Conquests of Might and Magic III

[stachnie]

I seem to remember the neutral units in Heroes being no pushover at the beginning either.

You are right - but neutrals that randomly appeared at the beginning of creature weeks (so a bit similar to randomly spawned Barbarians) were rather weak - IIRC about 2 basic week growths in town. Neutrals guarding basic mines (Wood, Ore) also were weak - usually player could capture them in the first week. From the other hand, Neutrals guarding important resources, passes etc. in scenarios/campaigns should be strong.

Perhaps the hapless scout could be removed, and exploring left in the hands of level-one units?

The problem is that races with cheap but weak level 1 units (especially Cornflux and Inferno, perhaps also Necropolis and Neutrals) are vulnerable to an early attack from other race or even Barbarians. tom2050 tried to solve that problem by giving initial Worker some HP and a good def. but the result is that it applies to all captured Workers (so it is not possible to recapture them, only destroy).

Other way - and maybe better - to give all Races some early defensive unit would be to make Scouts more expensive but give them some def. (perhaps 3 would be enough).


Best regards,

Slawomir Stachniewicz.

 

[jermungand]

When Civ 5 comes out, you could effectively recreate HoMM battlefield tactics directly onto the hexagonal world map itself. With some care you may be able to deliver both parts of HoMM gameplay, rolled together into one for a reproduction of Heroes that is highly original yet exceptionally faithful at the same time.

 

[Thunderfall]

Very nice! Keep up the good work!

 

[smirnoff]

Hi Tom , i m just wonder do u still work the scenarios ?or is been out

 

[tom2050]

Bug in Tower: their cities may build more than one Golem Factory. One is available with Lvl3 (as expected), next ones with Lvl6 and Lvl5 upg. (I have discovered all creature techs apart from upgrades for levels 6 and 7). I have no idea if extra buildings produce extra Golems.

Fixed, the other Golem Factories were meant for the Neutral Civ. I had them in as Bracada (Tower) by accident. I'll try to get an update out here soon, but am waiting to try to get some other things worked out.

Some spells that enslave units may be overpowered. Magic tombs: strong, but IMHO nothing gamebreaking (Magic Arrows are not very strong anyway). Disguise: good if you have a good unupgraded lvl2 unit. Has its uses but no great deal. Resurrection: I think it is overpowered. When properly used (attack redlined or low HP, low Defence units only) you may have dozens of unupgraded lvl 7 units with no maintenance just after you discovered the right tech (if you have enough money, of course).

Noted. Disguise has no real use to the AI, the only thing it might be good for is MP, but no MP exists right now. I included it, but I might just take some of the spells out that cannot function in any real way.

With Resurrection, perhaps adding maintenance and / or lowering the attack. I know the AI doesn't do near as well with such units.

I will go through these and see what I can do.

Edit2: it seems that Shipyards do not serve as trade hubs, at least over ocean. I have captured AI city at the second continent, rushed a Shipyard and it does not provide access to resources from the home continent, where most of my coastal cities have shipyards.

WIll be fixed in next update.

Edit 3: this game also hanged, after turn 255. I doubt it was due to the unit limit, as a few turns before I had disbanded almost all Gremlins and Master Gremlins. I started a new game as Dungeon, at Proven.

I will try to figure out why the hang is happening, it's possible that it is the settler issue. For some reasons, mods with more than 1 settler hang because if a civ is destroyed, and they have a settler in a boat somewhere, it hangs.

I could possibly get rid of all settler units and leave just 1 generic settler (the others are used solely for graphical purposes). I don't believe the game has ever had this problem with only 1 settler in regular games. I will talk to some others about this and see what they say.

E4it 4: resurrected units are King ones - is this by design?

It was the only way to make resurrected units not able to be built, but able to be upgraded to.

 

[tom2050]

As some people already noticed, Scouts (and other units) spawn Barbarians much too often, so Scouts get killed very easily. A few possible workarounds:

- give all civs Expansionist trait (already mentioned by tom2050)
- give Scouts move 1, ATAR (ATAR units do not spawn barbarians)
- give Scouts some Defence (like initial Worker and captured Workers).

In unmoded game huts within a city radius never spawned spawned Barbarians, now they often do.

