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Civ 4, a failure made successful by money and absence of community

xguild

Chieftain
Joined
Sep 27, 2005
Messages
82
The bottom line is that right now there is a whole slew of people unable to play at all or playing this game on a diminished level. These are people who paid for this software, they are customers, in every sense of the word they deserve a little respect and support from Firaxis and their fellow gamers who aren't having problems.

In my humble opinion at the very least their should be an acknowledgment of the problems not to mention potentially an apology for their customers from Firaxis. Instead what we got was more or less a complete denial from the head of marketing who said, and I quote, "Designing a PC game to run perfectly on all of the different hardware/software configurations available today is extremely challenging...particularly for a game as big and complex as Civilization IV. We do a tremendous amount of testing before we release a game, and try to test on every conceivable configuration (including laptops). For the most part, Civ IV is running well for most folks...and any issues that have come up since the release have been addressed and fixed by our team. It's difficult to reach perfection...but we'll never stop trying!"

I don't know about you guys, but as far as I know non of the issues that have come up have been fixed!! People found "work arounds" for a small number of the things involving relativly complex set of instructions that the average non-computer litterate person probobly couldn't follow. These however didn't come from Firaxis, they came from the fan base and they were resolutions for 2-3 issues that were resolved on the 2nd or 3rd day of release. Then they were posted on the main website as the sole thing anyone needed to do to fix the issues with this game. The rest of the problems haven't been addressed at all and we have no way of knowing if they will be addressed in the patch since there has been absolutly no official word whatsover about the patch.

What we have right now is a bunch of anxious fans, hoping... praying that whatever there technical issue is it will be addressed in the patch. It's a game of chance for most of us and we seem to have absolutly no power to ask for anything since the game is getting overwhelmingly great reviews and a large chunk of the fan base is going on record excusing these issues claiming that "This is an acceptable level of bugs". Perhaps that's true, but as fans of the game and as fellow gamers, i think their has to be a better sense of comradery because although many people are not experiancing problems with this game, they may do so with the next one that comes out. I think people would appriciate a level of support from their fellow gamers, rather then the response most of us have gotten which is for the most part "Shut the F up, no one gives a crap about your problems, oh and by the way ... hahahah ... My game works "perfect".

I think most gamers don't see the clear line that they have created for game developers with their complete absence of loyalty to the gaming community. By excusing developers failures and not sticking with their fellow gamers, we are creating an industry of excuses. It's true that many of you out there aren't having any problems and the game runs great for you, but by excusing the obvious issues with the game that other people are experiancing your opening the door to poor quality in future games.

It's sad, but we can all look forward to an industry that's going to continue to decline in quality. Not so long ago games that were released with issues were shunned by the gaming community with a single breath and the bad media would litterly put companies out of business. The result was a fear by developers and publishers to release bad product, knowing that the cost of doing so would be severe. Today, there is absolutly no fear, they can put out buggy untested games and we swallow the bull**** and call it ice cream, this not just coming from the many online magazines but from the actual gaming community.

What's worse is that game reviews these days are litterly for sale. After all if you have a website like gamespot.com and you have a HUGE Civilization 4 add on the front banner of your website which you are collecting top marketing dollar for, how could you possibly give the game anything but a steller review.

I'm disgusted with what's going on with this industry, not just because of the complete absence of quality, but because there is absolutly no gamer community anymore, just a bunch of loan wolves that do and say whatever they want with abosulty no thought whatsover. In fact we can expect more of the same in the future.
 
Oh look - no real rebuttals from fan-whores - what a surprise!

Totally agree with you Xguild. All it takes is a few minutes for these guys to tell us what is happening. These fan whores are that gullible and under the thumb that they will simply let themselves be totally walked over for the sake of loyalty. But loyalty to what? It can't be due to your personal relationships on the forum with the Firaxis guys because - guess what - they don't speak to us! So basically you fan whores defend Big Business for nothing!
 
