Civ2 in Civ3

[vmxa]

Here is where I am as I break for supper.

IBT:
AC attacks Crusader and retreats.

870AD:
Bach is in, drop lux to zero. Up research to 80% and save 2 turns.
knight kills the AC and goes elite.
Start cath in Athens for MA.

890AD:
5/5 knight kills Sami, goes red and cover with 2nd.
Still bumping Hannibal and waiting for Peace deal to end.

910AD:
Found Apoll
Crusader kills MDI
Crusader kills 2/3 pike
Knight kills 2/3 pike

920AD:
Crusader kills 2/3 pike
knight kills lb
knight goes red, before doing any damage, but kills AC.
5/5 LB kills yellow Sami.

930AD:
Cavs next turns and will switch the cath to MA then.
Found Apolyton in tundra as I really packed them now.
crusader kills yellow Sami.
The bad thing about all this peace is that Cleo is building troops and Hannibal is now able to send 17 units heading for Japan. I had them trimmed down, before the peace.

940AD:
MT in and had to scratch head as yet another SGL shows up. I have not managed a an MGL in some time.
I dial up the Xerxes and made a deal of Metal for PP and some gold.
I then call on the Ottoman and trade PP and Chem for Nav.
I do not want the peace, but I had to use the SGL on some thing. I rush Magel's.

Ping a Babylon galley till is red.
I more or less give Joan PP for 18 gold and world map.
Upgrade 17 knights. I left one as an elite for now.

950AD:
Well I am bored with not enough action so I attack ole Hannibal.
LB and MDI kill a LB
3 cavs kills Nums and then one retreats.
cav kills one and then crusaders dies doing no damage.
3rd kills it and a lb.
5/5 mdi kills lb
1st kills 2 lb
cav kills lb

960AD:
6 lb still left after last turn and they do not cut road, but head inland.
5 cavs kill LB
cav kills red Num and goes elite.
3/5 mdi kills lb and finally an MGL. Form 4th with cavs.
Bad news for the bears.

970AD:
4th kills 3 Nums and captures Hippo for 3 slaves. I am sure we got some gold, but I missed the amount.
I wanted to raze it for slaves, but it is on the coast with a Bab galley near. I was concerned units could land and I would miss them.
crusader retreats Sami and is covered by 2nd.

980AD:
Lost Dyes and Horses and I would not be shocked if our gal gets mean soon.
5/5 cav kills LB
3rd kills Num in Utica
2nd kills one as well.
2nd kils Sami
cav kills one and goes red.

990AD:
Cannot make cavs now.
1st kills Num in Utica
5/5 cav kills one and captures it. Did have 1 slave and a treb, not sure about gold.
found Therm1

4th grabs Cadiz. it is now size one, so I keep it.
2nd 12/18 kills red Sami and is now 10HP. Should be fine not much around it.

1000AD:
I failed to mention that Utica has the Great Wall.
I send a few units to disband for culture pop to get the horses in the fold. Will short rush it.
5/5 knight kills 2/3 pike
4th kills Num in Leptis Minor

1010AD:
4th kills 2 nums and razes Leptis for 2 slaves.
5/5 cav kills LB
Three cavs kill a LB, AC and Sami.

1020AD:
Start ToG
I start Pre in Buce. I had stopped some builds as I do not want more muskets.
Whoops got wires crossed. I thought there were three Japan units next to Myce. I used a crusader to kill 1hp Sami. I had to cover with army as it was the only unit there and another Sami could attack it.

2nd kills Num in Threv.., then 1st kills one. Then 1st kill another and razes it for 4 slaves.


Hannibal is not talking right now.

1030AD:
5/5 knight kills 1hp Sami
cav goes red killing pike

Found Cortinth

1040AD:
Corinth gets the horses in the borders, so start cavs.

Found Pha

As I look around I found only a musket being built and I switch it. Will look for the best 3 towns other than Athens and Buce.

I found 3 and Sparta is actually the top shield city.

Cav kills AC and 5/5 knight kills 1hp Sami
5/5 LB kills LB and covered by 2nd.
4th and 3rd next to some city.

1050AD:
The price for not having enough settlers as the Ottoman drop a knight/settler in the near the last razed town.

4th kills 2 Nums and captures Oea and 2 trebs and 2 slaves.
cav kills 1hp Sami
Hannibal landed a LB in the tundra, but I had the knights upgraded and ready, scratch one more.

1060AD:
I decide to peddle Physics as it cannot be long till it is learned by others. I sell to Xerxes for Demo, 260 gold and 12gpt.

