Sina
Warlord
I got home about an hour ago and could play some time tomorrow or Friday.
Slot me in again somewhere please.
Slot me in again somewhere please.
CTIV-6: Germs! Germs Everywhere!
- Thread starter ChrTh
- Start date
Gaspar~
Warlord
Sina go head and grab it ahead of me, please. Ideally I'd like you and hamtastic in whatever order to take a turn before I get it again, but if there's no sign of the hammer after you I'll play.
Gaspar~
Warlord
Oh, and welcome back! And congrats on the speedy recovery JOE!
Sina
Warlord
Thanks! 
I'll grab it, reread reports and comments and play at some point tomorrow.
I'll grab it, reread reports and comments and play at some point tomorrow.
pholkhero
Deviant Mind
Also, once you guys are back up to full-strength as it were I'd happily bow out, too...i was merely a sub after allGaspar~ said:
JesusOnEez
Emperor
@Gaspar~
Thanks, still got a fair bit of physio though.
Thanks, still got a fair bit of physio though.
Sina
Warlord
(0)1910AD:
Having a look around...
I got the impression from the report that we were not that bad off, but we are! Most cities still lack the basic buildings like Markets and observatories. We are even building Infantry without barracks (I noticed that only when the 0xp Infantry was finished). At least we'll be able to build Recycling Centers soon and then get some Forges and Factories.
Lizzy will probably have launched by then though! She's running away and we can't stop her with our pathetic production.
IBT: Lizzy wants Fission. No way!
(1)1910AD:
Delphi: Hospital -> Library
Kublai got a GA.
IBT: Now Lizzy wants to trade for Fission. Still no deal.
(2)1914AD:
Antium: Infantry -> Observatory
(3)1916AD:
Rome: Infantry -> Infantry
Narak has been born in Neapolis. He's a Prophet and useless. Move him to Rome.
IBT: Cathy wants us to cancel deals with America. No.
(4)1918AD:
Ecology is in and I choose Industrialism. I suspect tanks will be needed.
Lots of builds finished and I start Recycling Centers where not prohibited by variant rules.
One of Kublai's Ironclads is a Destroyer now.
Science down to 70% at +88. I'll set it up to 80% again in time to not lose a turn on research.
(5)1920AD:
Nothing
IBT: Roosevelt would like some help with his war against Cathy. We can't, so no sorry.
(6)1921AD:
More Recycling Centers are ordered up.
Pentagon has been built (England).
Toku started a GA.
IBT: Now Cathy wants us to join the war. Yet another no.
(7)1922AD:
Some more cities get to work on building Recycling Centers.
Lizzy gets Eiffel Tower as well.
Off Topic: Telephone connections from Nairobi are bad and text messages from London to Madagaska are not being delivered. Thought that would interest you.
Right, back to the game...
(8)1923AD:
Science up to 80% and indeed we get that turn back.
(9)1924AD:
Nothing.
(10)1925AD:
Cumae gets to start on a Recycling Center as well.
Ok, I hate to say this, but we can't win this game. No way! We have serious happiness problems and it won't get better by obsoleting Ivory in 2 turns. Nearly all cities are working on Recycling Centers now and can then get Forges and Factories. It is too late though. We simply don't have the production for a war against Lizzy any time soon. We could probably give Kublai a good beating when Rome and Antium can start on producing Tanks, but that's it. Nobody is willing to declare on Lizzy either.
I need a drink now.
View attachment 121627
Having a look around...
I got the impression from the report that we were not that bad off, but we are! Most cities still lack the basic buildings like Markets and observatories. We are even building Infantry without barracks (I noticed that only when the 0xp Infantry was finished). At least we'll be able to build Recycling Centers soon and then get some Forges and Factories.
Lizzy will probably have launched by then though! She's running away and we can't stop her with our pathetic production.
IBT: Lizzy wants Fission. No way!
(1)1910AD:
Delphi: Hospital -> Library
Kublai got a GA.
IBT: Now Lizzy wants to trade for Fission. Still no deal.
(2)1914AD:
Antium: Infantry -> Observatory
(3)1916AD:
Rome: Infantry -> Infantry
Narak has been born in Neapolis. He's a Prophet and useless. Move him to Rome.
IBT: Cathy wants us to cancel deals with America. No.
(4)1918AD:
Ecology is in and I choose Industrialism. I suspect tanks will be needed.
Lots of builds finished and I start Recycling Centers where not prohibited by variant rules.
One of Kublai's Ironclads is a Destroyer now.
Science down to 70% at +88. I'll set it up to 80% again in time to not lose a turn on research.
(5)1920AD:
Nothing
IBT: Roosevelt would like some help with his war against Cathy. We can't, so no sorry.
(6)1921AD:
More Recycling Centers are ordered up.
Pentagon has been built (England).
Toku started a GA.
IBT: Now Cathy wants us to join the war. Yet another no.
(7)1922AD:
Some more cities get to work on building Recycling Centers.
Lizzy gets Eiffel Tower as well.
Off Topic: Telephone connections from Nairobi are bad and text messages from London to Madagaska are not being delivered. Thought that would interest you.
