CP and CBP - Complete Changelog

Gazebo

Lord of the Community Patch
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I've tried it, it's good. When you make it work with CPP are you going to use sukritact's Decisions screen/menu or are you going to use CEP's menu for the choices?

I'll use sukritact's Events for everything. The modularity means that my esteemed team of creative minds can start designing decisions for it. I'm not going to incorporate the 'Decisions' bit, as I don't really feel like it adds that much to the game. Feel free to yell at me about this, however, and I might change my mind.
G
 

Crimson13

Prince
Joined
Jul 11, 2012
Messages
373
Eh, wait and see. When the that comes out I'll determine whether or not to nag at you, haha.

Another thing I wanted to ask (And didn't come up until I played a bit.) is what's going to be done with the new Bison and Cocoa resources that got added. As it is I don't think both have buildings that improve them. Bison could be treated similar to Deer and Cocoa to Bananas; Bison being a camp improvement via grassland and plains and Cocoa being the same as Bananas via only showing up in Jungles.

I guess you could add Bison to buildings that improve Deer as well, one thing I found that looked good was something I found in reddit (Copy-pasted.):

Hunting Cabin:
Unlocks with Trapping
-1 gold maintenance
+1 food
Gives +1 food for Deer and Bison resources.
Requires at least 1 improved source of Deer or Bison.

It doesn't have to be this, but I thought it interesting. As for Cocoa, I'd say (And I hate to feel like broken record on this, sorry if I'm irritating.) allow plantations without removing the Jungle tiles like CEP Bananas.
 

skodkim

Deity
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Jan 16, 2004
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Denmark
I don't know if it's supposed to be this way but the UB versions of the temple (Mud Pyramid Mosque and Burial Tomb) do not give Faith from incense or wine.

Edit: And they still require a shrine (which I consider a rather serious nerf to them compared to the standard temple).

\Skodkim
 

Gazebo

Lord of the Community Patch
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I don't know if it's supposed to be this way but the UB versions of the temple (Mud Pyramid Mosque and Burial Tomb) do not give Faith from incense or wine.

Edit: And they still require a shrine (which I consider a rather serious nerf to them compared to the standard temple).

\Skodkim

That's a bug – I'll address this in the next version (I figured I missed a few changes).

It doesn't have to be this, but I thought it interesting. As for Cocoa, I'd say (And I hate to feel like broken record on this, sorry if I'm irritating.) allow plantations without removing the Jungle tiles like CEP Bananas.

I think adding Bison to the Granary or Stable makes sense, at least from a functional standpoint. Probably the Granary, though, as the Stable has a lot of changes already (and Bison were more a source of food than production, historically).

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Lord Tirian

Erratic Poster
Joined
Nov 30, 2007
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Liverpool, UK
The changelog is missing the food depletion through settlers (whenever a settler is built, it empties out all the stored food).

Additionally... could we either get rid of it or at least get an option to turn that off?

I find it super annoying as it just encourages micromanaging (i.e. build your settlers right after a pop growth), is not even consistent (why does a settler "eat" different amounts of food) and can lead to situations where you get sudden starvations (finish settler, barbarian blockades your city, instant population loss - yay!). Reeks of bad design, to me.
 

Gazebo

Lord of the Community Patch
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The changelog is missing the food depletion through settlers (whenever a settler is built, it empties out all the stored food).

Additionally... could we either get rid of it or at least get an option to turn that off?

I find it super annoying as it just encourages micromanaging (i.e. build your settlers right after a pop growth), is not even consistent (why does a settler "eat" different amounts of food) and can lead to situations where you get sudden starvations (finish settler, barbarian blockades your city, instant population loss - yay!). Reeks of bad design, to me.

I'm also not a big fan. I'm probably going to just disable it entirely.

Edit: You can turn it off, by the way. Go to CBP/Core Files/Core Changes/CommunityPatchDllChanges.sql and navigate to MOD_BALANCE_CORE_SETTLER_RESET_FOOD. Set the value to zero and it should be disabled. This is not save compatible.

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skodkim

Deity
Joined
Jan 16, 2004
Messages
2,373
Location
Denmark
I'm also not a big fan. I'm probably going to just disable it entirely.

Edit: You can turn it off, by the way. Go to CBP/Core Files/Core Changes/CommunityPatchDllChanges.sql and navigate to MOD_BALANCE_CORE_SETTLER_RESET_FOOD. Set the value to zero and it should be disabled. This is not save compatible.

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Tried this with 11.1/65.1 and it didn't work for me. I started a new game after changing the value and checked to database to confirm it was to to "0".

\Skodkim
 

Deluxe

Warlord
Joined
Mar 3, 2013
Messages
249
I supposed this could help to see what change with CPP before installing :).

However that supposes that this thread is kept up-to-date, that's not always easy (my 1000 pages design documents agrees with this statement).
 

Valvts

A Plant
Joined
Sep 20, 2014
Messages
372
So I checked the xml sql files of the founder beliefs to get the exact number, here is the data:

"-- Hero Worship: Unlocks Great Altar National Wonder Receive Faith and Golden Age points when you conquer a City. Bonus scales with City population and Era."

+20 Faith and Golden Ages Points after conquering a city, scales with eras.


"-- Ceremonial Burial: Unlocks Mausoleum National Wonder Receive Faith and Culture whenever a Great Person is expended. Bonus scales with Era."

