Civilization VII Civs and Leaders Wishlist [Not a Prediction]

The Spanish Inquisition attacked my ancestors so I have personal beef with it, except for the Monty Python Spanish Inquisition.'

Yeah well Philip II attacked my ancestors too. Still not going to complain about him being part of Civ VI.

Again, the Spanish Inquisition was less likely to judge you guilty when you were innocent than existing law practices at the time. Is it barbaric compared to modern times? Sure! But it literally provided more protections for prosecuted people than they had before it. If the Spanish Inquisition hadn't existed to attack your ancestors, then some random lord would've sentenced them to death because no one was stopping him. At least the Spanish Inquisition was acquainted with the concept of gathering evidence.
 
Rommel's #1 claim to fame is that he was behind one of the closest-to-successful attempts on Hitler's life. He also, by most accounts, did not share the Nazi ideology or show cruelty or the like, although afaik there's some debate on whether Allied propaganda might have white-washed him to create a narrative.

I am aware that IIRC Rommel wasn't the member of Nazi party, but still I think this logic applies to the Third Reich leaders in general:

“Historians have a word for Germans who joined the Nazi party, not because they hated Jews, but out of a hope for restored patriotism, or a sense of economic anxiety, or a hope to preserve their religious values, or dislike of their opponents, or raw political opportunism, or convenience, or ignorance, or greed.
That word is "Nazi." Nobody cares about their motives anymore.” - A.R. Moxon

Rommel was ultimately admist loyal and very effective leaders of the murderous war machine which led to the death of millions, directly contributing to Nazi successes and the process of mass death and destruction. His absence in war would have directly saved the lives of thousands of Allied soldiers, and who knows how many civilians exterminated under Nazi rule before Wehrmacht's ultimate defeat - he was among many "clean" ones who have still contributed to the war lasting as long as it did.
 
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I am aware that IIRC Rommel wasn't the member of Nazi party, but still I think this logic applies to the Third Reich leaders in general:

“Historians have a word for Germans who joined the Nazi party, not because they hated Jews, but out of a hope for restored patriotism, or a sense of economic anxiety, or a hope to preserve their religious values, or dislike of their opponents, or raw political opportunism, or convenience, or ignorance, or greed.
That word is "Nazi." Nobody cares about their motives anymore.” - A.R. Moxon

I'm not saying that he's a good leader for Germany. But I don't like throwing everyone under the same umbrella, in particular someone who risked (and lost) his life trying to change the course of his country.
 
I say this all the time, but Gandhi was most definitely a leader in every sense of the word, a national leader at that too, not just a regional one. He just wasn't a ruler
Oh, I agree. I was implying that same logic also could apply Eva Peron, as in a spiritual leaders of civs are fine, not just limit to political leaders.
 
Shirvan - Ibrahim I (Representing the Caucuses in place of Georgia this time around, Shirvan can see oil early on and can extract it for other benefits - if stratigic resouces had passive bonuses for having them, Shirvan could trade this oil away in the early game that will give other empires benefits but will in term gives Shirvan lucrative trade deals)
I would much rather Armenia (besides, the Azeri never register as Caucasian to me), but I can see the appeal of a Azeri civ with Qizil Arslan as an alternative leader for Eldiguzid representation, or possibly even Jahan-Shah for Qoyunlu representation
 
I would much rather Armenia (besides, the Azeri never register as Caucasian to me), but I can see the appeal of a Azeri civ with Qizil Arslan as an alternative leader for Eldiguzid representation, or possibly even Jahan-Shah for Qoyunlu representation
When it comes to the Azerbaijanis it is more correct to call them "Trans-Caucasian" or "South Caucasian", as they are collectively called with Georgia and Armenia. But in general Azerbaijan is definitely part of the Caucasus region, which is something the Azerbaijani people don't deny.
 
Some more wishlist civ and leaders design ideas.

Dutch:
The Lords Seventeen – +5 loyalty from commercial hubs; +1 sight and movement for all naval units; commercial hubs generate 1 great admiral point per turn
Unique units: Sea Beggar, Blauwe Garde; Unique infrastructure: Polder
Leader: Frederick Henry. Ability: City Forcer; Agenda: Military Revolution. Focuses on siege and support units

Turks:
The Sultan’s Pier – founding a city on the coast or building a naval base for a city automatically claims all unclaimed water tiles for it; +4 diplomatic favour from military alliances
Unique units: Janissary, Sipahi; Unique infrastructure: Külliye
Leader: Selim I. Ability: Yavuz Sultan; Agenda: Servant of the Holy Cities. Focuses on being the strongest civ following his religion

Koreans:
Seonbi – activating a great person (except for great generals and great admirals) provides a permanent +1 amenity, +1 loyalty, +2 science, and +2 culture to the city they were activated in; recruiting great people with faith is 25% cheaper
Unique units: Hwach'a, Geobukseon; Unique infrastructure: Seowon
Leader: Jeongjo. Ability: Writings of Kyu; Agenda: Silhak. Focuses on science and culture

Maya:
Divine King – every palace functions as if it is in the capital; builders may use a charge to speed up the construction of districts and wonders; units earn faith from killing enemy units
Unique units: Atlatlist, Macuahuitlist; Unique infrastructure: Pyramid-Temple
Leader: Lady Xoc. Ability: Bloodletting Rituals; Agenda: Bee’s House. Focuses on accumulating faith and purchasing with it

Iroquois:
Mourning Wars – an Iroquois unit will withdraw from battle if it is about to get killed unless it starts the battle with very low health; when an Iroquois unit kills an enemy unit there is a 50% chance to add +1 to the nearest city’s population
Unique units: Tomahawk Warrior, Ambusher; Unique infrastructure: Longhouse
Leader: Red Jacket. Ability: Keeper Awake; Agenda: Religion for the White Man and the Red. Focuses on spreading religions from the home continent, and fighting against religions from foreign continents

Poles:
Rzeczpospolita – all military policy slots in any government are converted to wildcard policy slots; light and heavy cavalry units earn promotions 50% faster
Unique units: Winged Hussar, Uhlan; Unique infrastructure: Sejmik
Leader: Bolesław I. Ability: Vita Sancti Adalberti; Agenda: Brother and Partner of the Empire. Focuses on holy relics

