It won't be 59%. I think among the longtime CF people, you'll lose around 20%.
Civilization 5 and Steam(works)
- Thread starter ori
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It won't be 59%. I think among the longtime CF people, you'll lose around 20%.
Ahriman
Tyrant
Who wants to bet that half of the people who say "I will never buy Civ5 with Steam" turn around and buy it anyway if the game comes out and is well received/has great reviews.
Talk is cheap.
Talk is cheap.
Senethro
Overlord
I think it'll be a lot less. The news of Steam brings out those with strong opinion while those who don't care just don't turn up. Theres going to be an overrepresentation of the strong opinions in the above poll while the reality is they barely add up amongst the millions of sales.
oops you are right 
sooory I have not intended to make a high figure up,
I effectively counted the definite buys to the non-buyers.
er, well ok, maths is difficult.
this of course makes the whole question a bit pointless, because if only 25% are non buyers, many modders will still be with civ5.
which is good. still, until more features are revealed I am a bit suscpicous regarding the announcement that "you have to think in a different way" which was nearly the same phrase that was used to promote moo3
sooory I have not intended to make a high figure up,
I effectively counted the definite buys to the non-buyers.
er, well ok, maths is difficult.
this of course makes the whole question a bit pointless, because if only 25% are non buyers, many modders will still be with civ5.
which is good. still, until more features are revealed I am a bit suscpicous regarding the announcement that "you have to think in a different way" which was nearly the same phrase that was used to promote moo3
Sorry this is a bad post for my first one...but I plan on more.
I'm not sure what people have against Steam. I was originally against it when you needed it for Half-Life, ages and ages ago. But today, it is insanely different. I only buy games on Steam now. Most of the time, they are a good deal. I don't have to handle CDs/DVDs anymore. I can install/uninstall anytime. They have great deals on other games. For someone who uses Steam so heavily, obviously this is only going to make me want it more.
I also think that some of the people who won't give into buying the game on steam will be replaced by those who never picked up the game before. Steam has a huge following now. Plus, you have to admit, this is one way for 2K not to go bankrupt. They're saving a ton on production and shipping costs.
I'm not sure if I'm going to buy it the first day yet...but I will eventually purchase Civ V and most definitely on steam.
maybe.. but if the reviews on civfanatics are bad, I really won't buy it.
even if they are good, and many people say it has not much micromanagement, I won't buy it.
steam does affect the decision for me: if it had no steam, I would even preorder it. with steamworks in it, I will wait until I decide if civ5 is worth, to have that virus on my pc.
Senethro
Overlord
Thanks for posting mate, its people in your position who I'm hoping will turn out on release day and make a clear statement favouring Steam.
There are people on this forum who review Civ4 as being worse than Civ3. Make sure you pick the right people to listen to.
Ahriman
Tyrant
If reviews/reception are bad, then people won't/shouldn't buy it. This will be what determines sales of the game. Not Steam.
True
I don't know...Steam is a dream come true for me. I've purchased more video games than ever because of Steam...and Steam is what made me stop illegally downloading games (which was like 6 or 7 years ago.) I think people who don't use it should be so critical of it. I did end up with an iD pack of about 30 games for just under 40 bucks...that's a pretty sweet deal.
Unfortunately, you're probably right. The casuals who make up the bulk of sales don't care- and probably don't even know.
I do think the mod community will suffer though.
The mod community will not suffer if:
1. The modders who know their stuff continue to do what they do best: Create content and enjoy watching others play it.
2. The content that is created is marketed well (spread out there on the internets). 2K Greg and 2k Elizabeth says that the Steamworks portal or whatever the heck it is will help do this to all those other players.
Or we/CF could simply spread the word for these said modders. It's easy enough to do. I know that a lot of places would love to publish an article on Civ5 mods/best mods around which will attract readers. Think Dota (Warcraft 3 custom map that millions play rather than the core game or other maps) guys.
1. The modders who know their stuff continue to do what they do best: Create content and enjoy watching others play it.
2. The content that is created is marketed well (spread out there on the internets). 2K Greg and 2k Elizabeth says that the Steamworks portal or whatever the heck it is will help do this to all those other players.
Or we/CF could simply spread the word for these said modders. It's easy enough to do. I know that a lot of places would love to publish an article on Civ5 mods/best mods around which will attract readers. Think Dota (Warcraft 3 custom map that millions play rather than the core game or other maps) guys.
evrett37
Prince
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Its funny how little people value their freedom until its lost..the ability to regulate and control mod able content is going to totally upend and redefine the community. Especially if modding becomes a for profit business similar to cell phone aps due to a downloadble marketplace. Sooo many factors are being brought into play by turning an open free economy into a money making machine for the devs you have no idea. People are going to look back and wish they could have back what we have now. But whats lost is lost. And you will lose the ability to go back to a free and open system once money starts changing hands per download. Once the teeth are latched on to that black teet they wont be easy to pry off.
Civ had a special place as a "bridge" game that brought all sorts of people into gaming. A game that schools even installed. Steam is going to take a big swipe at that in a variety of forms and all so some big company can milk a brand. Its a bad tradeoff and and a total gamble against the community. Just say NO!
MaxCiv
Warlord
I concur. Initially, I was not very positively about Steam. For two main reasons; I am ideologically against DRM (as it in most cases only hurts the actual customers) and because I feared that Valve could turn it into a nightmare with lock-ins and whatnot.
Now I cannot change the former position, but luckily, the latter was never an outcome; it only got better. Most people, hearing of Steam, think instantly that it is a limitation on your behalf. And while, yes, Steam does limit you in certain ways, its pros far outweighs its cons.
