CP v. 65.2/CBP v. 12 - Released!

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If you want to help with that, I'd be grateful. :)
G

I'm so sorry but I have to say no on this one. Things are really hectic and I have little time for civ other than posting here and playing for an hour every now and then. Furthermore the whole flavor system is rather hard to understand. I have a hard time understanding the reason behind most of the numbers from vampire (bnw) I have looked at.

\Skodkim
 
Played a full game with Carthage. I have to say most changes are really cool. The one main problem for me was the early game, where my capital was causing unhappyness on its own down to -5... It was very hard to get to turn 50. I did like the fact that harbors were not availiable from the get go, and that happyness is more dynamic, but perhaps the latter is a bit too much so.
Also an in-game more detailed text that explains how to deal with each of the unhappyness issues would be great. It is crazy to go from +4 to -6 to +3 to god knows where in one turn, especially in the early game. Also the barbarians spawned a crazy amount of naval units.
The exploration tree needs an overhaul. I took it with Carthage, and the seaport policy does not come into action until way after you have taken it for example... +3 production on coastal is good but not until latter, the +3 total gold per turn is so and so... I really liked what CEP did with that tree and the economics tree (as well as the things Maciaveli did with the economics tree inr eform and rule)
Anyhow, thank you once more for constantly revitalizing the Civ experience.
 
I'm so sorry but I have to say no on this one. Things are really hectic and I have little time for civ other than posting here and playing for an hour every now and then. Furthermore the whole flavor system is rather hard to understand. I have a hard time understanding the reason behind most of the numbers from vampire (bnw) I have looked at.

\Skodkim

No worries! Was purely a 'if you want to, feel free' comment.

Played a full game with Carthage. I have to say most changes are really cool. The one main problem for me was the early game, where my capital was causing unhappyness on its own down to -5... It was very hard to get to turn 50. I did like the fact that harbors were not availiable from the get go, and that happyness is more dynamic, but perhaps the latter is a bit too much so.

I'm planning an adjustment to happiness for the next version to make it a little less punishing in the early game.

The exploration tree needs an overhaul. I took it with Carthage, and the seaport policy does not come into action until way after you have taken it for example... +3 production on coastal is good but not until latter, the +3 total gold per turn is so and so... I really liked what CEP did with that tree and the economics tree (as well as the things Maciaveli did with the economics tree inr eform and rule)

This is on the to-do list, definitely.
G
 
Firstly, I want to say to Gazebo and others, great mod! It really carries on the legacy of my favourite mod before this, Communitas.

Secondly, I am running the mod with the balance patch, CSD, Events and Decisions, and Historical Religions, and I noticed that when I used the first diplomat unit you get (the one at writing) it gave me 100 influence instead of the described 20 influence. I had cleared my cache before playing and everything else is working as it should be. I hadn't changed any options from the options.sql file in the CSD folder and when looking at it I didn't see any setting that would alter this. So I was wondering if I am the only one having this issue?

Lastly, I did notice that the Sweden Trait Modification and Fix for Mausoleum of Halicarnassus were not on the default settings (i.e. 1 = Fix Enabled (Default), and 1 = 0 Influence When Gifting Great People (Normal, Default)). Is this normal?

Oh, I also noticed that I was able create a mine on an iron resource that was on marsh tile without the need of the masonry tech to be able to clear the marsh. Is this intended or a bug? I also think I remember the first piety social policy did not correctly give me culture from having a shrine but I had been drinking so I might have been mistaken on that.
 
I'm planning an adjustment to happiness for the next version to make it a little less punishing in the early game.
G

This is required, I think :



Being assaulted by barbarians (Raging barbarians activated) I'm not able to reverse the situation, and it seems that I'm not the only one :p

Also, my units in cities are healing only by 15hp per turn, while units in my territory heal 30hp per turn. It does not seem logical.
 
I finished one game with this version (65.2/12) on the weekend. (Settings: Immortal, Germany, Continents normal map size.) Posted the few bugs I encountered earlier in the bugs thread. Now some suggestions/observations on gameplay:

Generally it was a great game!
I really like most of the new features especially:
- new tech tree,
- unit overhaul
- and of course especially the new promotions.

On these I am not sure after just one game
- buildings without %-modifiers - what is the idea behind this?
- slowed down workerspeed,
- improvements,
- iron/horses needed for late game units.


Now more specific:

units:

- Warriors should upgrade to spearman instead of swordsman.
I rarely saw any spearman ingame, but hordes of warriors nearly until late game. Iron is relatively rare and the AI (and especially the city-states) seem to miss it to upgrade their warriors in time. They only vanished during Renaissance wars. And as the ressource based units are considered elite, it seems natural to upgrade standard warriors to standard spearmen insted of elite swords.

- Horsed Units are either too cheap (production) or too strong (way more CS and MP) in comparison to other units especially (long)-swords.
Making them more expensive while staying strong seems the more historical solution to this.