Portuguese:
School of Navigation – +1 science and +1 great admiral point from campuses on coastal tiles, and an extra +1 if on a cliff; +1 movement and +1 sight to all naval units
Unique units: Nau, Caçador; Unique infrastructure: Feitoria
Leader: Pombal. Ability: Iluminismo; Agenda: Estrangeirado. Focuses on protection from natural disasters

Brazilians:
Carnaval do Brasil – +1 amenity from each entertainment complex; cities with an entertainment complex have access to the unique “carnival” project that provides an extra amenity for its duration as well as great artist, great writer, and great musician points; +1 tourism from rainforest tiles after the discovery of flight
Unique units: Pará, Urutu; Unique infrastructure: Arsenal of the Navy
Leader: Juscelino Kubitschek. Ability: Goals’ Plan; Agenda: Fifty Years Progress in Five. Focuses on industrialization and electrification

Kongo:
Seven Kingdoms – +4 gold and +4 culture from domestic trade routes to the capital, as well as from trade routes with city-states on the home continent; +1 amenity in the capital from every two active domestic trade routes to it; +1 gold from rainforest tiles
Unique units: Pombo, Cabanzo Bowman; Unique infrastructure: Raffia Grove
Leader: Nzinga a Nkuwu. Ability: Ships of the Enlightened King; Agenda: Religious Convert. Focuses on adopting foreign religions

Afghans:
Graveyard of Empires – enemy units suffer twice the damage from natural disasters in Afghan territory and move 50% slower; religious units not following Afghanistan’s majority religion suffer a 75% movement penalty in Afghan territory; no movement penalty for Afghan units on hills in Afghan territory
Unique units: Zamburak, Afridi Fighter; Unique infrastructure: Qala
Leader: Ahmad Shah Durrani. Ability: Pearl of Pearls; Agenda: Love of a Nation. Focuses on conflicts with neighbours

Norwegians:
Leidang – units may enter ocean tiles after shipbuilding has been researched; no movement cost for embarking and disembarking; naval units are produced 20% faster during war; +1 production from improved coastal resources
Unique units: Berserker, Longship; Unique infrastructure: Stave Church
Leader: Harald Fairhair. Ability: Hird; Agenda: Shockhead. Focuses on settling coastal and island cities

Khmer:
Cult of Devarāja – temples contain +1 relic slot; missionaries gain the martyr promotion; +1 gold from each holy site building
Unique units: Nāga Boat, Ballista Elephant; Unique infrastructure: Baray
Leader: Yasovarman I. Ability: Great Angkor; Agenda: Builder of Ashrams. Focuses on religion and growth

Hausa:
Chiefs of the Market – the first seven cities founded grant one free district, with its buildings automatically constructed upon researching the appropriate technology or civic (the same district cannot be chosen more than twice); +2 culture from horses; +3 gold per trade route between two civilizations or city-states that passes through Hausa territory
Unique units: Sarkin Baka, Lifidi Jarumi; Unique infrastructure: Kofofi
Leader: Amina. Ability: Ganuwar; Agenda: Tribute Collector. Focuses on trade routes

Phoenicians:
Tyrian Purple – upon meeting a civilization for the first time, both Phoenicia and said civilization gain a random eureka and a random inspiration; +1 gold from forest tiles; +2 gold from coastal luxury resources; +3 science and +2 gold from trade routes per every trading post they go through; coastal cities start with a trading post established in them
Unique units: Bireme, Balearic Slinger; Unique infrastructure: Cothon
Leader: Hiram I. Ability: King Solomon’s Temple; Agenda: Gold of Ophir. Focuses on long-distance trade

Bulgarians:
National Revival – the first golden age earned is a heroic age, even if it comes after a normal age; two dedications are available in every other golden age; +5 combat strength for all land units when defending, and an extra +3 if on hills
Unique units: Bulgar, Cuman Archer; Unique infrastructure: Literary School
Leader: Simeon the Great. Ability: A Clamour Rises by the Bosphorus; Agenda: Emperor of the Romans. Focuses on defence against neighbours

Hawaiians:
Kahuna Nui – sailing technology unlocked when first city is settled, allowing all land units to embark; may enter ocean tiles after discovering celestial navigation; +1 faith per specialist; buildings in districts are constructed 10% faster per occupied specialist slot in them
Unique units: Koa, Honolulu Rifle; Unique infrastructure: Heiau
Leader: Ka'ahumanu I. Ability: Kawaiaha’o Mission; Agenda: ‘Ai Noa. Focuses on spreading and protecting an adopted religion

Alternate leaders:

Germans:
Leader: Otto I. Ability: Imperial Church System; Agenda: Donation of Pepin. Focuses on golden and heroic ages

French:
Leader: Anne de Beaujeu. Ability: Madame la Grande; Agenda: Humble, Benign and Courteous. Focuses on saving and not spending gold
 
And? Still a Nazi

Technically not a Nazi, as he was never a member of the party. He was an officer of the German military and served the government of the time (faithfully almost to the end, when he participated in the assassination attempt).

Not all Germans were Nazis and I think it's important to remember that. You can blame Rommel for being an enabler and not resigning his commission when Hitler came to power, but the question of the proper response of professional soldiers in such circumstances is a thorny one. We still, in democracies, expect our military to follow the orders of the duly elected civilian government and not meddle in or influence government policy.

Terrible choice for a Civ leader for Germany, though, regardless. Shouldn't even be considered.
 
When it comes to the Azerbaijanis it is more correct to call them "Trans-Caucasian" or "South Caucasian", as they are collectively called with Georgia and Armenia. But in general Azerbaijan is definitely part of the Caucasus region, which is something the Azerbaijani people don't deny.
I mean they're Caucasian in that they live in the region, but they don't have much in common with the other Caucasians such as the Georgians, Circassians, Avars, Chechens, Ingush etc.

