ct3 - Chieftain Training Day (for newbies only)

U R right - let's get this game going - the lag time between moves is too long. :cry:

Am sorry Chieftess is under the weather but perhaps we can move on with the game.

Am back in town and back on email but RW Price - you already "got it" and I know you are probably chomping at the bit to get your 10 moves played. I'll pick up my spot between Bob and you next go round.

I see other new succession games being considered at Warlord and Chieftan but I want to finish this game out - I think we all do.

Less lag time - more game time! :D
 
Originally posted by BoBtheBUILDER
Preturn (230 AD):
Okay, is anyone else confused by this? It's 230 AD and the second best city in the world is a capital with a population of two and NO wonders? This seems odd... I wonder if there's only one other landmass and that there has been some warmongering between the other civs?
Sounds like a good possibility. We'll find out in a little bit (I hope).
I shift science down to 20%, we still get the Republic in a turn but we get 21 gp this turn too. :)
Good use of the science slider! :goodjob:
I don't see anything glaring going through the other advisers except that Pasargadae has three units on garrison and Zimbabwe only has one. Since only two can improve happiness I thought I'd move one of the Immortals from Pasargadae to Zimbabwe. The move will take three turns so I'm not sure if it'll be useful (MPs are useless after we switch to the Republic) but it may help if we have a long revolt.
A reasonable thought, at least.
Cities:
Tarsus nees someone to work that flood plain. That irrigated desert is useless to us there right now. Gordium needs a worker too, not immediately but we should be able to take advantage of that wheat tile better.
Persepolis needs irrigation or mines... it has one underperforming tile.
Babylon should be fine for now, it grows next turn but we can use the fishies for now. I move the tiles per ct's instructions here so Oracle is done in ten with 0 population growth forcasted.
I moved the workers around in Zimbabwe as Chieftess suggested. I'm not sure how much of a difference one turn will make there, particularly since we don't store any food as a result, but I'll trust in her recommendation.
I leave Pasargade as is because it looks okay. It will have another worker next turn too.
I change the tiles in Suza my moving the citizen working the roaded grassland to the north the the forest NE of town. Lighthouse scheduled for completion in 39 turns with 0 population growth.
Ulundi needs a woker to capitalize on the other unimproved flood plain.
Arbela has a worked tile that could be improved. I'm going to let it be since the settler is popping in one turn anyway. I will have to look at my map to see where this guy is headed.
Bapedi is going to be a neat little town once we get that jungle cleared. Gateway to the east! :)
Antioch is fine though I change the build from an Immortal to worker (we just need more of the little guys).
Good analysis of the towns and their needs.
Arbela completes its settler and I set it to produce a granary.
:confused: - we're building the Pyramids!
I didn't realize our galley was asleep so I wake it up and start exploring. I'm going to start to the E and begin working my way N.
The galley was asleep!? :smoke:
I realize the massive fool I was earlier ordering Arbela to build a granary when we're building the Pyramids for crying out loud! I switch Arbela to Barracks as well.
Well, you realized your mistake and fixed it. :D
Conclusion:
Nothing terribly exciting about that round. Next turn we'll have the Forbidden Palace in Zimbabwe and we'll have discovered Mathematics. The Oracle and the Pyramids will be done in four turns.
~sigh~ The FP in Zimbabwe is just way too close to our capital to be fully useful. But it's so close now there is no real choice in the matter. Anyway, the demographics shows that our remaining opponents are *probably* not in the greatest of shape, so it shouldn't be a game-breaker.

With our opponents' cities being size 2 and smaller ( :eek: ) we should have no problem snagging both the Pyramids and the Oracle. It's doubtful that they have any city far enough along in building them to affect us. The Lighthouse may be another matter, as it is still some 25 turns away. We need to find those guys!

One thing that could still be improved is worker/tile management. As I look at our cities, I see citizens working on unimproved tiles. This is especially important in our "core" areas around the Capital and FP cities. Zimbabwe, for instance, has a bonus Grassland just begging to be mined and roaded. Meanwhile, two citizens there are working unimproved forest tiles! Don't stop any workers from their current tasks, but find a couple that can get there soon and mine/road that tile. Leave the stack at Bapedi. It's too far to bring them back, and they will serve a good purpose by clearing all that jungle.

Actually, a very good turn, overall. I liked the clear, complete list of actions taken, and especially *why* they were taken.

(Since I haven't heard yet from Chieftess, call this the Critique, and let's get this thing moving again! :D )
 
Hey guys, I finally put my warlord game to bed!

BtB_victory.jpg
 
Thanks for the support guys. I'll post the save if you're interested (provided I still have it). I really think the game should have been resolved much more quickly, but I think I either 1) was not able to conduct war very effectively) or 2) have not figured out how to maximize culture output well.

I wound up relying on a technological edge against the Zulus (modern armor/bombers/artillary/battleships vs. riflemen/artillary/ironclads. I also made some stupid mistakes as far as cultureflipping goes. I finally figured out that you need to raze and move on when you get as close to the Zulu capital as I was.

