Critics vs Audience?

There were a lot of alt right fruit loops that criticized it for the purple haired feminist admiral and the anti capitalist message of the Cantobite scenes. That undermined legit criticism of how poorly the characters and lore were handled. Now I feel like every time I criticize that film I have to preface it with "I'm not an alt right troll, in fact my politics are the opposite. Now can you believe me when I say it sucked?"

I mean you'll find morons criticizing everything that comes out. Best to not give them any legitimacy by dwelling on their twitter posts

If I was worried who might have criticized what I'm about to criticize, I would have to preface everything with: "Okay so I'm not a nazi or an alien or a sexist or a racist or a genocidal maniac.. but.. let me just say that I do not like swiss cheese on an open face sandwich"
 
I mean you'll find morons criticizing everything that comes out. Best to not give them any legitimacy by dwelling on their twitter posts

If I was worried who might have criticized what I'm about to criticize, I would have to preface everything with: "Okay so I'm not a nazi or an alien or a sexist or a racist or a genocidal maniac.. but.. let me just say that I do not like swiss cheese on an open face sandwich"
Right. Generally speaking that's totally true. This was a bit of a special case though since the director, producer, some of the actors, etc waved off criticism with identity politics. It put me in a wierd place.
 
I am never on twitter so I don't even know any of that was happening. I just watch the movies and enjoy them for what they are

I think if you're worried that you criticizing a *movie* might be taken the wrong way by someone, then you are just talking to the wrong someone. Talk to people who are normal!
 
Averaging the scores seems better just be aware of bias from the critics and audiences.

Trolls will tank score but critics will give dreck high scores if it ticks the right boxes. Oscar nominations for boring historical period pieces are a prime example.

I'll use Star Trek Discovery. Black women oh noes. Critics give it 80% something or other.

Audiences and trolls something like 40%.

It's not great but it doesn't deserve either score but somewhere in the 60s I consider a fair score.
 
I noticed that it depends on which media.
When it comes to movies, I tend to more often than not side with the critics.
When it comes to games, I tend to much more often side with the audience (I've noticed that Metacritics audience-side is really reliable for my tastes).

I have the perception that most movie critics do it out of passion for the medium, while most video game journalist tend to follow the market and kowtow more often with editors. Maybe games entering the mainstream culture will change this over the decades.
 
There is a way to tell if an audience score has been tanked by trolls with sock accounts. The number of ratings is readily available on most movie sites. Take two similar movies, maybe same franchise or contemporaneous with matching popularity and compare review numbers. If one has a drastically higher number than the other it might be trolls with socks attempting to skew the score. If the numbers are similar I'd say they're legit.

Since I've been on the The Last Jedi topic we could look at TLJ and the Force Awakens. TFA is a little older and has a review count on RT of 230k. TLJ is sitting around 215k. Itd take a lot of socks to skew a score with that many reviews. To bring TLJ down from TFAs 86% to TLJs 44% you'd need to add a good 100k sock votes.

I just dont buy the troll theory. It borders on the "alternative facts" lunacy. Either people like something or they don't. If critics and audience dont agree then critics are using some criteria on what's "good" that's different from whether or not people are going to like something. IMO that makes them pretty useless.
 
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There is a way to tell if an audience score has been tanked by trolls with sock accounts. The number of ratings is readily available on most movie sites. Take two similar movies, maybe same franchise or contemporaneous with matching popularity and compare review numbers. If one has a drastically higher number than the other it might be trolls with socks attempting to skew the score. If the numbers are similar I'd say they're legit.
I've a simpler method. Just remove all the 0 and all the 10. Usually works like a charm, it removes most of the trolls/fanboys.
 
Either people like something or they don't. If critics and audience dont agree then critics are using some criteria on what's "good" that's different from whether or not people are going to like something. IMO that makes them pretty useless.

Yes, kind of. But their value is also what you perceive it to be. If you feel a critic informs your choice, then the criticism has value to you (like everything on the 'market', ugh). There's also the possible entertainment value from reading film critics.