My collection edition copy works fine. My only complain is that my video card only has 64 Mb so the graphics are no so good. (but who plays civ for the graphics?) I just bought a ATI X800 All in wonder (256 MB) so i would be able to play with crispy graphics, though :D

I haven't read the first post. only the fourth one which says that the first post is rant. :lol:

It must be very fustrating to be a civ addict and not been able to play CIv IV because your system doesn't meet the specs or you are not spart enough to keep your system in good shape :lol:
Moderator Action: Trolling - warned. That's to go with your warning for the same thing yesterday.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

If you are not a civ addict, you always can store the game with the other bought but never played games or sell it on Ebay.
 
Urederra said:
It must be very fustrating to be a civ addict and not been able to play CIv IV because your system doesn't meet the specs or you are not spart enough to keep your system in good shape :lol:
Arrogant fanwhorism. 'Not smart enough'? Try not having the money to maintain what is basically a luxury item - computers. Some of us have wifes to pay for; children; cars; mortgages; further education.

Just because your copy works fine, doesn't mean that Firaxis arrogance [which has rubbed off onto its fan-whores] is acceptable. We deserve an update from Firaxis not because it is the right thing to do, but because they have sold me and thousands of other consumers a faulty product for which I demand a fix or a refund.
Moderator Action: Trolling as well - make your posts constructuive, or don't bother posting.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889
 
Ubiquitous said:
Oh look - no real rebuttals from fan-whores - what a surprise!

I am NOT a whore! I'm on the paying end of this arrangement.

John - yes.
Whore - certainly not.
 
Ubiquitous said:
Arrogant fanwhorism. 'Not smart enough'? Try not having the money to maintain what is basically a luxury item - computers. Some of us have wifes to pay for; children; cars; mortgages; further education.

Just because your copy works fine, doesn't mean that Firaxis arrogance [which has rubbed off onto its fan-whores] is acceptable. We deserve an update from Firaxis not because it is the right thing to do, but because they have sold me and thousands of other consumers a faulty product for which I demand a fix or a refund.

Moderator Action: Comments removed
 
The game has serious problems which have to be fixed, but these are technical, not game-wise, problem, and Civ4 it's in no way a "failure".

It's more a whiner issue than a fanboy issue here.Moderator Action: <= For reference - that's the kind of comment that seems to be causing flame wars.
 
Ubiquitous said:
Arrogant fanwhorism. 'Not smart enough'? Try not having the money to maintain what is basically a luxury item - computers. Some of us have wifes to pay for; children; cars; mortgages; further education.

Surely... wifes and children are also luxury items?

Oh yes, they are!
 
@Ubiquitous. How much Microsoft pays you to come here and insult us? Moderator Action: You don't get right-of-reply.

Final warning.

Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

Sorry, but Civ IV is number one in sales, Age of empires is number two, And no matter how much are you getting paid by Microsoft to insult us in this forum, it is not gonna change that fact.
 
francois9 said:
Surely... wifes and children are also luxury items?

Oh yes, they are!

Imagine that, blaming his wife and kids for his inability to plays civ4. How selfish. :blush:
 
Ubiquitous said:
Arrogant fanwhorism. 'Not smart enough'? Try not having the money to maintain what is basically a luxury item - computers. Some of us have wifes to pay for; children; cars; mortgages; further education.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Blaming Firaxis for your failure in life to buy yourself a proper machine to play Civ 4? And you want to raise children? :lol:Moderator Action: Trolling - warned.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889
 
This is appaling.

The man writes a well written post about how the game has some flaws in it that he would like to see fixed. A game that he has payed money for. Money that was earned by doing some sort of work. He has a right to demand a fix for a game he has payed good money for.

This game is running just fine for me, but I will never tell people who are having problems that they are not allowed to complain. Ubiquitous is right. Seriously ask yourself why you are defending a company you have no real connection with so passionately. To say someone is too stupid, or doesn't have enough money to upgrade to the latest hardware, and then say thats the reason the game doesnt work is the most irresponsible thing you could do. There used to be a time when mininum requirements would run the game as it should be run. At no point on the box does it say, if you play with minimum requirements you will not be able to run this game properly.