Not to leave Cleo out I get Econ, 70 gold, 7gpt.

found Myce1.

Upgrade a few trebs with the extra cash.

3rd kills 2 Nums in Gades and captures it and 3 gold.

BTW I should have mentioned that I see why Ottoman never really came for us. Most of their land is on an island/continent. It is only a tile or two from our land mass.

MA done next turn.

It is strange to have almost as many (3) SGL's as MGL's in a game that is basically a war game. Have been at war the whole time with at least 2 nations and up to 5 at one point.

 

[vmxa]

Here is the save:

I just played a few more turns, not much going on now.

1070AD:
Start an army provisionally.
4th kills 2 Nums and captures Malaca.
It had 1 treb.

1080AD:
4th grabs lol and we gain dye. Will see about peace now as no more Carthage near us on this land. Kills 2 Nums.
Made peace for Citra and abandon it.

1090AD:
Note that I did a chop in Athens, so no switch to a wonder on this build.
You could switch to a cav to clear it, if needed.

1100AD:
5/5 archer kills 1hp pike
start Mag.

Save:

 

[TheOverseer714]

Sure, welcome aboard ThinkTank. Busted rep and all...I guess that means we will be doing Conquest for sure. You can pick up where vmxa leaves off.

 

[vmxa]

I hated to break the peace deal, but normally I allow 2 rounds of get out. This was not my game, so I went to 11 rounds. At that point it was either wait 9 more turns or until they amassed enough units to make us some pain.

In addition, we needed to get moving, not to mention the horses. We are pretty much at the point where we need to stay at war, so we can clear the land.

You may want to start a build for a frigate in Myce. If it needs a harbor, do that first. Three frigates should be enough to combine with bombardment to keep them in check. I am not concerned about landings, but their bombardment via frigates. It can be annoying.

You need to decide, if you want to go for clearing the rest of the land past Utica or not. I was going to send the cav army back around to the Japan front, once the replacement army arrived.

Hopefully we will get Steam as the free tech, but we are very short on labor. I have been trying to get roads on the tiles. I was chopping trees in Athens in prep for rails. That would allow use of the mountain.

We have money for a few things as I was not running a deficit. Once rails are up we can dump some of those Hops and maybe a few MDI as many towns are size one and do not need MP's. The units there are just for landings. That will free up a few cavs for offense as well.

I made no banks and that is also one of the reasons why I did not start Smith's. My .02 on techs is to race for RP. I love all the things it brings. Faster workers, needed, artillery, infantry. The problem is the ToE.

This can be dealt with via a good prebuild. We do not have to be first to SciMeth. If we are doing damage Cleo and growing we should close on the tech side. The AI will probably go for those optional techs and not get to ToE first.

 

[TheOverseer714]

We should be able to get ToE and still get RP first. If we get Steam free, that would clinch that. It beggars the question, if we don't get Steam, do we gift up and trade or self-research and never trade anything? With a busted rep, I favor the latter. Another question, factories, should we build them at all, limit them to our top 5-10 cities, or build them in 50% or less corrupt cities?

 

[vmxa]

It seems I get Nationalism more often than any, because it is one I do not want. I am not sure I remember it correctly, but I think only Cleo and Persia are doing well at research and they will not need any gifting. They are neck and neck with us on tech.

The others are pretty much stiffs, France is far back and so is Babylon. Japan is not doing all that much better. I cannot remember Ottoman, probably better than Japan. So I would just trade as you get a deal worth doing.

I suspect you know how I tend to do it. A few of the best places get a factory as best as I can squeeze them in. I doubt we will need more than 5 or 6. I will be hard to support more units than that anyway. By the time we can get the support, we will have few enemies.

Wonder if Think Tank is still up for a run?

I am seldom in a hurry to get rivals into the next age, especially IA. We can maybe gain one tech and then Cleo and Xerxes will join the age. The Persians will get a free tech, so we may be able to trade them, depends on what we get.

I would be willing to trade Nat for something, especially Medicine. I am not so keen on trading Medicine. Steam, I could see as a trade overseas will not hurt. They will have Steam before we come anyhow.

How are you doing on all your SG's? If Rod02 does not come up tomorrow and neither you or Think grab it by then, should I take another round? All this talk about techs got me excited to see what we get.

 

[ThinkTank]

Wonder if Think Tank is still up for a run?

Cannot play before Sunday so any of you take another round.

 

[vmxa]

Well in that case I will play out till we get to the next age. I will then check to see if Overseer has posted about his availability.