(Come to think of it, neither do Armenians, as far as I know)
 
I've been thinking about this for a while! Taking the pulse of the civ communities (i.e. here and reddit) I've made the following list of civs/lead that I'd like to see in Civ VII.Civ VI had 50+ civs and a total of 67 leaders. I think Civ VII should strive for 60+ civs and 70 total leaders. I mean, it's the seventh iteration so a nice round number would be great!

I'll assume 20 for the base game (+1 from VI's number), and then 9 civs per expansion pack (+1 per the number introduced in Rise and Fall/Gathering Storm)

I'll divide it up by the base game, as well as "packs"/DLC that I'd like to see done. For the time being I'll assume they'll use the 2-3 pack model with scattered passes/additional DLC along the way. Also note that I don't have a leader for every civ...while I tried to do so, my historical knowledge of every nation isn't perfect. But I tried to get all 62 civs and 8 alternative leaders!!

Civilization 7: Base Game (The Classics)

1. Haudenosaunee - Jigonhsasee
2. Maya - Pakal I
3. USA - Thomas Jefferson (Controversial, but I definitely want an expansionist USA)
4. Inca - Pachacuti
5. Brazil - Pedro II
6. Songhai - Askia the Great
7. Egypt - Hateshput
8. Rome - Hadrian
9. Greece - Epaminondas
10. England - Elizabeth I
11. France - Napoleon Bonaparte
12. Germany - Fredrick II
13. Russia - Catherine the Great
14. Achemenids - Xerxes I
15. Abbasids - Harun al Rashid
16. Mongols - Genghis Khan
17. China - Emperor Taizong
18. Japan - Emperor Meiji
19. Maurya - Ashoka the Great
20. Babylon - Hammurabi


Pass Content 1: Deus Vult: The Crusading Spirit (4 additions)
21. Byzantines - Basil II
22. Ayyubids - Saladin
23. Poland - Jan III Sobieski
24. Ottomans - Suleiman the Magnificient


Expansion Pack 1: Winds of Change (Pack based on trade/nomadic peoples! 9 additions)
25. Mali - Mansa Musa
26. Portugal - Manuel I
27. Timurids - Timur
28. Swahili - (Probably the Sultan of Oman? Lame but I really want a Swahili civ!)
29. Morocco - Dihya
30. Phoenicia - Dido
31. Dine/Navajo (If allowed) - Hastiin Chʼil Haajiní
32. Maori - ???
33. Zulu - Shaka


Pass Content 2: Queens of the World (4 additions)
34. Hawai'i - Liliuokalani
35. Kievan Rus - Olga I
36. Austria - Maria Theresa
37. Ambundu - Nzinga Mbande


Expansion Pack 2: Conquest and Resistance (Pack based on resistance to colonialism/invaders! 9 additions)

38. Aztecs - Montezuma I
39. Spain - Isabella I
40. Ethiopia - Menelik II
41. Italy - Camillo Benso (Or Giuseppe Garibaldi..both would be ok)
42. Netherlands - William of Orange
43. Indonesia - Gitarja (Or Gajah Mada would be great too!)
43. Denmark - Ragnar Lothbrok
44. Ireland - Michael Collins
45. Vietnam - Ba Trieu



Pass Content 3: Liberators of the New World (3 additions)
46. Gran Colombia - Simon Bolivar
47. Haiti - Touissant l'Overture
48. Argentina - Jose Antonio de San Martin


Expansion Pack 3: The Test of Time (Emphasis on building great things/ development! 9 additions)
49. India - Gandhi (Had to have him...)
50. Nubia - Amanitore
51. Umayyads - Abd al-Malik
52. Mapuche - Lautaro
53. Sweden - Charles XII
54. Mexico - ???
55. Safavids - Abbas the Great
56. Korea - Sejong
57. Khmer - ???


Pass Content 4: Last Frontiers (4 additions)
58. Canada - Wilfrid Laurier
59. Ojibwe (If allowed) - ???
60. Australia - ???
61. Aboriginal Civ - (A don't know if they want to choose one or go with an amalgomation but it needs to happen! FXS can do it!)


Expansion Pack 4: Great Nations, Great Minds (Only leaders, all for more than one civ! 8 new leaders)
62. Justinian I (Rome/ Byzantium - Represents early Byzantine Empire)
63. Alexander the Great (Greece/ Achemenids - Represents Macedonia)
64. Akbar I (Timurids/ India - Represents Mughals)
65. Margaret I (Denmark/ Sweden - Represents Kalmar Union)
66. Shajar al-Durr (Ayyubids/ Egypt - Represents Mamluks)
67. Charles V (Austria/ Spain - Represents Holy Roman Empire)
68. Abd al-Rahman (Umayyads/ Morocco - Represents Al-Andalus)
69. Ashurbanipal (Babylon/ Egypt - Represents Assyrian Empire)


Pass Content 5: The Epic of Gilgamesh (1 addition)
70. Sumeria - Gilgabro (A fun scenario plus a fan-favorite returns! Could be used for a special event or something like Julius Caesar was in VI)


Just my 2 cents. Who did I miss and who would you have preferred to see? Gotta love that new-civ-game speculation!
 
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Not angry or anything, just some criticisms.

THREE ENGLISH CIVS IN A BASE GAME??? LIKE WHAT????? (Reminds me of my ex who lives in Britain)

As the #1 Reagan hater what

I'm not fond of dictators, as you'll later see

Isn't it not allowed to have depictions of the Prophet Muhammad?

Not again!!! XD

Seriously? A king who continued pressing for WWI, a Nazi, and a genocidal tyrant of a queen?

The guy who led all the genocides towards the Nahua and many, many others. Also an evil tyrant

Dictators are always a bad choice

I'd quit Civ if I ever see the CSA adapted into a civ game.



In the end I am a bit upset at these choices, and I apologize if I did anything wrong.
Good. Then I hope they use Rommel and General Lee as Great Generals, because the fanbase does NOT need people like you who want their fee-fees to be prioritized over history.

You think Montezuma was choir boy? Get out of here with your woke nonsense.

What a ridiculous person you are.

Now, frankly speaking, they should not use political figures who came after 1900, let the modders take that care of those.