Right, back to the game...
(8)1923AD:
Science up to 80% and indeed we get that turn back.
(9)1924AD:
Nothing.
(10)1925AD:
Cumae gets to start on a Recycling Center as well.
Ok, I hate to say this, but we can't win this game. No way! We have serious happiness problems and it won't get better by obsoleting Ivory in 2 turns. Nearly all cities are working on Recycling Centers now and can then get Forges and Factories. It is too late though. We simply don't have the production for a war against Lizzy any time soon. We could probably give Kublai a good beating when Rome and Antium can start on producing Tanks, but that's it. Nobody is willing to declare on Lizzy either.
I need a drink now.
View attachment 121627
JesusOnEez
Emperor
OK...I have a suggestion that I'd like to put forward with regards to getting a space race, and as a health orientated game, you're not gonna like it. We stop ourselves in our current tracks and build nukes...the only way we're going to slow the AI down and stop them getting a space race victory first is to nuke them. While we're heading for nukes we can also build up a biggish navy to take on any ocean based attacks that'll head our way, and with any luck this'll slow everyone down enough to get the space race...
...world war people.
Of course, they might nuke us as well...but what have we got to lose? Not sure how long it'd take us to get Manhatten Project but thoughts?
I think it's time to think outside the box, as I agree that a win via MM is looking unlikely.
KA-BOOM!
...world war people.
Of course, they might nuke us as well...but what have we got to lose? Not sure how long it'd take us to get Manhatten Project but thoughts?
I think it's time to think outside the box, as I agree that a win via MM is looking unlikely.
KA-BOOM!
pholkhero
Deviant Mind
You must keep in mind, though, that the AI is notoriously poor on production capability...w/enough prod, Rome can make up for any shortcoming in the tech race
Gaspar~
Warlord
Nukes may well be our only option, but realistically they have to wait until factories and forges and power plants are built. Also keep in mind that by the time we can have nukes, theres a very good chance Lizzie will have SDI, the AI makes that a priority build.
Sort of the key point here: If we sit back and just try and get our economy/productive base up while teching to space, the English -will- launch before we ever get the chance. One way or another, we absolutely must get Elizabeth involved in war, either with us or with someone else. Probably the only chance we have of taking her down is by a large scale invasion with carrier groups and amphibious landings, heavy bombing power etc. I don't know if we have the time in the game left to get our production stuff online, tech appropriately, and create that force before she launches.
Regardless, in the meantime our only option is build towards productivity. I suppose theres an outside chance of using a combination of the Internet and Spies to stop Liz from launching and get the appropriate tech ourselves. Its certainly a longshot, and would require a Fiber Optics beeline after Industrialism.
I'm going to give hamtastic until tomorrow afternoon to grab the save before I jump in and take it.
Sort of the key point here: If we sit back and just try and get our economy/productive base up while teching to space, the English -will- launch before we ever get the chance. One way or another, we absolutely must get Elizabeth involved in war, either with us or with someone else. Probably the only chance we have of taking her down is by a large scale invasion with carrier groups and amphibious landings, heavy bombing power etc. I don't know if we have the time in the game left to get our production stuff online, tech appropriately, and create that force before she launches.
Regardless, in the meantime our only option is build towards productivity. I suppose theres an outside chance of using a combination of the Internet and Spies to stop Liz from launching and get the appropriate tech ourselves. Its certainly a longshot, and would require a Fiber Optics beeline after Industrialism.
I'm going to give hamtastic until tomorrow afternoon to grab the save before I jump in and take it.
Sina
Warlord
I have never tried nukes before, but am always open to new experiences. 
I agree with all Gaspar said, exactly my thoughts. From the look I had at the game during my turns, we are not going to get it done. And I don't think I am even pessimistic here...which I can be from time to time.
I agree with all Gaspar said, exactly my thoughts. From the look I had at the game during my turns, we are not going to get it done. And I don't think I am even pessimistic here...which I can be from time to time.
pholkhero
Deviant Mind
regardless.
For the Emperor!!
For the Emperor!!
Gaspar~
Warlord
Ok, I got it, will play in the am Saturday.
Gaspar~
Warlord
Pre-turn: Checking diplo, Lizzie is up 3 techs we can see, everyone else is up Artillery. We have Fission on everyone but Liz, and Ecology as well. Judging by the impressive by AI standards 450 gold cache Liz has, she's in the runaway financial position. We've really been up against it in this game, surrounded by 3 aggressive AI, lacking iron until it didn't matter anymore, in the sandwich position on the continent, and 2 financial civs in relative isolation. Combined with a really tough variant, my guess is we'll be watching Liz launch in about 60 turns. Sadly, there's really nothing we can do to affect it in our current position, our only real choice atm is to try and get all the production stuff built now that we can, and hope by the time we can build effective modern military, there's still a hope for a last ditch war or espionage campaign. I'm going to build production and military, and tech towards fiber optics, though I fear since only Liz is really ahead in the tech game, it won't help enough.