We still have a deal with Cleo for 16 turns, we get 7gpt. The deal with the Ottoman is only 4
more turns, so I think I would clear them out at that point and go on the rest of the land at
that end. It would be nice if Cleo jumps us during that time as they have a town or two on that
end.

Actually, I will wait till the next age, which is a few turns after the Ottoman deal ends. Then if we do get Steam, we can get some units free.

 

[vmxa]

Here is the save:

 

[vmxa]

1110AD:
Found Herakleia
5/5 knight kills AC
cav kills 2/4 Sami
Up research to 100.

1120AD:
Cleo declares on Japan, so they turn around.
I disband a unit to speed up harbor in Myce.
3/5 knight kills 1hp pike, last unit in sight.

1150AD:
Carthage keeps moving a LB into our land.
Disband LB for Harbor in Myce. We got another crusader, so no loss in power.
Mag on the IBT.
Xerxes start Shakes.

1160AD:
Good news and bad news.
We get Steam, but have no coal. A second decent piece of news is that coal is near in the Ottoman empire.

I DOW and capture Riza killing a knight with a 5/5 cav. A cav retreated from pike, and another cav kills it. (I see while posting this that I left out where this was, not Riza)

Found Ephesus

4th heads for Bolu where th coal is located. They do not have any roads, so I send all sorts of workers on a long trek to the site to road to the town and then the coal.

1170AD:
4th kills two spears and gets Bolu. I see 3 Egyptian units near it. Do not know what they were planning. Maybe heading for Japan via land.

I spend 84 gold to rush a settler from Malaca.

1180AD:
I asked Cleo to leave and she declares. I have seen cavs, so it could get to be tense.
4th kills the 3 units next to Bolu that she had.

1190AD:
WLTKD breaks out.
Cleo sends a cav to our area.

Found Thess1

4th kills Cleo's LB and Ottoman spear.
First workers arrive in the jungle.

1200AD:
Denzli is attacked and 4th kills 3 spears.

I have been upgrading a few cannons from time to time. I expect that we will want arty on those coastal towns soon as Cleo will be sending frigates.

First of Cleo's cavs comes into our borders and I red line it and the 5/5 knight kills it cleanly. Several more are set to arrive next turn.

IBT:
cav attacks Myce and retreats.

1210AD:
5/5 knight repeats last battle, but take a hit.

4th kills LB and captures Denz

3 cavs kill units (2 cavs and a knight).

IBT:
I fell asleep and left 2 MDI fortified on a hill for a long time and a cav attacked them. Killing one. I should have moved them as now they can be reached.

1220AD:
4/5 knight kills another cav.
cav kills 2/4 cav
cav kills 1/4 cav

IBT:
Rats a frigate pings an elite cav, so it starts.
Cav retreats from Myce musket. Sooner or later they will kill some musket.

1230AD:
4/5 knight kills again and my dismal MGL results continues.

Note we currently have only 5 cities with 10 or more shields. Those are not net either.

Found Hali1

4/5 cav kill Otto LB.
Two cavs kill 1hp knights.

I peddle ToG to Xerxes to see what he gets for a free one and it is Steam, no help. IIRC he gave around 280 gold and 17gpt.

IBT:
Cav retreats.

1240AD:
4/5 knight kills knight.

Found Miletos.

2nd kills retreating cav.

IBT:
cav dies at Myce, about time.

1255AD:
5/5 knight kills knight and cav kills one.
4th kills spear in Bing..

IBT:
It happened, cav kills musket, need those infantry. Remember Myce is a city on a hill and the cav was pinged.

1260AD:
We are the proud owners of Newtons and stared Smith for ToE. We also get an army out of Athens and start another. It could also be for ToE.

5/5 knight kills that cav.
3rd kills Otto LB
4th kills spear and captures Bingol.

Found Artem

Sacrifice a crusader on a cav on a hill, but the fool actually won.
cav kills cleanly a 2/4 cav.
cavs kill 3 Otto units at Oea (knight,?, sword).

IBT:
2 cavs attack Myce, which uses Crusaders now. Crusaders retreat the first and kill the second. I see that both cavs were regulars. No one has been promoted during all of the defensive battles there so far.

1265AD:
Well now, knight finally makes a leader and we form the 6th. The 5th now has cavs.

Japan lands a Sami, but it is next to Bingol, we have the 4th there, sorry Japan.

5th is filled and kills 2 cavs.

We now have coal and start some rails with the pathetic crew available.
4th kills Sami.