- Composite bowman come too early and/or are too strong.
I would put them in the second row of classic tech as they are now just one tech row behind bowman. I could build them even before bowman, teching more on the under(?) site of the techtree.

- barbarian ships should spawn later.
There are no player ships before classic now, so barbs should not have ships earlier than any (AI-)player.

- When producing a settler I don't get the surplus food 1:1 added to the prod and the food storage is emptied. Is this intended or bugged?
If intended please change it back. Emptying the storage only needs more micromanagement to optimise and why making the super important prod in early game even more important and food weaker? But settlers could be a bit more expensive (120).


buildings/specialists:

- Scientists (+3) are too strong, merchants (+2) are too weak (at least in comparison to other specialists.)
Scientists and engineers with +2 would be okay, merchants should produce at least 3 gold as gold is weaker than prod and science.

- The mint is too weak.
+2 per ressource should be minimum. With +1 you would need at least 3 or better 4 ressources to even consider building a mint. And this rarely happens. So make it +2 and/or add something extra.


Religion:

- Veneration (+1 faith per believer up to 10) and especially Inspiration (+1 culture per believer up to 10) seem extremly powerful to me.
Perhaps more like +0,5 would be better.


Policies:

- The first two tradition policies seem way too powerful to me. Thats just too much free food (4-8) so early in the game.
All AIs taking tradition have super capitals (15+) relatively early, the others are weak in comparison. I played four games (at least early game) with this tradition tree. Two times I took tradition myself = easy early game. The times I took honor/piety the tradition-AIs went far away in pop and science. The +x food from the opener should be replaced by something else (e.g. +2/3 % growth per policy). I feel it's a really big balance issue at the moment.


Improvements:

- Generally I need more experience to get a feel for the changes, but I think mines with 4 prod come too early (late classic with fresh water). Better move to late medieval with and renaissance without fresh water.
And is there an unaccounted +1 on all mines in industrial times? My mines produced 5 hammers in late game.

- It would be nice to replace trade posts with villages/towns. I just mean name and graphics. Trade post spam feels weird.;)


Promotions:

- Please make the ship promotions +10% instead of +20% (and optionally remove the ships/cities-lines). It is too easy to kill enemy navies with +60 % CS after just three promotions, especially when the AI likes city attack promotions and or extra movement/sight as much as these powerful navy killers.

- Weaken the wolf pack promotions at least a bit. Of course subs should be glass cannons, but one shooting everything and making ridiciolus amounts of damage against cities is too much.


Happiness:

- I really like "your" system. It's has way more flair than vanillas. But there are some problems that need tweaking, I think.

(1) It's to easy to make normally developed cities nearly completely happy (1-3 unhappiness in a 20+ city, "all in green"). I build nearly no coloseums, zoos and stadiums. Boredom was never a problem.

(2) There are strange jumps in happiness going from +15 to -10 in the same round. I think garrison influence on happiness is the main reason for this.

(3) AI was often really unhappy late game (after ideology, don't know before). In wartime they had often rebellions, hindering their war efforts. The penalties for annexing/conquering cities seem extremyly sharp as long as they are "in rebellion". Perhaps a connection to the garrison problem mentioned above.

It's hard for me to suggest something specific as I am not sure how the system exactly works. I read the guide, of course, but without the exact numbers it is still more a feeling than math.:)


Enough for now.;) Thanks again for your efforts!:worship:
 
I agree with Bernd-das-Brot about the Mint being too weak. Especially with the market the way it is now, it just completely outclasses the mint.

What Tradition policies are you talking about? I am not in front of my Civ computer at the moment, but I don't remember an early super-food Tradition policy. But maybe I am just not remembering. (EDIT: Ah, Oligarchy. Forgot about that one!)
 
Hey Gazebo,

thanks for integrating my changes, I'm happy they won't be lost.

Anyway, I just did a little test game, some observations:

- New spy system is extremely annoying, because every turn I have an AI apologizing for their failed mission. Worst of all, I don't see any difference whether I forgive them or not. Can these nagscreens be disabled?

- Religion is an uphill battle. Even if I am first to found my religion and spread it far and wide, the AI players will eventually found their own and spam me with great prophets. It should be easy to spread a religion to pagans, but not to dislodge another religion.

- Inquisitors can not be built after renaissance? Is this by design? Anyway, how about paying a price in population for using an inquistor?

Best
ilteroi
 
- buildings without %-modifiers - what is the idea behind this?
Blame Beyond Earth for that! ;) There was a discussion thread here (the last few posts).

In short, the removal of %-modifiers...
  • Removes the snowball effect from new techs a bit
  • Keeps specialists and tile yields more relevant
  • Makes population more important
  • Makes specialisation less crucial (might help the AI)
  • Makes wonders/national wonders that do have %-effects more special

It'll also keep the overall numbers in the game a bit smaller, avoiding the gold spam towards the end of the game.
 
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