Civ7 now includes Denuvo

[Dale]

And 2K probably paid quite a bit for that licensing fee.

It might not actually be as much as some people appear to be assuming here. It's not the official source of course, but this AWS product overview page indicates it is around 50c per activation, + $25k per month. (Contracts may specify otherwise, but with no other information available). https://aws.amazon.com/marketplace/pp/prodview-x443idlstvufi

Take a $70 USD standard edition pricing. If we take an assumption of 50% of that is net revenue (after distribution and taxes), which isn't unreasonable means the revenue from 715 sales per month covers the Denuvo monthly cost. Don't need to factor in the 50c per activation cost since that is variable to sales, plus such a negligible cost per unit. Over the course of 1 year, 8572 sales would cover the monthly cost of Denuvo.

The question is, will the inclusion of Denuvo for 1 year result in more than or equal to 8,572 sales? Is the estimation is 'yes' then it is a beneficial result for the publisher.

EDIT: fixing up maths

 

[Riconatic]

A DRM which reduces the number of installs of Civ7 is unlikely to increase sales of Civ7. What it does do is increase sales of Civ8 and on, because you can't keep playing Civ7 forever.

What do you mean? This drm does not have any total install limit. It has install limit per 24h.

Civ 7 can be played until denuvo verification servers are closed and tokens get obsolete. Are you suggesting that when civ 8 comes the servers will be shutdown? I would count that as conspiracy theory.

 

[Atlas627]

What do you mean? This drm does not have any total install limit. It has install limit per 24h.

Civ 7 can be played until denuvo verification servers are closed and tokens get obsolete. Are you suggesting that when civ 8 comes the servers will be shutdown? I would count that as conspiracy theory.

I don't think that's an install limit PER 24hrs, I think that's a maximum number of installs after the first 24hrs. I swore somebody said that.

Regardless, Steam itself is DRM which makes it very difficult to run 2 copies of the game simultaneously. So in that sense, Steam may increase sales of Civ7 by making sure people don't buy a single copy to share with their friends (though they still could, they'd just have to get fancy with offline mode).

And no of course I'm not suggesting they'd shut the servers down when Civ8 comes out. I've been arguing with everyone freaking out over how Steam could do that.

 

[Trav'ling Canuck]

Profitable companies are more likely to have good data than unprofitable companies, but I think most companies are still operating on hunches.

There's no good data in this area (although I'm sure Denovu has a marketing pitch based on what data there is). At best they will have data on how quickly the game is cracked and pirated. They may have extrapolated data guessing how many copies of the game are pirated, but zero data on how many sales these pirated copies have cost them.

The correlation factor makes this an intractable problem. The most popular games have the most sales and also the most pirating. The least pirated games have the least sales, because they're bad games. Denovu might be able to make a case that they will reduce pirated copies, but there's no way they can confirm that sales would have been higher as a result. For that they'd need to know how many people bought the game because they didn't want to wait for a pirated game and they'd also need to know how many people didn't buy the game because of the DRM hindrance. That data's just not out there.

 

[TreVor_ish]

There are a lot more games then there used to be. Plenty sales, and quite a lot of good indies. Many of well known titles are turning into dlc platforms. DRM's on top of DRM's are a nuisance. But lets throw allegations based on nothing. Haven't seen a single evidence of piracy being such a problem nowadays.

 

[Leyrann]

Re "confusing" Denuvo anti-tamper with Denuvo anti-cheat.

Two sides of the same coin.

Yeah, in the same way that Sid Meier's Civilization VI and Sid Meier's Pirates are two sides of the same coin.

They were published by the same company and have the same name in their, well, name.

And that's about all they have in common.

Heck, Civ VI and Pirates have more in common, as they're at least both games.

Kernel-level access program that scans other active programs =/= some extra code in the .exe of a program, put there by the developers of that program.

 

[KayAU]

Don't need to factor in the 50c per activation cost since that is variable to sales, plus such a negligible cost per unit.

I may be misunderstanding something, but for a high selling game like Civ 6, wouldn't this be a very large part of the cost? Apparently Civ 6 sold something like 11 million copies. Assuming just 1 activation per copy, wouldn't that be 5,5 million USD? And most likely the average number of activations will be higher than 1.

At least the costs are structured in such a way that they would be incentivised to remove it at some point.

 

[canadamufc]

Knowing that this means they can’t steal the game, I’m sure that a large portion of the uproar against Denuvo is from pirates as well.

Very inconsiderate and disrespectful thing to say to people discussing this in good faith. Calling your opposing view being full of criminals is not a good look.

Not arguing further, I don’t know enough about Denuvo to do so, but what was said is not cool at all no matter what side you may reside.

 

[Riconatic]

I don't think that's an install limit PER 24hrs, I think that's a maximum number of installs after the first 24hrs. I swore somebody said that.

I do not think there is maximum installs. Or even ever has been. Zero sources saying that.