Telling him that he should go do something else with his life if he doesnt like the game is about the most assanine thing you could tell him. He PAYED for the game. Throwing 60 bucks down on a game, having it not work, and then saying "Oh well! That doesn't work, won't play that". That sounds like a good idea to you, you wouldnt be immensly pissed that you just threw away 60 bucks?

Christ just give him some respect, he's not being lame about it.
 
Ubiquitous said:
Oh look - no real rebuttals from fan-whores - what a surprise! [...] These fan whores [...]

I will not say if I agree or not with "xguild", but I respect the time & trouble he took to write such a lengthy and well composed post, launching a new thread & a new debate.

On the other hand, "Ubiquitous", your use of the insult "fan-whores" is an obvious provocation that might attract childish "flames". You do not do fair justice to "xguild" 's noble effort.
 
So far there have been half a dozen posts and not a single constructive post. This makes my point even further, not only do we blindly support the industry despites it's many failures, but we don't even read each others posts anymore. What a weak community this really is and how sad is the shape of the PC gaming industry today.

EDIT: Perhaps I spoke to soon!!.... Is there any life in this community left?
 
Why should I call game failure because of compatibility problem.

The fact is that such problems occur only for minority of players (however it is big or vocal), and that they are usually fixed with first patches, if not even with just driver updates. They don't affect other players.

Why would I call game failure especially if it works good for me?
And is addictive?
 
You people need to get over yourselves. That is, on both sides. yes, I said BOTH.

For the people going 'Ow... just another rant/whine'; If you have nothing to say that is worth listening to, don't say anything.

As for the people complaining about the game; Sure, it sucks that the game has issues like these. But **** happens. If you feel that you have been cheated out of your money, that's your perogative. But don't post it on fan-forums. Send it to the appropriate people. I can understand certain people around here gettign annoyed by posts like this. They have absolutely NO relevance when it comes to the game itself. Period.

On top of that, me with my mediocre systems which aren't even set up as a gaming rig (AMD Athlon 3000+, ATi Radeon 9550, 512 MD DDR RAM & laptop with even lower specs), run this game just fine. Only huge maps are unplayable in late eras. If it were truly a bug, I would have the same issues as you and i shouldn't be able to play at all without having major problems. And there are plenty of people who can also play the game just fine.

So, the conclusion must be that the game is either incompatible (at the moment) with certain hardware specs and because of that make certain aspects of the program buggy (as such, the problem is NOT primarily a bug in the game) or your computer software configuration is wonky (which isn't nessecarily your fault as this kind of thing is very sensitive and has numerous aspects that could cause the problem). The first can only be partially be fixed by the developer, and the second one is out of their hands entirely.

I'm sorry, but i just can't take anyone seriously if they claim this game is a failure when i'm enjoying it thouroughly, and many others are as well. just because YOU have problems, doesn't make the game a bad game. That's pretty much the worst line of reasoning you can come up with concerning this topic.

I acknowledge that the game isn't flawless. but what did you expect? A perfect game on the first frickin' release? It's not like the game has already been out for years or something. Ofcourse developers will claim the game works perfectly. Every sane company does that. No game is perfect, but every single released piece of programming is advertised as the next generation of gaming standards. You should try a bit of common sense here.

To anyone who is still complaining about CivIV; Go away and make your own damn game if you think you know everything so damned well. No offense, but this isn't related to the game. Send an email to the devopers instead or something. Don't post this on a forum like this if you feel cheated out of your money (which is basically your main point). Ask for a refund for all i care. You're probably even in your right to ask for a refund, since the product is unplayable for YOU. but once again, don't generalize this to reflect the entire game.

And don't get me wrong, I know it's frustrating since I've also been on the receiving end of the Stick o' Hurt when it comes to games not working properly. So don't say 'Your game works fine, so you have no right to speak'. i know where you're coming from. Nevertheless, i find your entire argument wholly unfounded at the moment.

