit the zone where they will appear?
I remember certain buildings couldn't built unless above 50 deg Latitude. Can the Crocs only be generated between 50N and 50S Latitudes?
Maybe, have Great White Sharks or Killer Whales only spawn in the coldest regions.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

This is what I mentioned somewhere else in the forum to do with alligators. Have them spawn only on flood plains near a river and remain there. And Snakes spawn in jungles and marshes.
Or if, the current alligators/crocs could spawn on inland lakes. Having them dominate the oceans, especially, the arctic oceans, is odd.
Is there a way to limit the zone where they will appear?
I remember certain buildings couldn't built unless above 50 deg Latitude. Can the Crocs only be generated between 50N and 50S Latitudes?
Maybe, have Great White Sharks or Killer Whales only spawn in the coldest regions.

I have a snake unit, but ts default stats means that you need a series of nukes to kill it!

There are no graphics for other sea critters like the shark and whales.

Currently there is no way to control where an animal goes beyond terrain type and no latitude value in its spawn XML (yet). The only current way to stop salt water crocodiles moving into unwanted areas would be to create a new terrain for polar coast. It could look like normal coast.

 

[EldrinFal]

I have a snake unit, but ts default stats means that you need a series of nukes to kill it!

Change that to a Godzilla unit and then you're talking! (Isn't there an active thread about some post-apocalyptic events?? )

 

[Praetyre]

You'd think nuking Godzilla would be a very, very bad idea, and not only because of the effect on the surrounding area...

 

[ThoricFrame]

I don't like the idea of blizzards etc lasting years (ie 1+ turns)... This isn't game of thrones.

 

[Nevets_]

I don't like the idea of blizzards etc lasting years (ie 1+ turns)... This isn't game of thrones.

Are you also disturbed that it takes 20 years to move a unit 1 square, or 100 years to build a mud hut? There are tons of abstractions in the game. If the blizzard/storm/whatever only lasted 1 turn, it's no different from the random events we have now, just occasional disasters that give you no advanced warning and have not lasting effects after you repair the damage.