Moderator Action: Discussing your fellow forum members instead of the thread topic is trolling. Please stop. leif
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889
 
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I mean they're Caucasian in that they live in the region, but they don't have much in common with the other Caucasians such as the Georgians, Circassians, Avars, Chechens, Ingush etc.

(Come to think of it, neither do Armenians, as far as I know)
Well, Caucasians are all very different from each other. Some are Turkic, some are Iranian, some are Georgian. The Caucasus is a region, and the people of the Caucasus, while being different, are also all very "Caucasian" so to say. I have visited Azerbaijan a few weeks ago, and trust me, it was a very Caucasian experience, but with a Turkic flavour.
 
Good. Then I hope they use Rommel and General Lee as Great Generals, because the fanbase does NOT need people like you who want their fee-fees to be prioritized over history.

You think Montezuma was choir boy? Get out of here with your woke nonsense.

What a ridiculous person you are.

Now, frankly speaking, they should not use political figures who came after 1900, let the modders take that care of those.
Why such a phobia about the 20th Century. It's as important a century as any in history. Besides Gandhi, FDR, Churchill, and Stalin have been used in this franchise. I know talk of the 20th Century brings a certain Charlie Chaplin look alike into the conversation. But even if he remains off limits, there are leaders the franchise should not ignore any longer. JFK being one of them.
 
You might know him by a different name, he's the king who allowed the Jews to go back to Israel. In the Dutch translation he's called Kores.



Rommel's #1 claim to fame is that he was behind one of the closest-to-successful attempts on Hitler's life. He also, by most accounts, did not share the Nazi ideology or show cruelty or the like, although afaik there's some debate on whether Allied propaganda might have white-washed him to create a narrative.



Eva Peron wasn't even a leader. She was the wife of one.



Literally an improvement over the common legal practices at the time. See also:

Rommel has no business in a Civ game, and nor does any other figure from Nazi Germany. This whitewashing of his history--the "Rommel myth"--is itself a part of the larger "Clean Wehrmecht myth." He was not some innocent, chivalrous knight--he was a 100% culpable war criminal.

His supposed military prowess was itself a product of propaganda by the Allies, and his battlefield "chivalry" in North Africa was a luxury afforded to him only by the theater itself and in no way exculpates his furthering of the Nazi cause through his every action. His fervent support of Hitler began when prewar phase of the Holocaust was well underway. Ultimately, willingly and graciously accepted the support of both Hitler and Goebbels and of the Nazi state apparatus writ large, and there is no conceivable way that he was not aware of and privy to the crimes against humanity perpetrated by Nazi Germany.
 
Rommel has no business in a Civ game, and nor does any other figure from Nazi Germany. This whitewashing of his history--the "Rommel myth"--is itself a part of the larger "Clean Wehrmecht myth." He was not some innocent, chivalrous knight--he was a 100% culpable war criminal.

His supposed military prowess was itself a product of propaganda by the Allies, and his battlefield "chivalry" in North Africa was a luxury afforded to him only by the theater itself and in no way exculpates his furthering of the Nazi cause through his every action. His fervent support of Hitler began when prewar phase of the Holocaust was well underway. Ultimately, willingly and graciously accepted the support of both Hitler and Goebbels and of the Nazi state apparatus writ large, and there is no conceivable way that he was not aware of and privy to the crimes against humanity perpetrated by Nazi Germany.
Your comment is kind of ridiculous because it implies you yourself are whitewashing all the other leaders ever presented in the Civ series, many of whom are far from irreproachable.
 
Okay, here's my more in depth wishlist. It should have a more detailed reasoning for why I am picking certain leaders. I will try to provide two leader options; my top pick, and my "runner up". This list is only for the base game, but I might make another list containing the civs I want for the first DLC later. Now prepare yourself for the wall of text:

Arabia - My top choice is Abd al-Malik ibn Marwan. The second fitna revealed the unprecedented level of division within the Caliphate, divisions which only grew as the civil conflict ground on for a decade. Under Abd al-Malik's leadership, the Umayyads managed to slowly grow their power until they found themselves in a position to challenge for the umma’s leadership once again. Abd al-Malik's adept handling of the second fitna revealed him to be a shrewd mover and shaker with a disposition suitable for leadership. He did more than emulate those who came before him, he enacted changes that pushed the caliphate further into statehood and away from its roots as a tribal confederacy, cementing his family’s supremacy in the process

My runner up is al-Mu'tadid. This energetic Caliph personally led his armies and succeeded in restoring the Abbasid Caliphate to its former glory. He was even able to effectively diminish his adversaries, often without even resorting to open conflict. Generally, he is portrayed as an exemplary caliph. Although likely embellished by propaganda, it's evident that his leadership provided much-needed stability to the caliphate after the turbulent anarchy at Samarra. He also renewed caliphal sponsorship of scholars and scientists.

Assyria - My pick for the ancient Mesopotamia base game spot. My top pick is Sennacherib. He is probably most famous for the failed siege to Jerusalem and making king Hezekiah confined "like a bird in a cage." Sennacherib also waged successful campaigns against Elam and squashed many revolts. He is also responsible for rebuilding the city of Nineveh.

My runner up is Tiglath-Pileser III. Succeeded in extending Assyrian domination over vast territories. He crushed an Aramean coalition, conquered the northern half of Babylonia, including the city itself and became the first Assyrian king of Babylon.

Burma - My top choice is Alaungpaya. Alaungpaya was one the three greatest kings of Burma, and the founder of the Konbaung dynasty. The mid 1700s were a period of turmoil in Burma, Binnya Dala led a Mon revolt, and took Ava from the declining Toungoo dynasty. Alaungpaya resisted, established Moksobomyo as his capital, reclaimed Ava, and founded the Konbaung dynasty. He also forced the French and the British out, and unified the country.

My runner up is Bayinnaung. Bayinnaung was a powerful ruler of the Taungoo dynasty in Myanmar. He quelled the revolting Mons, and expanded his kingdom by conquering the Shan States and Siam, making Myanmar a dominant power in Southeast Asia. He was also a patron of Buddhism, generously supporting monasteries, and building pagodas.