BoB
 
Preturn (340 AD):

Nothing jumps out at me as needing to be changed, so I'll hit Enter to start off my round.

Turn 1 (350 AD):
I decide to pursue Currency as our next science research project. My reasoning is that it will be done in only 7 turns at the current rate, and will allow us to start working on Marketplace, which will then have a good effect on the happiness of our citizenry. At this point, I think that will be more valuable than the ability to build fortresses.

Zimbabwe finishes the Forbidden Palace and I order them to start on a spearman. We need to be building up our forces against the possibility of invasion when we are discovered.

Antioch is set to building an Immortal.

With the completion of the worker in Tarsus (whom I order to start on a mine), I set them to building a spearman as well. Also around Tarsus, I move 3 workers in place to continue irrigating next turn.

The worker west of Bactra is put to work building roads into our new city so that it will be connected to the rest of us.

Workers east of Susa begin clearing forest.

A worker near Bapedi connects the mine with roads. I moved all the workers to the other side of the city to begin clearing forest. We need to get to the point at which this city will begin cranking out some culture so that we can expand our borders and get access to the spice resources.

Turn 2 (360 AD):

Two workers from Tarsus head over to Zimbabwe to begin mining the bonus grassland, which will give us an extra shield (thanks, Padma!). One worker stays behind at Tarsus to irrigate the land around the city.

A worker west of Ulundi is sent to the other side of the city, where he will build a mine in the hills there. It'll take him two turns to arrive.

Workers northwest of Bapedi are set to clear jungles. This is a slow-moving job.

Our galley continues its exploration of the small island to the northeast of us. Doesn't look like we're going to find anything.

Workers west of Bactra begin clearing the forest. Next, we'll connect the city to the rest of our civilization by building roads there.

Turn 3 (370 AD):

Zimbabwe starts working on a barracks.

Pasargadae begins building walls around the city, and then will start work on a courthouse. Hopefully, this will help with the corruption. The idea behind the walls is that this is a coastal city and may soon need the extra defenses. I'm not sure what to do with the newly-finished settler that was created here. So, I decided to send him to the tip of the island, above Antioch, and we'll found a coastal city there.

A worker east of Ulundi begins building a mine to improve the tile there. Meanwhile, we continue clearing forest around Bapedi.

Arbela starts creating a horseman.


Turn 4 (380 AD):

We complete the Pyramids in Persepolis.

We complete the Oracle in Babylon. Hey, I just realized one of the bummers of a succession game--not everyone gets to see the wonders completed. Oh well, it's not like we have wonder movies anymore, right?

Babylon and Persepolis both begin producing spearmen.

Tragically, our galley is lost at sea near the newly discovered island. I moved it one square out to sea to broaden our knowledge and hopefully get a glimpse of other land. Then, I moved back toward the island, hoping that it would be close enough to stay alive. Looks like I lost that gamble.

Workers near Zimbabwe moved to the forest tile southwest of the city. I wanted to move them to the grassland just in front of the forest, but I couldn't seem to get them there.

Workers connect Bactra with roads, then move to connect our horse resources near there.

We begin building a mine near Susa.

Turn 5 (390 AD):

Zimbabwe declares "We Love the Emperor Day".

Ulundi begins working on its second spearman.

Antioch starts work on a Courthouse.

We move a worker to the iron deposits near Bactra, and work continues around Bapedi clearing the land around this city.

Turn 6 (400 AD):

On second thought, maybe we won't touch the iron deposits near Bactra, since we've already got plenty, and I don't want to waste this now.

Babylon starts work on a barracks, while Bactra begins work on a new galley to replace the one I lost. We're still 19 turns away from the Great Lighthouse--we really need it, since we have no clue where our friends and foes are hiding.

We send a worker to the wheat square near Gordium, and another to the forests near Babylon.

Jungle clearing work continues around Bapedi.

I moved workers in place to clear some more forests around Susa.

Sidon founded in 400 AD at the northern tip of the island.

Turn 7 (410 AD):

Zimbabwe's cultural influence expands! Zimbabwe starts work on a courthouse. Honestly, at this point it's getting harder to know what to build without knowing what we should be getting ready for. We really need to know who our neighbors are and where they're located.

Pasargadae finishes her walls and starts working on a courthouse.

I start Ulundi working on a courthouse as well.

Arbela starts producing her own Immortal.

Tarsus was feeling left out, so they're building a spearman as well.

Gordium needs a temple, so we start to build one there. Just then, the people declare their love for me and I get to work on our temple.

A worker near Babylon starts to clear forests, as well as near Susa and Zimbabwe.

Turn 8 (420 AD):

I instructed our scientists to research Literature. It only takes 4 turns, and the library (or Great Library) may be useful.

Workers near Zimbabwe, Susa and Bactra are instructed to clear forest.


Turn 9 (430 AD):

Persepolis finishes the horseman and begins working on a marketplace.

More workers head for Zimbabwe to help with clearing the forests there.

In Gordium, a worker begins connecting the wheat square with a road.