I traded Physics to Joan for Free Art, map and 6 gold. Just in case we have an option to build Shakes. Also to not let her fall too far behind the others.
5/5 archer kills 1hp spear.

2 Ottoman units landed at Bingol, but I leave them and will see if they attack the army. Next turn the 3rd arrives and will free the 4th to move on. It can deal with them, if they are still around.

IBT:
Yuk Ottoman do not attack, but they do land 7 more units. At least the 4th will be healed.

1275AD:
Start RP at 100%, due in 11 turns.

5/5 cav kills a sword.
3rd kills a LB and now there are 3 knights, 3 MDI and a pike at Bingol.

The knight2 kills knight and goes elite. Maybe it can make a second leader?
5th kills musket in Bus... 6th arrives there as well, so we take the fight to them finally.

I leave it to the next player how to deal with Bingol.

The situation:
3rd has one move and could either attack the stack or enter Bingol to defend or stay put. Stay put to encourage them to go around and be stuck on a hill, thus leaving the elite cav alone.

If it stays, it will not be attacked as it is full health. If it attacks and takes little damage, it will still be safe.

The big question is can the 4th hold the town, if 3 knights and 3 mdi attack it? What about 2 knights and 3 mdi, if you use the 3rd?

I was planning on moving the 3rd into town and using the 4th to try and kill all three knights. This allows the elite knight to be safe from the one move units. If the 4th can do even better, by killing 4 units, then the rest can be gotten next turn.

After writing it down, I went ahead and took the actions.

4th kills knight, pike, knight, and knight. So 3 mdi left and they can attack the town, but we are solid there.

They can move towards nearby empty town, most likely. The elite can then kill one and go back to the empty town and 3rd can clean the rest, while 4th heals.

There is a lone Carthage LB in our lands. I have been running him off every few turns. We have a few rails up.

The team that made the road to the coal is working its way to the core. A 3 man team is trying to rail to the other crew near Gort. One more crew working at Oea that can join the coal crew.

Eventually all will be in unison. RP will help a lot there. You may want to rush out a few workers for cash and a settler or two as we have enough to handle the deficit for RP.

 

[vmxa]

I slapped in three more turns and will post two screen shots. The save:

 

[vmxa]

Here is the North West, where we grabbed the first Egyptian town. The East where we nearly have the land cleared.

 

[vmxa]

IBT:
All three Ottoman MDI's attack and die.
I see they land a scary stack of 3/3 MDI and 3/3 warrior next to Denizli. I am very scared of the warrior, hope the elite cav can handle him.

1280AD:
5/5 cav kills the mdi and enters Denizli.
5/5 lb kill 1hp cav.

Got a rail to lol, Malaca, Artem, Oea and partial for Thess1. These are towns that have a lone unit and landings have been pulled off there.

I wanted to mention and maybe I did that a small bunch is putting down a road to Denizli and then Bingol.

Action has been heavy there so far and we have few units to spare.

Disease hit Bolu and it is size 1 so it will not get the second round.

I rushed the frigate for 60 gold as I want to kill some of these damaged galleys from Babylon.

I take liberties with the 3/5 archer and it kills 1hp pike. I figured it was no real loss and may as well take a shot at a leader.

Just in case I was confusing on the pre, the current army build will not be for that. It will be done long before we learn SciMeth. It is the one after, that could be used. We will need to keep a close on Sistine as it could finish too soon as well. I have not check on the shield count for our palace. It may be large enough.

I am expecting a lower price for Medicine to shave turn or two off as well as maybe a few more specialist from rails and water. I do not expect to boost shields in that town for a time, but could in Athens. We just do not have enough workers.

Well now the special unit called Knight2, just kill a pike and made its second leader. Now named Knight2_cav3.

Form 7th.

5th kills a pike and a spear in Busiris and we captured it. It has two slaves, again I did not notice the gold, if any. This could be a mistake as we will be reachable here. I have two cav armies in it now and will get a third soon.

IBT:
Nice enough. warrior, red lines the cav. I told you I was afraid of him.
Cav dies on crusader in Myce. Both units went red and hung on to win.
No one attacked the town of Busiris. Surprised a little.

1285AD:
7th kills pike with 2 units and I add a third cav.
Frigate sinks 2hp galley.
7th kills one cav and I put in back in town for now.
6th kills two Japan LB.

I did not list the rails from the other group last turn, but all rail stacks have linked. That is the west groups are together and the East groups are together. West working towards the cap or the front, not sure now.

The East towards the West stack.