China - My top choice is Taizu of Song. Honestly, I just want a Song emperor. He pulled off what is probably the most peaceful coup in history and reunited most of China after the era of warlords. He was a patron the arts, sciences and economics.

My runner up is Han Wudi. Emperor Wudi is renowned for his significant contributions to China’s expansion and cultural development. He successfully repelled threats from the north, introduced the Silk Road, and established Confucianism as the state "religion". His reign was marked by military conquests, territorial expansions, and efforts to unify the diverse cultures within the empire.

Egypt - Due to Egypt only having a limited amount of 3000 years of history, we unfortunately have to put the Greek lady back in charge. /s.

On a more serious note, from the trailer it looks like we are getting a female leader. Thus my top choice is Hatshepsut. Ruling first as regent for, then as co-ruler with, her nephew Thutmose III, Hatshepsut enjoyed a relatively peaceful reign, at the beginning of the New Kingdom. She restored monuments destroyed during the disruptive Second Intermediate Period. She renewed trade with western Asia to the east, the far-off land of Punt to the south, and the Aegean Islands to the north. But honestly, I wouldn't even mind Sobekneferu or Nefertiti.

My runner up is Mentuhotep II. He is revered by as the guy who reunited Egypt after the era of disunity (the First Intermediate Period) that followed the end of the Old Kingdom. He also initiated a number of building projects, including in the areas of el-Kab, Gebelein, Tod, Deir el-Ballas, Dendera, Karnak, Abydos, Aswan and Armant. His greatest building work was his temple and tomb on the west bank at Thebes.

England - My top choice is Edward I Longshanks. He reformed the laws so every man got a fair trial, defeated De Montfort and ended the period of civil war inherited from his father, limited the powers of the feudal lords, prevented war between France and Spain, reformed parliament so they met regularly. He also conquered Wales and built some cool looking castles.

My runner up is Henry II. Fixed a lot of problems following the destructive civil war between his mother and king Stephen. He also significantly reformed the law and the financial system (father of common law).

Ethiopia - My top choice is Ezana. He was the first Ethiopian king to convert to Christianity (thanks to the monk Frumentius from Roman Syria) and was a prolific builder judging by his monumental obelisks, stelae, and thrones. Ezana also launched several military campaigns including the Kushites. Ezana is remembered for laying the foundation of the Ethiopian Empire and ensuring Axum remained a major power in East Africa.

My runner up is Lalibela. Legend has it that Lalibela is said to have seen a vision in Jerusalem that instructed him to build a new Jerusalem in Ethiopia as a response to Saladin's recapture of the city in 1187. Lalibela would go on to construct 11 complex monolithic churches.

France - My top choice is Philip II. He successfully conquered the English territories in Western France and brought down the Angevin Empire. His victory at the Battle of Bouvines against the coalition of England and the Holy Roman Empire led to the dethroning of Emperor Otto IV, while King John of England was forced to negotiate with his nobles, and thus sign the Magna Carta. He also reorganized the government, bringing financial stability to the country and thus making possible a sharp increase in prosperity.

My runner up is Cardinal Richelieu. A brilliant statesman who controlled a large part of the government under Louis XIII. He broke the power of the turbulent nobles, and united the country under the monarchy, and thus prepared the way for the rule of Louis XIV.

Germany - My top choice is Otto I. Otto sought to increase the Crown’s authority by curbing the power of the aristocracy and the Church. He faced several rebellions, including those led by the Duke of Bavaria and the Duke of Franconia, but managed to to crush them. He established himself as the sole master of Germany and successfully united West Francia and East Francia through strategic marriages. Otto also ended the Slavic threat in the North and halted the Pagan Hungarian invasions of Europe. He expanded into Italy, uniting it with Germany, and was crowned Holy Roman Emperor by Pope John XII. His reign also saw the beginning of the Ottonian renaissance.

My runner up is... Bismarck.

Greece - My top choice is Peisistratos. Peisistratos was an Athenian tyrant and one of the first populists, who dominated the Athenian political stage during the 5th century. Herodotus describes how Peisistratos absurdly managed to take power 3 times through pretty ridiculous coups. Not sure how true these are, but I find them pretty funny. Anyways, one of his greatest achievement was transforming the economy by introducing loans for farmers and encouraging them to grow cash crops. He is also credited with holding the first Panathenaic Games.

My runner up is Alexander the great, because Macedon should not be a separate civ from Greece. :(

Indo-Aryans - I support splitting up India. Not sure what to call this Civ, but it is supposed to represent the Northern Indo-Aryan part of India.

My top choice is Samudragupta. This guy is actually the perfect Civ leader. He is depicted on coins as a muscular warrior flaunting his scars, as well as playing the Veena. He was called the "exterminator of all kings" and is credited with successfully repelling foreign invasions, including defeating the Shakas, the Murundas, and the Kalingas. According to the Allahabad Pillar inscription, he exterminated 9 monarchs and subjugated 12 kings which resulted in an empire extending from the Himalayas in the north to the Deccan in the south, and from the Brahmaputra River in the east to the Yamuna River in the west. Samudragupta was also a great patron of art, architecture and music. He has been described in inscriptions as Kaviraja, or the "King of Poets" for his many poetical compositions.

My runner up is Shivaji. Shivaji was the founder of the Maratha Empire. Shivaji carved out an enclave from the declining Adilshahi sultanate of Bijapur which eventually became the genesis of the Maratha Empire. He revived Hindu political traditions and promoted the use of Marathi and Sanskrit languages

Kannadiga - My top choice is Krishnadevaraya. He defeated the five deccan sultanates, the Reddys of Kondavidu, the Velamas of Bhuvanagiri and the Gajapati dynasty of Kalinga. He was also renowned for patronizing poets and for inscribing languages in Sanskrit, Tamil, Kannada, and Telugu. Krishna Deva Raya was a polyglot himself, fluent in Sanskrit, Tamil, Kannada, and Telugu.

My runner up is Amoghavarsha. Amoghavarsha I immediately set out to expand the Rashtrakuta kingdom. He defeated the Eastern Chalukyas and the Gangas, two powerful dynasties in South India. He also defeated the Pratiharas, a powerful dynasty in North India and gained control over parts of present-day Madhya Pradesh and Gujarat. He was also a patron of Kannada literature and is credited with sponsoring many poets, scholars, and artists during his reign.