Ergo, they do fill some kind of gap in the market. But, certainly, they have no objective/use value like, say, a washing machine or a car, or even reviewers of washing machines and maybe cars.
 
In yonder thread, I mentioned Jennifer Garner's Peppermint from last year, and while I knew its reviews had been poor, I decided to look it up anyway:

Rotten Tomatoes critics score: 12%
Rotten Tomatoes audience score: 72%
Metacritic critics' score: 29 - only 1 review deemed positive, 10 mixed, 15 negative
Metacritic users' score: 60 - 43 positive ratings, 23 mixed, 14 negative

I don't know if I've ever seen a division between critics and audiences, but I haven't done a survey or anything. I still haven't seen this movie, but I'm even more curious now.
 
RT is a tough one to read. Critics might say "eh wasn't perfect but worth a watch" and give it a thumbs up. A movie like that could get certified fresh if enough critics did that. Audiences might look at it as "it was ok but I wish I would've waited for it to hit netflix" and give it a thumbs down because they dont think it's worth going to the theater for. That might turn it rotten. In reality it might just be a 6/10 movie.
 
RT is a tough one to read. Critics might say "eh wasn't perfect but worth a watch" and give it a thumbs up. A movie like that could get certified fresh if enough critics did that. Audiences might look at it as "it was ok but I wish I would've waited for it to hit netflix" and give it a thumbs down because they dont think it's worth going to the theater for. That might turn it rotten. In reality it might just be a 6/10 movie.
Likewise, Metacritic will assign a 0-100 score to any review that doesn't provide one, or "translate" a letter-grade or other ratings scale. And of course a number score assigned to something like a film is not a measure of anything, it's purely a comparative value, so one critic's "85" isn't really comparable to another critic's "85", it's only comparable between ratings by the same critic, and only then if the critic herself is consistent. So, yeah, this is all [hogwash]. :lol:
 
I noticed that it depends on which media.
When it comes to movies, I tend to more often than not side with the critics.
When it comes to games, I tend to much more often side with the audience (I've noticed that Metacritics audience-side is really reliable for my tastes).

I have the perception that most movie critics do it out of passion for the medium, while most video game journalist tend to follow the market and kowtow more often with editors. Maybe games entering the mainstream culture will change this over the decades.

Eh, it's hard to know the specifics of what sort of critics you're reading and how you're responding/identifying with them. However, my tentative theory for where that divide is coming from is the fact that film is an older medium and film criticism has been institutionalized as an intellectual pursuit for sixty/seventy years at this point, so there's a lot more of an institutional infrastructure for a critic today to fall back on in terms of genre, form, expectations, and education.

Games criticism, by contrast, was only really institutionalized as a specialized academic discipline within the last fifteen years, and even today academic games criticism falls mainly within the purview of broader critical theorists, feminist theorists, cultural critics, semiologists, etc. rather than academics of games qua games, while commercial games criticism draws its institutional origins alternatively from consumer advice publications a la tech or car mags or from company-run rags that were little more than in-house advertisements for upcoming games.

I feel that as the institutionalization of the medium pro se continues, we'll see video game reviews start to take on a character more akin to what we see in film criticism, and less of the "box-ticking to generate an algorithmic score out of ten" which has historically characterized the industry.
 
The Orville season 1 had very low critic scores and high user scores.

Season 2 the critic scores were a lot higher and the show didn't really do anything different.

The Last Jedi is marginally better than the audience score, in a vacumn it could pass for mindless schlock but it does a piss poor job of following up TFA and the previous 2 trilogies.
 
Looks like we have another situation on our hands with the latest Rambo movie. The reviews are calling it a "MAGA fantasy" and such. It looks like this will be fun.

Depends if it's goes political or if it's just 80s style big dumb Rambo.

Sometimes explosions are fun.
 
Well Rambo the critics hate it fans love it.

Rolling Stone a Reagan movie for the Maga era.
 
I liked First Blood (1st rambo movie) the sheriff was a fash. The second rambo was ok, still the spooks/govt higherups where the bad guys
 
I'm not a massive Rambo fan but liked the 2008 and one or two of the earlier movies.
 
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