+50 Faith and Culture whenever a Great Person is expended, scales with eras.


"-- Holy Law: Unlocks Divine Court National Wonder. Receive Faith, Science, and Gold when you purchase a Policy. Bonus scales with Era."

+ 50 Faith, Gold and Science when you purchase a Policy, scales with eras.


"-- Way of the Pilgrim: Unlocks Reliquary National Wonder. Receive Tourism when you spread your Religion to foreign cities. Bonus scales with Era."

+ 20 Tourism when you spread your Religion to foreign cities, scales with era.


"-- Path of Transcendence: Unlocks Sacred Garden National Wonder. Receive a large boost to all national yields when you enter a new Era. Bonus scales with Era."

+ 400 Faith, Gold, Science and Culture when entering a new era, scales with eras.


"-- Council of Elders: Unlocks Holy Council National Wonder. Receive a boost to current Science research when a city adopts your Religion. Bonus scales with Era."

+ 40 Science when a city adopts your Religion, scales with eras.


"-- Apostolic Tradition: Unlocks Apostolic Palace National Wonder. Receive Golden Age points when you spread your Religion to cities other than your Holy City. Bonus scales with Era."

+ 30 Golden Ages Points when you spread your Religion to cities other then your Holy City, scales with eras.


My only question is how does all these scale with eras? Does each new era multiply the bonuses by 2? Thanks!
 

Gazebo

Lord of the Community Patch
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So I checked the xml sql files of the founder beliefs to get the exact number, here is the data:

"-- Hero Worship: Unlocks Great Altar National Wonder Receive Faith and Golden Age points when you conquer a City. Bonus scales with City population and Era."

+20 Faith and Golden Ages Points after conquering a city, scales with eras.


"-- Ceremonial Burial: Unlocks Mausoleum National Wonder Receive Faith and Culture whenever a Great Person is expended. Bonus scales with Era."

+50 Faith and Culture whenever a Great Person is expended, scales with eras.


"-- Holy Law: Unlocks Divine Court National Wonder. Receive Faith, Science, and Gold when you purchase a Policy. Bonus scales with Era."

+ 50 Faith, Gold and Science when you purchase a Policy, scales with eras.


"-- Way of the Pilgrim: Unlocks Reliquary National Wonder. Receive Tourism when you spread your Religion to foreign cities. Bonus scales with Era."

+ 20 Tourism when you spread your Religion to foreign cities, scales with era.


"-- Path of Transcendence: Unlocks Sacred Garden National Wonder. Receive a large boost to all national yields when you enter a new Era. Bonus scales with Era."

+ 400 Faith, Gold, Science and Culture when entering a new era, scales with eras.


"-- Council of Elders: Unlocks Holy Council National Wonder. Receive a boost to current Science research when a city adopts your Religion. Bonus scales with Era."

+ 40 Science when a city adopts your Religion, scales with eras.


"-- Apostolic Tradition: Unlocks Apostolic Palace National Wonder. Receive Golden Age points when you spread your Religion to cities other than your Holy City. Bonus scales with Era."

+ 30 Golden Ages Points when you spread your Religion to cities other then your Holy City, scales with eras.


My only question is how does all these scale with eras? Does each new era multiply the bonuses by 2? Thanks!

Each era multiplies the value by its era value. So classical is 1, medieval is 2, and so on.

G
 

Shalvan

Warlord
Joined
Feb 24, 2013
Messages
133
Hm, there is no way you could unlock 8 social policies in one era. Path of Transcendence seems much stronger than Holy Law. Similarly Ceremonial Burial, 8 GPs is not likely in one era.
 

Deluxe

Warlord
Joined
Mar 3, 2013
Messages
249
Just a question : has the cost of the guided missile been reduced in CPP ?

I find this unit too powerfull. It's cheap (3 missiles are cheaper than a battleship in term of production) and fast to produce, and you can stack them, making cities absolutely horrible to conquer.

In my current game one AI is stacking 6 missiles in all endangered cities, and I guess instant buying as many as it can each turn, making warfare a nightmare (half my fleet of a dozen or more boats can get insta killed when I approach the coast). I don't remember any counter to that, as they can't be intercepted.

I guess the biggest problem is the fact that you can buy multiple air units in a city (as they stack) : when I see him buying 6 of them in 2 cities every turn, I really get crazy. I need to swarm him with an enormous army to conquer a single city.

Talking about cities, I found them extremely hard to break in the end game (and maybe a tight too easy at the beginning), using siege weapons and boats (with upgrades).

Here is a small example :



3 turns and around 10 units attacking the city each turn, and the city has still half of its hp !

And in this case I had perfect positionning, and virtually no counter attack from my ennemy. But against an AI it's a real pain. This make surprise attacks pretty much useless on any cities but the weakest. I know that it would have been easier with missile cruisers, but I doubt that this is the problem here.

Edit : It seems that they did not receive a boost. First time I see an AI using them so well... No maintenance, cheap, efficient, I knew this unit was nice but for a defensive war it's more than nice : it's awesome. Maybe a bit too awesome. They fade a bit after unlocking the last troops tier (mechanic infantry, missile cruisers, etc.) but still, I can produce 3/4 of them for 1 missile Cruiser, and they cost no maintenance.
 
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