In general, I think Barbarians are too strong. They are not a problem for Civs with good defensive lvl 1 units (especially Fortress and Castle) but they may be a big problem for Cornflux (Pixies) and Neutrals (their Settlers are often guarded by Peasants). Maybe basic Barbarian unit should be weaker and slower? Peasants would be too weak, but maybe Halflings?

You know, that didn't use to happen either. Something changed where Barbs started spawning when a city expands. In fact, I don't think it is supposed to EVER happen. I actually think something got bugged up somehow. I gave scouts move of 3 and ignore all terrain to be able to avoid barbs. Perhaps a def of 1 could help out.

I didn't know ATAR units do not spawn barbs ! Perhaps that may work!

Neutral civ can build both Peasants and Halflings from the start (in update at least) since Peasants are too weak to start with.

Tom, mixing Heores and Civ is like making crack. This is the most fun mod I've played yet for Civ, and considering how good some of the mods around here are, that's quite a feat.

As far as the barbarians go, I like them powerful as they are now. I seem to remember the neutral units in Heroes being no pushover at the beginning either. Perhaps the hapless scout could be removed, and exploring left in the hands of level-one units?

Keep up the good work; I'm looking forward to your updates.

AI never builds scouts... I have yet to figure that one out. But they do explore the countryside with regular units, and the AI in a sense 'knows all' anyways, so this is okay.

I'm still in process of getting the bugs out of the game, so I can start getting scenarios done.

I agree with both points. I hardly ever use scouts and I like the barbs reasonably strong too.

For city placement locations around the edge of your empire are the only real use of scouts, and to perhaps grab resources. If they are made ATAR which does not spawn barbs, it might provide a bigger use for them, but would be similar to making all civs expansionist. I'll have to test it out.

The problem is that races with cheap but weak level 1 units (especially Cornflux and Inferno, perhaps also Necropolis and Neutrals) are vulnerable to an early attack from other race or even Barbarians. tom2050 tried to solve that problem by giving initial Worker some HP and a good def. but the result is that it applies to all captured Workers (so it is not possible to recapture them, only destroy).

Other way - and maybe better - to give all Races some early defensive unit would be to make Scouts more expensive but give them some def. (perhaps 3 would be enough).

I tried to make the difference in units somewhat more even by making less units cheaper, but with the way combat works, sometimes it doesn't make a huge difference. I think the Conflux is most in danger with only 2.2.2 units. I even added 1 hitpoint to help them out. Necropolis skeletons warriors at 6.6.1 may be too strong with an additional hitpoint though. (?) but they do seem to die often.

Scouts, 3 def, 1 move, ATAR. The AI should still build regular units since the AI would use them as exploration only. I don't know if the AI would actually defend cities with them unless they are given the defense strategy.

It's possible to give these Civ's (neutrals, conflux, etc) a special building early on that is cheap that boosts city defenses enough so they are more on even ground in early game.

When Civ 5 comes out, you could effectively recreate HoMM battlefield tactics directly onto the hexagonal world map itself. With some care you may be able to deliver both parts of HoMM gameplay, rolled together into one for a reproduction of Heroes that is highly original yet exceptionally faithful at the same time.

Perhaps, but I have no plans to stop work on this anytime soon. We'll see... but it's always best IMO to wait until the final versions of the game are completed sometimes before starting such a massive project. Also, we'll have to see what (if any) issues there are with mods and the Steam forced updates issues. But you are right, it does present some nice possibilities.

Very nice! Keep up the good work!

Thanks Thunderfall!

Hi Tom , i m just wonder do u still work the scenarios ?or is been out

I'm trying to get some of the gameplay issues smoothed out before I release the scenarios. 3 of them are already half-done actually. Homecoming, Guardian Angels, and Griffin Cliffs. There are some differences in the scenarios, such as Mountains and Forests are impassible to stick to the design of the maps. Most everything else is the same, so once gameplay gets to a more consistent state, I will start pumping out scenarios.

 

[stachnie]

I gave scouts move of 3 and ignore all terrain to be able to avoid barbs. Perhaps a def of 1 could help out.

Yes, it should - usually barbarians do not attack Pixies, but they ALWAYS go for an unit without defence.

I didn't know ATAR units do not spawn barbs ! Perhaps that may work!

At least they shouldn't:

Something changed where Barbs started spawning when a city expands

... the other rules also may have changed.