Turn 10 (440 AD):

Babylon begins work on an Immortal. Perhaps we can load this guy on a boat later when we're able to explore seas more freely. The Great Lighthouse is only 15 turns away!


http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/xerxes_of_the_persians_440_ad.zip
 
Looking at the save now... it certainly looks like there are sea square "breadcrumbs" to the other continents. Once we get the lighthouse we should be able to take advantage of them.

Maybe we should start considering what type of victory we want to go for. With the dearth of wonders that are built (we own 'em all), maybe we should consider a culture victory. It'd be a good learning experience because I've never pulled one off and I'd be very interested in learning the mechanics of getting one.

Any thoughts on that?

Otherwise it seems like that was a pretty good turn. Too bad about losing the galley though! :(
 
Here's my dotmap proposal for the new island. Let me know what you think!


440AD_dotmap.jpg
 
Bob, I have downloaded rwprice's save, and I don't see the "breadcrumbs" indicating a nearby continent that you mention. (I do see the uninhabited continent though.)

It seems that we are doing fine. A culture victory might be in our best interest since we now have the pyramid, and other wonders.

However, there is something compelling about getting in there and beating the socks off the others. (I can't believe I said that!)

I am going back to your saved game and then use rwprice's log to play it to his save so I can get a better feel of where we are.

As to your map, I am not sure how to interpret it. Sorry. Chalk it up to inexperience. :(

stwils
 
Okay, first let me comment on the dotmap.

It's not bad, but it does include a LOT of overlap. Not necessarily a bad thing; maybe we won't grow cities of any size there. :)

If it were up to me, though, I would only put three cities there. Leave the two in the North and the East. They are fine. But I would not build the Western city, and would move the Southern one up one tile to the NW. This way we still get control of the entire island, and with less overlap.
 
Well, I still haven't heard from Chieftess, and I've been unable to connect with her in the chat, so I guess until I get told to stop, I will continue with critiques.
Originally posted by rwprice

I decide to pursue Currency as our next science research project. My reasoning is that it will be done in only 7 turns at the current rate, and will allow us to start working on Marketplace, which will then have a good effect on the happiness of our citizenry. At this point, I think that will be more valuable than the ability to build fortresses.
Sounds reasonable. :)
Workers northwest of Bapedi are set to clear jungles. This is a slow-moving job.
Indeed! That is why we almost always use "teams" of many workers to clear jungle; it's the only way to get it done in reasonable time!
Pasargadae begins building walls around the city, and then will start work on a courthouse. Hopefully, this will help with the corruption. The idea behind the walls is that this is a coastal city and may soon need the extra defenses.
You do realize, I assume, that walls are useless once a city grows beyond size 6? And they have no effect on naval warfare? Seems like wasted production (shields & turns) to me. :smoke:
I'm not sure what to do with the newly-finished settler that was created here. So, I decided to send him to the tip of the island, above Antioch, and we'll found a coastal city there.
A reasonable choice. Other choices include:
  • the forest NE of Babylon to get the fish and the wines.
  • North or NW of Bapedi - to get a culture lock on that part of the continent
  • The jungle between Bapedi and Ulundi to get the spices and culture lock
  • between Tarsus and Ulundi for culture lock
  • the coast west of Zimbabwe and south of Susa for culture lock
Hey, I just realized one of the bummers of a succession game--not everyone gets to see the wonders completed. Oh well, it's not like we have wonder movies anymore, right?
right on both counts: we don't get to see them, but we don't get movies, anway. :)
We move a worker to the iron deposits near Bactra,
:eek:
On second thought, maybe we won't touch the iron deposits near Bactra, since we've already got plenty, and I don't want to waste this now.
:goodjob:
I instructed our scientists to research Literature. It only takes 4 turns, and the library (or Great Library) may be useful.
Libraries at least. Although, the Great Library would be good for culture points. I'm *not* sure it will be useful for getting new techs. I am beginning to think, since we have gotten all the wonders so far, that the other civs are not pushing the tech envelope, so to speak.

Overall, a decent set of turns. I didn't go into detail on workers and such, since it seems like you've got the idea. :)

I see what you mean about the "breadcrumbs". :D The other continent(s) just has to be just west of us! We just have to find the route there! (More suicide galley missions.)
 
Padma,

I know we all appreciate your doing the critiques for us and in such a timely manner.

I had a quick question about something you said in your critique of rwprice's game. You talk about "culture lock." Does that mean that the cities' boundaries all connect to the others so there is no vacant land between?

stwils
 
Yes. "Culture Lock" is a term to refer to the situation where the AI cannot settle somewhere because your culture borders prevent it. Technically, your borders do not have to be totally connected, as the AI's settling algorithm does not let it settle within the 21-tile area of your city, even if your borders haven't expanded yet.
 
Originally posted by Padma
You do realize, I assume, that walls are useless once a city grows beyond size 6? And they have no effect on naval warfare? Seems like wasted production (shields & turns) to me. :smoke:

No, I didn't realize those facts about walls. I guess I just learned something. I should've stopped to think about that before building them. That's what's so good about these training day games.

Also, I didn't know about the culture lock concept. I'll have to keep that in mind for future expansion plans.

Thanks for the lessons, Padma!
 
Back
Top Bottom