-------

I think this can be considered a decent rebuttal without resorting to the general namecalling and stuff :p
 
I agree with some of what you said, but I think you have some unrealistic expectations.

xguild said:
The bottom line is that right now there is a whole slew of people unable to play at all or playing this game on a diminished level.

I'm not sure how many people a "whole slew" is, but there are some for sure.

xguild said:
In my humble opinion at the very least their should be an acknowledgment of the problems not to mention potentially an apology for their customers from Firaxis.

I would consider any patches (one will be released shortly...acording to Fraxis) to be an acknowledgment that a mistake was made...and even better then an apology. And I agree with the quote you included from Fraxis.

xguild said:
I don't know about you guys, but as far as I know non of the issues that have come up have been fixed!!

Uh, how long has the game been out?!? Chances are they *have* fixed these issues and will be including them in the first patch that comes out...but give them a chance to do that before saying that they aren't doing their job.

xguild said:
we have no way of knowing if they will be addressed in the patch since there has been absolutly no official word whatsover about the patch.

Again...how log has the game been out?

xguild said:
a large chunk of the fan base is going on record excusing these issues claiming that "This is an acceptable level of bugs".

I agree with you here...this is unfortunate. However, as unfortunate as it is it is also common business practice. Achieving perfection is not cost effective, so one needs to achive as close to perfection as the market will allow and still buy the product. If you want to change this you are wanting to change how most businesses operate. (I would love to see it happen, I just don't think it's realistic.)

xguild said:
I think people would appriciate a level of support from their fellow gamers, rather then the response most of us have gotten which is for the most part "Shut the F up, no one gives a crap about your problems, oh and by the way ... hahahah ... My game works "perfect".

Ouch. I am sorry that someone upset you this badly, but I can assure you that it does not reflect all of us. I may disagree with you but I still think your opinion is yours to have.

xguild said:
It's true that many of you out there aren't having any problems and the game runs great for you

Didn't you start by saying that there was a "slew" of people not playing due to technical difficulties...or something like that?

xguild said:
It's sad, but we can all look forward to an industry that's going to continue to decline in quality.

It is sad, but...

xguild said:
Not so long ago games that were released with issues were shunned by the gaming community with a single breath and the bad media would litterly put companies out of business.

...I'm not sure I like this as the alternative.

xguild said:
What's worse is that game reviews these days are litterly for sale.

If that's true it is very unfortunate. I guess we are back to "buyer beware". Thank heavens for the internet and the ability to read several reviews from different perspectives all with little effort. Which is exactly what I did with Civ IV and I only found glowing reviews. Currently, I still agree with most of these (although I wouldn't give the game a 10/10 like one review did).

So, I think I agree with, maybe, 20% of what you say. But that's just my opinion. What is also my opinion is that the game is great, despite some of the problems I have been having with it. I have now heard that Fraxis is releasing a patch very soon (increadably quick response when compared to other gaming companies) and I am sure that most, if not all, of my current problems will be resolved with it. And if there are some that aren't? Well, Rome wasn't built in a day.
 
Urederra said:
@Ubiquitous. How much Microsoft pays you to come here and insult us?

Sorry, but Civ IV is number one in sales, Age of empires is number two, And no matter how much are you getting paid by Microsoft to insult us in this forum, it is not gonna change that fact.
This is the kind of thing that really annoys people like myself - you are so deluded that you actually think I give a rats arse about 'Age of Empires III'?! I have owned every civ that there has ever been - it is one of two computer games I have purchased in the past year - all I ask is that the game WORKS. I did my job - I own a computer that meets the rec. specs. Now Firaxis should do their job [properly this time] and ensure that the game works with those specs.

All I want is my game to work properly, as advertised.

And I will no longer use fan[atical]-whore to describe people as you are correct it is somewhat petty [they just wind me up so much...] fan[atical]-boy I assume is more acceptable? Moderator Action: No, its not.
 
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