Neutral civ can build both Peasants and Halflings from the start (in update at least) since Peasants are too weak to start with.

Yes, I guess. I think AI builds Peasants because they allow a really FAST expansion (it applies also to Cornflux).

I think the Conflux is most in danger with only 2.2.2 units. I even added 1 hitpoint to help them out.

True - I have tried them at Proven and I had to restart the game a few times because AI's often attacked very early. An early attack from Castle (they ALWAYS did) is deadly.

I'm trying to get some of the gameplay issues smoothed out before I release the scenarios. [...] once gameplay gets to a more consistent state, I will start pumping out scenarios.

Good work!


Best regards,

Slawomir Stachniewicz.

 

[Lamabreeder]

Hi Tom!

Your scenario is great and a lot of fun! It is amazing how you translated the H3 game mechanics - a game I also love - into those of civ3, this is not a small feat! You did translate the attack and defense values of many H3 creatues directly into civ attack and defense values, didn't you? Also the incorporation of the graphics and music is perfect! Thank you for spending hundreds of hours making this great mod and sharing it!

I started several games and played one a bit longer (near day 200) in which I built a nice empire and successfully conquered my neighbor.

I noticed some things, however, which I want to feed-back to you.

First of all I have the impression the AI does not research and does not build the creature dwellings. This puts it at a deciding disadvantage IMHO. I mainly did not continue playing because I found it too easy (on expert) - certainly because of this. My tech advisor wanted me to research MAGIC, too, in the beginning, not a very wise choice. The AI seemed to follow this bad advice, though.

I suspect it might have something to do that from the viewpoint of the AI the magics are the best choices because they are in the most recent era. Only a wild guess. If it was true, however, then this could be solved by "simply" swapping the eras of magic and creature dwellings.

There is another possible approach to make creature dwellings available for the AI: Just remove the tech requirement from the buildings. Increase the shield cost for them instead, so that especially the higher level creature dwellings take a long time to complete. I suspect that you will not like this idea since you put already so much effort in the tech tree and all, but this approach will ensure that the AI has at least the possibility to build the essential creature dwellings.

If I remember correctly then you reported that the AI *did* build creature dwellings in your test games. In this case you can simply recreate the cicumstances under which it did.

Another thing: I personally like strong barbarians, but I do not like them to be invisible. Then they are just too random and evading them is just a matter of luck, not of skill. I did lose protected settlers and workers to those thieves, and I was playing fortress, meaning good defense, but not good enough to counter them, and bad offense, too bad to effectively remove barbarian camps (especially if the priorities are on expanding, not on fighting just now).

And yet another thing: Disease from marshes *really* sucks. So much, in fact, that I abandoned start positions in or near them - and I was playing fortress. You state in the Civilopedia that it was a minor inconvenience only since the probability was reduced to 5%. I don't know exactly what this number means, but I can tell you from experience, that in my one game where the majority of my fortresses lay in a giant swamp area I had disease on such a regular basis that it was *the* limiting factor for growth despite the bonus food - those damned cities never made it past size 8 (and yes, they had wells or access to fresh water), whereas they surely would have reached double the size or more (subjectively felt) were it not for the disease.

What about removing disease completely, but giving the swamp another disadvantage? The simplest idea would be to make swamp like all the other terrain, obviously. Other ideas would be to leave the food bonus but to penalize swamp in either shields (remove intrinsic shield and/or disallow mining) or trade (roads give only one instead of two trade) or both.

I, too, found the masses of creatures a little bit tedious in later turns. Perhaps removing the auto-building of creatures for the level 1 creature dwelling buildings would be a good idea.

Additionally, I do not think it is necessary to be able to build level 2 creatures directly. Level 1 creatures suffice in the start, for expanding and perhaps exploring, and then the auto-generated creatures take over.

One more thing, a very curious one: I was repeatedly not able to build the Capital Small Wonder (CSW) in my, well, capital city. I checked the .biq in the editor, but found nothing that would suggest this. Could it be a bug in Civ3? Or did I not see something? My capital had a city hall, of course, the required building for the CSW, and I was able to build the CSW in other cities.