So now we have Gort, Leptis, Apoll and Carthage linked by rails and a bit more. The East now has tied Thess1 and a hill past Oea. It is cutting down the trees on that tile to rail that tile. That will rush a worker as well.

3rd kills Cleo's LB at Bingol.
4th stomps next to Avar...

IBT:
Babylon lands some unit next to Busiris.
Smith is finished and then cascade to Shakes and it is done. Egypt I think.

1290AD:
Switch to Palace and it can hold all the shields we need.
4th kills two spears and a LB in Avaris and we capture it and three trebs.

Need roads to it.

A cav rides onto the hill next to Therm and I ping it twice. Crusader kills it and goes elite.
7th gets its 4 unit.
Cover some workers as the Carthage LB is next to them. I doubt it will do anything, but we cannot afford to lose workers.

Chop finishes worker and we rail up Halil and Riza.

I sent an extra worker back to the rails to join in. We gained a worker from Denizli.

A settler is coming out of Therm soon. I was looking at either the banana or the tile SE on the coast.

5th kills three Babylon units at Busiris. Not sure if any of the units there will cut roads or move on or attack. I killed the pike as he is the most likely to cut a road. 6th did not move and could be used or let heal. I tend to let one army heal, so if the town is attacked, it will heal anyway, even if it fights.

 

[TheOverseer714]

Since it's late evening here, I doubt I can get much of a set in here, so ThinkTank can grab the save and play if he can, then I'll take it from there.

 

[vmxa]

That makes sense. We have 4 cav armies finally and rails started, so it should pick up speed soon.

 

[ThinkTank]

Got it. Will first have a look at the save and see if I have any questions on strategy.

 

[ThinkTank]

Win by space or conquest - right now we're going for conquest, correct?

Any reason we have not sent an army pillaging the Egyption strategic resources?

We have RP in 8. After that, beeline Scientific Method for ToE and take AT and Electronics as freebies? And try to trade for industrialization?

We're at war with Egypt (won't talk) and Japan, Ottomans and Babylon (these 3 will talk). I don't see any strong
reason right now for being at war with Babylon, and after our NE pensinsula is cleared, the Ottoman war can be paused too I feel.
We can then focus on clearing our continent first before we go on oversees war. Agreed?

There are quite a few towns doing 6 to 8 shields that are on wealth, why?

Our Eastern empire looks for a good place to start some serious science/tax farms, shall I start that operation?

 

[vmxa]

ThinkTank
"Win by space or conquest - right now we're going for conquest, correct?"

correct

"Any reason we have not sent an army pillaging the Egyption strategic resources?"

Two reasons 1) did not have the amries until recently 2) I would rather kill units and towns. They can have their resources as they will be our resources soon.

IOW I only pillage in real hard games and then only resources that can hurt me, such a Al or Ur, maybe rubber.

"We have RP in 8. After that, beeline Scientific Method for ToE and take AT and Electronics as freebies? And try to trade for industrialization?"

Yup that is the path. Trade as you see fit.

"We're at war with Egypt (won't talk) and Japan, Ottomans and Babylon (these 3 will talk). I don't see any strong
reason right now for being at war with Babylon, and after our NE pensinsula is cleared, the Ottoman war can be paused too I feel."

Either way you like to deal with it is fine. The main reason I did not make peace is we get happiness form Babylon. The secondary reason to maintain all the wars is that keeps them grinding out units and sending them over. A small slow down in their progress and a tiny shot at leaders.

"We can then focus on clearing our continent first before we go on oversees war. Agreed?"

We do not have much choice in that as we do not have transports or enough units to deal with invading right now.

"There are quite a few towns doing 6 to 8 shields that are on wealth, why?"

We could not afford to make more troops and did not really need them, except to speed up the end.

"Our Eastern empire looks for a good place to start some serious science/tax farms, shall I start that operation?"

As soon as you can fit it in. Right now we are short on workers, so it will be hard to do. My priority would be 1) rails from one end to the other 2) rails on Athens and or Buce 3) rails to coastal towns 4) farms. Three and four can be swapped.

 

[ThinkTank]

Looks like we agree. I will already start founding the farm towns as that will be good for unit support anyway.

 

[vmxa]

BTW we are probably at the point were we can afford to add a couple of those 8 shield towns to the unit production. It may soon be hard to fill armies and create leaders without more cavs. Once we get SciMeth, we can reduce research, if we need the money.

I suspect we won't need to as we should be growing enough to handle the extra support. Have fun, that is what we are about anyway.