Kanuri - My pick for the Sub-Saharan civ base game slot. My top pick for them is Idris Alooma. Idris was an outstanding statesman, and under his rule, the Kanem-Bornu touched the zenith of its power. He is remembered for his military skills, administrative reforms and Islamic piety. He also introduced a number of legal and administrative reforms based on his religious beliefs and Islamic law. He sponsored the construction of numerous mosques and made a pilgrimage to Mecca, where he arranged for the establishment of a hostel to be used by pilgrims from his empire. He also established diplomatic relations with the Ottomans to secure muskets and training to fight his enemies at home

My runner up is Dunama Dabbalemi. His reign is considered the pinnacle of the Sayfawa Kanem dynasty. Mai Dabbalemi expanded his army to approximately 40,000 horsemen, which he used to declare a Jihad against the southern tribes. He also assumed nominal control over the Fezzan region and greatly profited from the Saharan trade, using the proceeds to establish Madrassahs in Cairo for pilgrims en route to Mecca.

Japan - Japanese history ain't my forte. But Hōjō Masako seems like a very interesting person so she is my top choice.

My runner up is Okubo Toshimichi.

Maya - My top choice is Yuknoom Chʼeen II. Yuknoom Ch’een II was the ruler that brought Calakmul to its height. His reign was a period of intense conflict between Calakmul's arch rival Tikal, but Calakmul was able to get the upperhand and reinstated Balaj Chan Kʼawiil upon the throne of Dos Pilas as his vassal. Many major building programs also happened in Calakmul during Yuknoom's reign.

My runner up is to just bring back Pacal. He is the quintessential Maya leader.

Rome - My top choice is Vespasian. He maneuvered three imperial claimants and crushed two major revolts in Judea and Gaul during his first years. He also reformed Roman taxation, currency, military postings, and oversaw the expansion in Britain. Additionally, he undertook the rebuilding of Rome following Nero's Great Fire and initiated the construction of the Colosseum. Also I like his personality and his sense of humor.

My runner up is Aurelian. AVE TO THE RESTITVTOR ORBIS!

Russia - My top choice is Ivan III. Ivan III was the first Russian ruler to gain full independence from the Golden Horde. He tripled the territory of his state. And he also renovated the Moscow Kremlin and introduced a new legal codex and laid the foundations of the Russian state

My runner up is Ivan IV. The first tsar of all of Russia. Well he might be mad man, but he also transformed Russia into a powerful and centralized state, so definitely an interesting personality.

Turkish - My top choice is Murad II. Despite facing significant opposition from rival throne contenders, rebellious factions, and foreign adversaries, Murad successfully led wars that expanded Ottoman territory and secured key strategic positions, notably capturing Thessaloniki in 1430 and winning the Battle of Varna in 1444, thereby strengthening Ottoman control in the Balkans.

My second choice is actually Selim I. He conquered the Mamluks, thus bringing Syria, Egypt, Hejaz, and Palestine under Ottoman rule. This also brought the esteemed title of Caliph under Ottoman authority. He was also known for his harsh manner and firm leadership, Selim I laid the groundwork for administrative changes to manage the empire’s expanding territories.

But honestly tho, they should just bring back Mehmed II. He has only been in one iteration of civ.
 
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Okay, here's my more in depth wishlist. It should have a more detailed reasoning for why I am picking certain leaders. I will try to provide two leader options; my top pick, and my "runner up". This list is only for the base game, but I might make another list containing the civs I want for the first DLC later. Now prepare yourself for the wall of text:

Arabia - My top choice is Abd al-Malik ibn Marwan. The second fitna revealed the unprecedented level of division within the Caliphate, divisions which only grew as the civil conflict ground on for a decade. Under Abd al-Malik's leadership, the Umayyads managed to slowly grow their power until they found themselves in a position to challenge for the umma’s leadership once again. Abd al-Malik's adept handling of the second fitna revealed him to be a shrewd mover and shaker with a disposition suitable for leadership. He did more than emulate those who came before him, he enacted changes that pushed the caliphate further into statehood and away from its roots as a tribal confederacy, cementing his family’s supremacy in the process

My runner up is al-Mu'tadid. This energetic Caliph personally led his armies and succeeded in restoring the Abbasid Caliphate to its former glory. He was even able to effectively diminish his adversaries, often without even resorting to open conflict. Generally, he is portrayed as an exemplary caliph. Although likely embellished by propaganda, it's evident that his leadership provided much-needed stability to the caliphate after the turbulent anarchy at Samarra. He also renewed caliphal sponsorship of scholars and scientists.

Assyria - My pick for the ancient Mesopotamia base game spot. My top pick is Sennacherib. He is probably most famous for the failed siege to Jerusalem and making king Hezekiah confined "like a bird in a cage." Sennacherib also waged successful campaigns against Elam and squashed many revolts. He is also responsible for rebuilding the city of Nineveh.

My runner up is Tiglath-Pileser III. Succeeded in extending Assyrian domination over vast territories. He crushed an Aramean coalition, conquered the northern half of Babylonia, including the city itself and became the first Assyrian king of Babylon.

Burma - My top choice is Alaungpaya. Alaungpaya was one the three greatest kings of Burma, and the founder of the Konbaung dynasty. The mid 1700s were a period of turmoil in Burma, Binnya Dala led a Mon revolt, and took Ava from the declining Toungoo dynasty. Alaungpaya resisted, established Moksobomyo as his capital, reclaimed Ava, and founded the Konbaung dynasty. He also forced the French and the British out, and unified the country.

My runner up is Bayinnaung. Bayinnaung was a powerful ruler of the Taungoo dynasty in Myanmar. He quelled the revolting Mons, and expanded his kingdom by conquering the Shan States and Siam, making Myanmar a dominant power in Southeast Asia. He was also a patron of Buddhism, generously supporting monasteries, and building pagodas.

China - My top choice is Taizu of Song. Honestly, I just want a Song emperor. He pulled off what is probably the most peaceful coup in history and reunited most of China after the era of warlords. He was a patron the arts, sciences and economics.