And a last thing: I would really like if it were possible to achieve a peaceful victory (mainly because I like the occassional war but get tired quite quickly if I really have to conquer all and everyone). I think a diplomatic victory would not really be within the theme of H3 although I would certainly not oppose it; a modified spaceship victory sounds good to me. Some ideas: Aquiring the grail (I know, you already have built it in with a different role), defeating the Azure Dragon or another monster, voyage into the underworld/center of earth (okay, not totally H3), aquiring or (dis-)assembling Armageddon's Blade, Angelic Alliance or another artifact, completing research on a super-spell or whatever.

Once again let me thank you and congratulate you for this masterpiece of yours! I'm off now, playing COMM3.

 

[Andres12345]

Um,When i load the game it says something is missing,

 

[vmxa]

Could you give the text of the msg, maybe a screen shot?

 

[Andres12345]

I Cant be exact but it says

Missing Entry in "Conquests\COMM3\text\PediaIcons.txt":ICON_BLDG_Blacksmith

AUDIO

Note:Little newbie but how do you make a screen shot?

 

[tom2050]

I Cant be exact but it says

Missing Entry in "Conquests\COMM3\text\PediaIcons.txt":ICON_BLDG_Blacksmith

AUDIO

Note:Little newbie but how do you make a screen shot?

When you unzip or unrar the main file, the program often creates a duplicate folder.

Make sure that the folder COMM3 (which should be in your Civilization III/Conquests/Scenarios directory) does not contain another COMM3 directory inside, but it should have folders such as _EXTRA, Art, sounds, and Text.

If the COMM3 folder does include another COMM3 folder, then copy everything inside of the 2nd one (_EXTRA, Art, sounds, Text) and paste it into the first one. And it will work!

Let me know what happens, but this is the most common problem. Also, you are using Windows I assume? and not MAC?

 

[vmxa]

Many ways to get a screen shot. In Windows the Print key will capture the screen and you can then paste it from the clipboard to something like Paint.

Lots of free apps like Irafanview that can capture and save the screen or accept a print from the clipboard.

 

[Andres12345]

Woops ,i did it on The conquests\conquests let me see

Ok now it asks for more space,i got plenty,oh well,

 

[tom2050]

Your scenario is great and a lot of fun! It is amazing how you translated the H3 game mechanics - a game I also love - into those of civ3, this is not a small feat! You did translate the attack and defense values of many H3 creatues directly into civ attack and defense values, didn't you? Also the incorporation of the graphics and music is perfect! Thank you for spending hundreds of hours making this great mod and sharing it!

Yes, A/D translated over, hitpoints were allocated based on health of the unit; but hitpoints cannot translate to civ 3 as they were in HoMM3, they are too different. Damage in HoMM3 couldn't really be taken into account though; I couldn't find a way.

I started several games and played one a bit longer (near day 200) in which I built a nice empire and successfully conquered my neighbor.

I noticed some things, however, which I want to feed-back to you.

First of all I have the impression the AI does not research and does not build the creature dwellings. This puts it at a deciding disadvantage IMHO. I mainly did not continue playing because I found it too easy (on expert) - certainly because of this. My tech advisor wanted me to research MAGIC, too, in the beginning, not a very wise choice. The AI seemed to follow this bad advice, though.

The problem started because of limited culture groups (5). And there are 9 towns that need different graphics, so unfortunately the tech tree had to be 'split and seperated' in order to let all towns have their own city graphics. This brings about that bad side effect.

I am using Flavors to steer certain civ's into certain directions, but it is difficult to get working properly.

I suspect it might have something to do that from the viewpoint of the AI the magics are the best choices because they are in the most recent era. Only a wild guess. If it was true, however, then this could be solved by "simply" swapping the eras of magic and creature dwellings.

There is another possible approach to make creature dwellings available for the AI: Just remove the tech requirement from the buildings. Increase the shield cost for them instead, so that especially the higher level creature dwellings take a long time to complete. I suspect that you will not like this idea since you put already so much effort in the tech tree and all, but this approach will ensure that the AI has at least the possibility to build the essential creature dwellings.

I remember thinking about doing something like this, but didn't (for some reason). Although it is a perfectly viable solution! It would completely 100% solve the problem of civ's not able to build structures due to tech problems.... and would also have this benefit: Civ's would then have only Might and Magic (and other) tech's to discover.

It's possible these structures would be available very early though! So the game would be much more speedy! May provide some better possibilities though.