That being said, I probably would have gotten Civ5 anyway (preordered it via Steam), but Steam probably made that decision easier. I mean, going down to the store to buy a game? What is this? The middle ages?! I'm too lazy for that.
Steam is one of the few examples of DRM done 'right'. The DRM is in most cases non-intrusive. Yes, yes, I know the stories and whatnot, but those are technical mishaps, that was actually not about the basics of Steam, but rather games doing something they weren't supposed to be doing.
People, digital distribution is the way of the future, this is a fact we all have to accept. There is no reason to dwell in this nay-saying confinement. That being said, don't say yes to all digital distribution! And certainly not to any DRM-scheme, like Ubisoft's.
More and more games will go the way of digital distributions. And there will be fewer and fewer physical stores selling games. Change happens. It lessens the costs of distribution, so they can focus on paying developers to make better games and/or lessen the price to the customer.
It's an interesting point you bring up evrett, about school's using civ4. I've spoken with many maths teachers and future maths teachers and it turns out civ4 is quite popular as an educational too. Occasionally we get people on the boards here asking about things related to using it in the classroom or teaching their son/daughter some maths (history is a reason too, but I'm less familiar with that side of things).
I don't want to slag off steam too much in this post, but with required Steam, I would expect pretty much no school environment would welcome this game anymore. Not a big loss necessarily, but I really do reserve a lot of respect for people who create software (including games) that can be used as effective education tools. Civ4 has done an excellent job with that, from what I've heard.
. The main difference is you get the game a fair bit faster via digital distribution. And that is a big difference. Really I don't think the main point here is that it's digital distribution, but rather that it's online purchasing.
I don't want to slag off steam too much in this post, but with required Steam, I would expect pretty much no school environment would welcome this game anymore. Not a big loss necessarily, but I really do reserve a lot of respect for people who create software (including games) that can be used as effective education tools. Civ4 has done an excellent job with that, from what I've heard.
ebay works a charm too if you're too lazy to leave your chairSvip said:
. The main difference is you get the game a fair bit faster via digital distribution. And that is a big difference. Really I don't think the main point here is that it's digital distribution, but rather that it's online purchasing.Steam allows you purchase a so called 'licence'-deal, if you are a computer café (or whatever the English term is), institution or something. Basically where you need a lot of accounts and a lot of licences. These deals are typically a lot cheaper than purchasing each individually.
That being said. I still think Paradox's games are more educational than Civ. In fact, I cannot really see the educational aspect of Civ4 right off the bat. Sure it has history build into it, but Paradox's games is playing history.
Nah. I think its selling point is the digital distribution. Purchasing the goods still require packaging and shipment. A lot of extra expenses. With digital distribution, the distribution cost is almost only going to keeping the servers alive. Which of course, individually is more expensive than packing one game. But considering how many games a server can distribute over time; it's a fraction of the packaging and shipment costs are on physical products.
Don't pretend you can't order CIV V on Amazon or a similar site and have it shipped to you quickly. What Steam excels at is making impulsive purchase decisions easier for impulsive purchasers who lack the self control to shop around for a better digital download or a DVD. In rare cases Steam may be the only viable option. But please, let's not enable them.
Shame I live in a country that these companies do not intend to ship quickly to. You should consider yourself lucky, that Amazon is a viable alternative to you. That's not the case for me. In addition, I do like not having to fiddle with a CD, unless I have to be nostalgic. And that's just wrong with a modern game.
In addition to that, more and more computers, laptops especially, are now being made without a disc-drive, because they are old and clunky and take up space and weight, which is especially an issue in many laptops. So for some people, they have to rely on installing software via the internet.
And I can bet you, that disc-drives will slow vanish away and be replaced by either digital distribution or USB-sticks or possibly a new miniature sized read-only format.
I installed Steam about a month ago and purchased CIV III and Railroad Tycoon to give it a whirl.
So far I'm completely indifferent to having it. It hasn't done anything nasty like erase my hard drive and set my computer on fire, but it hasn't really got me excited either. I rarely play MP games and when I do its hanging out with my friends playing a hotseat game, could care less about achievements, Steam or otherwise (no offense to HoF players)
My only concern is what if Steam goes out of business gets closed down or whatever in the near future?
I realize that the probability of this happening is extremely low, however just a few short years ago (if even that long) the same could be said about Ford, GM, Chrysler, and significant list of major players on Wall Street.
So I believe that in this day and age this is a legitimate concern. Does anyone think that Steam falls into the "To Big to Fail Category"?
So far I'm completely indifferent to having it. It hasn't done anything nasty like erase my hard drive and set my computer on fire, but it hasn't really got me excited either. I rarely play MP games and when I do its hanging out with my friends playing a hotseat game, could care less about achievements, Steam or otherwise (no offense to HoF players)
My only concern is what if Steam goes out of business gets closed down or whatever in the near future?
I realize that the probability of this happening is extremely low, however just a few short years ago (if even that long) the same could be said about Ford, GM, Chrysler, and significant list of major players on Wall Street.
So I believe that in this day and age this is a legitimate concern. Does anyone think that Steam falls into the "To Big to Fail Category"?
Svip wrote:
I don't think buying the appropriate amount of copies would be the issue for an instution. I believe (can't back this up, just "think" it ) that they are likely to buy the amount of licenses that they need. The question it brings to my mind is this: If you were in charge of a schools IT dept. would you put Steam on your schools computers?
I don't think buying the appropriate amount of copies would be the issue for an instution. I believe (can't back this up, just "think" it ) that they are likely to buy the amount of licenses that they need. The question it brings to my mind is this: If you were in charge of a schools IT dept. would you put Steam on your schools computers?
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