My runner up is Han Wudi. Emperor Wudi is renowned for his significant contributions to China’s expansion and cultural development. He successfully repelled threats from the north, introduced the Silk Road, and established Confucianism as the state "religion". His reign was marked by military conquests, territorial expansions, and efforts to unify the diverse cultures within the empire.

Egypt - Due to Egypt only having a limited amount of 3000 years of history, we unfortunately have to put the Greek lady back in charge. /s.

On a more serious note, my top choice is Hatshepsut. Ruling first as regent for, then as co-ruler with, her nephew Thutmose III, Hatshepsut enjoyed a relatively peaceful reign, at the beginning of the New Kingdom. She restored monuments destroyed during the disruptive Second Intermediate Period. She renewed trade with western Asia to the east, the far-off land of Punt to the south, and the Aegean Islands to the north. But honestly, I wouldn't even mind Sobekneferu or Nefertiti.

My runner up is Mentuhotep II. He is revered by as the guy who reunited Egypt after the era of disunity (the First Intermediate Period) that followed the end of the Old Kingdom. He also initiated a number of building projects, including in the areas of el-Kab, Gebelein, Tod, Deir el-Ballas, Dendera, Karnak, Abydos, Aswan and Armant. His greatest building work was his temple and tomb on the west bank at Thebes.

England - My top choice is Edward I Longshanks. He reformed the laws so every man got a fair trial, defeated De Montfort and ended the period of civil war inherited from his father, limited the powers of the feudal lords, prevented war between France and Spain, reformed parliament so they met regularly. He also conquered Wales and built some cool looking castles.

My runner up is Henry II. Fixed a lot of problems following the destructive civil war between his mother and king Stephen. He also significantly reformed the law and the financial system (father of common law).

Ethiopia - My top choice is Ezana. He was the first Ethiopian king to convert to Christianity (thanks to the monk Frumentius from Roman Syria) and was a prolific builder judging by his monumental obelisks, stelae, and thrones. Ezana also launched several military campaigns including the Kuhorsehockyes. Ezana is remembered for laying the foundation of the Ethiopian Empire and ensuring Axum remained a major power in East Africa.

My runner up is Lalibela. Legend has it that Lalibela is said to have seen a vision in Jerusalem that instructed him to build a new Jerusalem in Ethiopia as a response to Saladin's recapture of the city in 1187. Lalibela would go on to construct 11 complex monolithic churches.

France - My top choice is Philip II. He successfully conquered the English territories in Western France and brought down the Angevin Empire. His victory at the Battle of Bouvines against the coalition of England and the Holy Roman Empire led to the dethroning of Emperor Otto IV, while King John of England was forced to negotiate with his nobles, and thus sign the Magna Carta. He also reorganized the government, bringing financial stability to the country and thus making possible a sharp increase in prosperity.

My runner up is Cardinal Richelieu. A brilliant statesman who controlled a large part of the government under Louis XIII. He broke the power of the turbulent nobles, and united the country under the monarchy, and thus prepared the way for the rule of Louis XIV.

Germany - My top choice is Otto I. Otto sought to increase the Crown’s authority by curbing the power of the aristocracy and the Church. He faced several rebellions, including those led by the Duke of Bavaria and the Duke of Franconia, but managed to to crush them. He established himself as the sole master of Germany and successfully united West Francia and East Francia through strategic marriages. Otto also ended the Slavic threat in the North and halted the Pagan Hungarian invasions of Europe. He expanded into Italy, uniting it with Germany, and was crowned Holy Roman Emperor by Pope John XII. His reign also saw the beginning of the Ottonian renaissance.

My runner up is... Bismarck.

Greece - My top choice is Peisistratos. Peisistratos was an Athenian tyrant and one of the first populists, who dominated the Athenian political stage during the 5th century. Herodotus describes how Peisistratos absurdly managed to take power 3 times through pretty ridiculous coups. Not sure how true these are, but I find them pretty funny. Anyways, one of his greatest achievement was transforming the economy by introducing loans for farmers and encouraging them to grow cash crops. He is also credited with holding the first Panathenaic Games.

My runner up is Alexander the great, because Macedon should not be a separate civ from Greece. :(

Indo-Aryans - I support splitting up India. Not sure what to call this Civ, but it is supposed to represent the Northern Indo-Aryan part of India.

My top choice is Samudragupta. This guy is actually the perfect Civ leader. He is depicted on coins as a muscular warrior flaunting his scars, as well as playing the Veena. He was called the "exterminator of all kings" and is credited with successfully repelling foreign invasions, including defeating the Shakas, the Murundas, and the Kalingas. According to the Allahabad Pillar inscription, he exterminated 9 monarchs and subjugated 12 kings which resulted in an empire extending from the Himalayas in the north to the Deccan in the south, and from the Brahmaputra River in the east to the Yamuna River in the west. Samudragupta was also a great patron of art, architecture and music. He has been described in inscriptions as Kaviraja, or the "King of Poets" for his many poetical compositions.

My runner up is Shivaji. Shivaji was the founder of the Maratha Empire. Shivaji carved out an enclave from the declining Adilshahi sultanate of Bijapur which eventually became the genesis of the Maratha Empire. He revived Hindu political traditions and promoted the use of Marathi and Sanskrit languages

Kannadiga - My top choice is Krishnadevaraya. He defeated the five deccan sultanates, the Reddys of Kondavidu, the Velamas of Bhuvanagiri and the Gajapati dynasty of Kalinga. He was also renowned for patronizing poets and for inscribing languages in Sanskrit, Tamil, Kannada, and Telugu. Krishna Deva Raya was a polyglot himself, fluent in Sanskrit, Tamil, Kannada, and Telugu.

My runner up is Amoghavarsha. Amoghavarsha I immediately set out to expand the Rashtrakuta kingdom. He defeated the Eastern Chalukyas and the Gangas, two powerful dynasties in South India. He also defeated the Pratiharas, a powerful dynasty in North India and gained control over parts of present-day Madhya Pradesh and Gujarat. He was also a patron of Kannada literature and is credited with sponsoring many poets, scholars, and artists during his reign.