If I remember correctly then you reported that the AI *did* build creature dwellings in your test games. In this case you can simply recreate the cicumstances under which it did.

Before, the AI did go for all creatures, and as I found out, they ignored all other tech's. Although Flavors do 'steer' civ's into certain directions, I believe AI still takes what each tech makes available into account, therefore not really truly steering the AI as is set in the editor.

Another thing: I personally like strong barbarians, but I do not like them to be invisible. Then they are just too random and evading them is just a matter of luck, not of skill. I did lose protected settlers and workers to those thieves, and I was playing fortress, meaning good defense, but not good enough to counter them, and bad offense, too bad to effectively remove barbarian camps (especially if the priorities are on expanding, not on fighting just now).

I pretty much agree (and always have), I struggle with what to replace the Rogue with. I could make the Barbarian Rogue visible. Workers and Settlers and Scouts can see invisible units, but due to their 2 movement speed, it is often too late. I will keep it in mind and make a change here.

Although challenging in a way, it is more of an 'annoying challenge'.

And yet another thing: Disease from marshes *really* sucks.

Initially, I was trying to make Fortress Immune to disease, and set it low for everyone else, but this impossible to do in Civ 3! So I might just remove it. And I can do something along the lines you mentioned of giving swamp another disadvantage.

I, too, found the masses of creatures a little bit tedious in later turns. Perhaps removing the auto-building of creatures for the level 1 creature dwelling buildings would be a good idea.

Additionally, I do not think it is necessary to be able to build level 2 creatures directly. Level 1 creatures suffice in the start, for expanding and perhaps exploring, and then the auto-generated creatures take over.

Well, if I decide to make creature buildings able to be built without tech research; then there would be no need to be able to build level 2 directly... since creature structures would pop up pretty quickly!

Only problem with removing the level 1 dwellings, is that they are required (as were in HoMM3) to build higher level dwellings! Perhaps I can make them auto-produce much less often since the level 1's can be built.

One more thing, a very curious one: I was repeatedly not able to build the Capital Small Wonder (CSW) in my, well, capital city. I checked the .biq in the editor, but found nothing that would suggest this. Could it be a bug in Civ3? Or did I not see something? My capital had a city hall, of course, the required building for the CSW, and I was able to build the CSW in other cities.

I believe the Capital requires several (5) City Halls to be built before it becomes available. I'm pretty sure I added a {Requires}: statement in the civilopedia.

And a last thing: I would really like if it were possible to achieve a peaceful victory (mainly because I like the occassional war but get tired quite quickly if I really have to conquer all and everyone). I think a diplomatic victory would not really be within the theme of H3 although I would certainly not oppose it; a modified spaceship victory sounds good to me. Some ideas: Aquiring the grail (I know, you already have built it in with a different role), defeating the Azure Dragon or another monster, voyage into the underworld/center of earth (okay, not totally H3), aquiring or (dis-)assembling Armageddon's Blade, Angelic Alliance or another artifact, completing research on a super-spell or whatever.

Diplomatic victory in Civ 3 is kind of strange though... it can end the game abruptly if a leader is elected IIRC. I had it in, but then removed it. I suppose I can put it in, since player can decide if they wish to play Diplo victory or not.

Due to the resource limit (strategic) of 32 (or the resource bug hits), the epic game is stuck on not being able to implement other strategies using resources.

But I do plan on making actually scenarios, in which 3 are partially completed now. Rest of Erathia, Arm Blade, and Shad of Death. Hopefully I can get them going soon, once I straighten out the main epic BIQ.

 

[tom2050]

Woops ,i did it on The conquests\conquests let me see

Ok now it asks for more space,i got plenty,oh well,

I believe it will work in Conquests/Conquests also. Just make sure the COMM3 directory doesn't have another COMM3 directory inside of it. It should have the other folders I mentioned. Keep us updated!

 

[DFBATTLER]

Downloading, will report back with bug report if there will be a need for one.

 

[DFBATTLER]

Just got it and noticed that Catherine Ironheart really should be Ironfist.

 

[DFBATTLER]

Armageddon pedia entries: the range of a Tac Nuke is 7/10 squares - needs to be fixed to The range of an Armageddon spell is 7/10 squares.

 

[DFBATTLER]

The Aurora Borealis provides your army with every turns. Fill in the blanks?

Sorry for super multi posting btw.