All sources saying 5 installs per 24h.

 

[greenOak]

Yeah, in the same way that Sid Meier's Civilization VI and Sid Meier's Pirates are two sides of the same coin.

They were published by the same company and have the same name in their, well, name.

And that's about all they have in common.

Heck, Civ VI and Pirates have more in common, as they're at least both games.

Kernel-level access program that scans other active programs =/= some extra code in the .exe of a program, put there by the developers of that program.

Agree with this (at least from a personal standpoint). As someone who had no idea of what Denuvo was before the civ fanbase made a stink about it, kernel level access is the only thing discussed in this thread that I care strongly about.

 

[GIO888]

As long as you don't mind the game lagging because of it, your SSD burning out years before it should, and

not ACTUALLY knowing what proprietary software on your device without your consent is ACTUALLY doing.

 

[Riconatic]

As long as you don't mind the game lagging because of it, your SSD burning out years before it should, and

not ACTUALLY knowing what proprietary software on your device without your consent is ACTUALLY doing.

Ssd burning is full false claim. Someone invented it in their head and it has nothing to with anything.

Game lags zero if firaxis/2k developer know their business at all. And they know as 2k has used it previously. But this has happened. Some developer have implemented it wrong.

I know what denuvo code does as well as I know what any game code running on my system does. There are ”billion” lines of code in civ 7 which is much more unknown to me than denuvo.

There is very little facts in your post.

 

[GIO888]

Read Kwami's posts again.

It is well documented on forums here and Reddit of expensive SSD replacement drives needed from over-taxing by Denuvo?

Search if you don't believe me.

I do bow to your obvious knowledgability on Software uses - so that may not be as worrying as I first thought....

 

[Riconatic]

Read Kwami's posts again.

It is well documented on forums here and Reddit of expensive SSD replacement drives needed from over-taxing by Denuvo?

Search if you don't believe me.

I do bow to your obvious knowledgability on Software uses - so that may not be as worrying as I first thought....

Reading on reddit does not do any good. Someone needs to prove it somehow. Saying so does not make it so. Nobody has ever proven anything regarding ssd.

Rumor is really really old. Ten years or so. Two things
1. It was debunked immediately by ”all”
2. Even if true ten years have been passed and things can be improved during ten years time.

So no. I do not believe unless proven somehow.

 

[fantsu]

Still really happy how Firaxis and 2K now can protect their product from pirates. Even this discussion shows the salty tears of thieves fearing they cannot steal the game now.

 

[Kev1916]

Still really happy how Firaxis and 2K now can protect their product from pirates. Even this discussion shows the salty tears of thieves fearing they cannot steal the game now.

Happy that your happy , lets hope your new game doesn't run into any lauch issues and crashes if the server is unreachable, down or overloaded as it happens on popular new releases, you won't be able to get any activation tokens and the game won't run....

Pirates may then be laughing at you !

2K should come out and give a contracted mandatory removal of Denuvo with a stated time scale

 

[fantsu]

Happy that your happy , lets hope your new game doesn't run into any lauch issues and crashes if the server is unreachable, down or overloaded as it happens on popular new releases, you won't be able to get any activation tokens and the game won't run....

Pirates may then be laughing at you !

2K should come out and give a contracted mandatory removal of Denuvo with a stated time scale

I'll be buying console version of the game so no Denuvo for me.
I am sure 2K will remove it later when the dust is settled and pirating the game isnt a feat that thieves can brag about.

 

[Riconatic]

I'll be buying console version of the game so no Denuvo for me.
I am sure 2K will remove it later when the dust is settled and pirating the game isnt a feat that thieves can brag about.

I am not so sure that removal. Like discussed in this thread (maybe page 4), midnight sun’s still have denuvo. It is nearing two years age.

I personally do not believe any benefits would follow from removal. Sales boost from denuvo haters or full offline gamers after 2+ years I do not see. If it was well implemented also technically nothing changes.

Cost aspects are the unknown factor for me however.

 

[Gedemon]

I'll be buying console version of the game so no Denuvo for me.
I am sure 2K will remove it later when the dust is settled and pirating the game isnt a feat that thieves can brag about.

I don't think they'll remove it, unless it's cracked or if they failed to implement it correctly in the 5 months they have until release and it has a negative impact on the game's performance.

Still really happy how Firaxis and 2K now can protect their product from pirates. Even this discussion shows the salty tears of thieves fearing they cannot steal the game now.

there are legitimate questions to be asked, respect those who ask them.

 

[fantsu]

there are legitimate questions to be asked, respect those who ask them.

Sure. Still remember when people got mad early 80s when even affordable cars started to have immobilizers as an anti-theft mechanism and how it would increase the price of the product for everyone.
Clever people asked why some inviduals steal cars then. Its happening again I see.
Some can fault those who worked hard and try to prevent theft of their efforts. Communism in a nut shell pretty much.