Kanuri - My pick for an Sub-Saharan civ. My top pick for them is Idris Alooma. Idris was an outstanding statesman, and under his rule, the Kanem-Bornu touched the zenith of its power. He is remembered for his military skills, administrative reforms and Islamic piety. He also introduced a number of legal and administrative reforms based on his religious beliefs and Islamic law. He sponsored the construction of numerous mosques and made a pilgrimage to Mecca, where he arranged for the establishment of a hostel to be used by pilgrims from his empire. He also established diplomatic relations with the Ottomans to secure muskets and training to fight his enemies at home

My runner up is Dunama Dabbalemi. His reign is considered the pinnacle of the Sayfawa Kanem dynasty. Mai Dabbalemi expanded his army to approximately 40,000 horsemen, which he used to declare a Jihad against the southern tribes. He also assumed nominal control over the Fezzan region and greatly profited from the Saharan trade, using the proceeds to establish Madrassahs in Cairo for pilgrims en route to Mecca.

Japan - Japanese history ain't my forte. But Hōjō Masako seems like a very interesting person so she is my top choice.

My runner up is Minamoto no Yoritomo.

Maya - My top choice is Yuknoom Chʼeen II. Yuknoom Ch’een II was the ruler that brought Calakmul to its height. His reign was a period of intense conflict between Calakmul's arch rival Tikal, but Calakmul was able to get the upperhand and reinstated Balaj Chan Kʼawiil upon the throne of Dos Pilas as his vassal. Many major building programs also happened in Calakmul during Yuknoom's reign.

My runner up is to just bring back Pacal. He is the quintessential Maya leader.

Rome - My top choice is Vespasian. He maneuvered three imperial claimants and crushed two major revolts in Judea and Gaul during his first years. He also reformed Roman taxation, currency, military postings, and oversaw the expansion in Britain. Additionally, he undertook the rebuilding of Rome following Nero's Great Fire and initiated the construction of the Colosseum. Also I like his personality and his sense of humor.

My runner up is Aurelian. AVE TO THE RESTITVTOR ORBIS!

Russia - My top choice is Ivan III. Ivan III was the first Russian ruler to gain full independence from the Golden Horde. He tripled the territory of his state. And he also renovated the Moscow Kremlin and introduced a new legal codex and laid the foundations of the Russian state

My runner up is Ivan IV. The first tsar of all of Russia. Well he might be mad man, but he also transformed Russia into a powerful and centralized state, so definitely an interesting personality.

Turkish - My top choice is Murad II. Despite facing significant opposition from rival throne contenders, rebellious factions, and foreign adversaries, Murad successfully led wars that expanded Ottoman territory and secured key strategic positions, notably capturing Thessaloniki in 1430 and winning the Battle of Varna in 1444, thereby strengthening Ottoman control in the Balkans.

My second choice is actually Selim I. He conquered the Mamluks, thus bringing Syria, Egypt, Hejaz, and Palestine under Ottoman rule. This also brought the esteemed title of Caliph under Ottoman authority. He was also known for his harsh manner and firm leadership, Selim I laid the groundwork for administrative changes to manage the empire’s expanding territories.

But honestly tho, they should just bring back Mehmed II. He has only been in one iteration of civ.
I too desire a medieval English leader. 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿

What if... They had England and the UK as separate Civs hehehe

Cardinal Richelieu would be amazing for a colonialist France, something we haven't really had in Civ so far. Interestingly, compared to the English and the Spaniards the French were much more peaceful and trade-oriented when it came to their relations with New World natives. 🇫🇷
 
Because you get people like the other weirdo I quoted above who think it's all about how they personally feel about a given leader, and not how historically significant they were.

That much is proven by their rehabilitating of Stalin, an objectively abhorrent individual, but not of Hitler, who cannot be said to be substantially worst than other leaders who also engaged in genocide and a plethora of other fun activities like flaying and human sacrifice.

There's too much moral hangups for 20th century.
Atilla the Hun, Alexander The Great, Napolean, Queen Victoria. None of these got their fame by selling flowers. And I don't see how it's fair that these are in the game and the likes of Castro( a character tailor-made for this game), and Khruschev(my choice for leader of Russia) are left out. I don't pick these leaders because they're my favorite people. I certainly have plenty of issues with both Ike and JFK. But if we can stomach the Austrian Painter in the game, then we can counter with some others. Just no Nixon please.
 
Yeah well Philip II attacked my ancestors too. Still not going to complain about him being part of Civ VI.

Again, the Spanish Inquisition was less likely to judge you guilty when you were innocent than existing law practices at the time. Is it barbaric compared to modern times? Sure! But it literally provided more protections for prosecuted people than they had before it. If the Spanish Inquisition hadn't existed to attack your ancestors, then some random lord would've sentenced them to death because no one was stopping him. At least the Spanish Inquisition was acquainted with the concept of gathering evidence.
True on that.
I apologize if I did anything wrong. I watched the video again and yeah you were true on that part, but we still can't forget the lives lost due to the Inquisition.
As much as I'm not a fan of Phillip II, I'm still fine with him being in VI, at least he's better than Qin Shi Huang, who shouldn't even have appeared.

________________________________
Good. Then I hope they use Rommel and General Lee as Great Generals, because the fanbase does NOT need people like you who want their fee-fees to be prioritized over history.
I'm not trying to prioritize anything. The Confederate States of America, Soviet Union, Nazi Germany, and many other abominable tyrannical states do NOT deserve to be added to the Civilization franchise. Also you can do other modern generals, like my boy William Tecumseh Sherman.
You think Montezuma was choir boy?
Dawg did I ever say that??? I personally am not that fond of Montezuma
Get out of here with your woke nonsense.
I take that title as a badge of honor so thank you.
What a ridiculous person you are.
I'm sorry, what? Only my ex gets to call me "ridiculous", and some of my former friends too I guess. Kinda deserve that title, but that's off topic.

Please stop putting words in my mouth Acepox

Moderator Action: Please report offensive posts instead of answering them, part of this post deleted. Answering them is trolling. leif
 
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