I will say if we could manage a golden age right about now, we'd have a chance, since we're still #1 in GNP. Flipping sci down 10% and culture up 10 brings Industrialism still in 2 but gives us 11 more gpt from actually putting folks to work. This will only be needed til we have forges, since we'll then have happy from gems.
Hit the big red button.
1925(1) - Nil. Swing the *cough* navy *cough* around near England, she's the one we need to worry about.
1926(2) - Industrialism in, ivory obsolete, even more unhappy. Start research on plastics, 3 gorges wouldn't be bad, though we can build coal plants after recycling centers. After that I'd go Radio -> Computers -> Fiber Optics. But that's just me.
I actually get the pleasure of starting the first forge!
Here's some good news:
1927(3) - Nothing. Start another Forge.
1928(4) - 3rd forge started. May need to bump lux to 20% if I want everyone working. Nothing we can trade for.
1929(5) - Here's a look inside Canterbury:
(IT) Liz dials us up and offers crab for Gems. I'm not particularly intrested in giving her more happies. Toku demands we cancel deals with her, but I also decline, as I fear her more than him. To punctuate, Liz finishes Rock and Roll. So long as she doesn't get the elevator.
1930(6) - Nothing.
1931(7) - Great Engineer born in Rome. While a GA appeals, I think rushing the Elevator or Three Gorges makes more sense. I fortify him for the time being. Rome and Pharsalos finish forges, start factories. Cathy takes Atlanta. Why oh why couldn't she be at war with Liz.
FWIW, we're about 11 turns from a Great Scientist in Shangian. When he's born, pair him with one of the GPs for a GA. Be careful about not getting the GE burnt in that transaction however.
Liz has aluminum by Oxford. I'm too depressed to take a picture.
(IT) Roosevelt asks for Fission. I tell him to bugger off.
1932(8) - More forges and factories come online. Liz has more aluminum by Nottingham. After I finish slitting my wrists, I come back to play more.
1933(9) - More scouting and more doing little else. Its taking way too long for our railnet to come online. Scotland Yard has to be a priority build once we get productivity elsewhere. Ironworks in Rome or Pharsalos.
1934(10) - Liz has a billion troops in London. I bring my computer out to the garage, start the car running, and shut the door.
That's as far as my turnset goes. Probably a decent chance I won't get the game back if everyone is alive. We need troops to deter Kublai and Cathy. We don't want war with them, we'll never get their cities productive before too late. The only real issue is Liz. We can outproduce anyone else once we get all the buildings up. We need spies over there, we need money, we need happies. I don't think nuking them will work, this chick is building everything she can, I'll be stunned if she doesn't have SDI in no time if she doesn't have it already.
Good luck, and the save:
I will say if we could manage a golden age right about now, we'd have a chance, since we're still #1 in GNP. Flipping sci down 10% and culture up 10 brings Industrialism still in 2 but gives us 11 more gpt from actually putting folks to work. This will only be needed til we have forges, since we'll then have happy from gems.
Hit the big red button.
1925(1) - Nil. Swing the *cough* navy *cough* around near England, she's the one we need to worry about.
1926(2) - Industrialism in, ivory obsolete, even more unhappy. Start research on plastics, 3 gorges wouldn't be bad, though we can build coal plants after recycling centers. After that I'd go Radio -> Computers -> Fiber Optics. But that's just me.
I actually get the pleasure of starting the first forge!
Here's some good news:
1927(3) - Nothing. Start another Forge.
1928(4) - 3rd forge started. May need to bump lux to 20% if I want everyone working. Nothing we can trade for.
1929(5) - Here's a look inside Canterbury:
(IT) Liz dials us up and offers crab for Gems. I'm not particularly intrested in giving her more happies. Toku demands we cancel deals with her, but I also decline, as I fear her more than him. To punctuate, Liz finishes Rock and Roll. So long as she doesn't get the elevator.
1930(6) - Nothing.
1931(7) - Great Engineer born in Rome. While a GA appeals, I think rushing the Elevator or Three Gorges makes more sense. I fortify him for the time being. Rome and Pharsalos finish forges, start factories. Cathy takes Atlanta. Why oh why couldn't she be at war with Liz.
FWIW, we're about 11 turns from a Great Scientist in Shangian. When he's born, pair him with one of the GPs for a GA. Be careful about not getting the GE burnt in that transaction however.
Liz has aluminum by Oxford. I'm too depressed to take a picture.
(IT) Roosevelt asks for Fission. I tell him to bugger off.
1932(8) - More forges and factories come online. Liz has more aluminum by Nottingham. After I finish slitting my wrists, I come back to play more.
1933(9) - More scouting and more doing little else. Its taking way too long for our railnet to come online. Scotland Yard has to be a priority build once we get productivity elsewhere. Ironworks in Rome or Pharsalos.
1934(10) - Liz has a billion troops in London. I bring my computer out to the garage, start the car running, and shut the door.
That's as far as my turnset goes. Probably a decent chance I won't get the game back if everyone is alive. We need troops to deter Kublai and Cathy. We don't want war with them, we'll never get their cities productive before too late. The only real issue is Liz. We can outproduce anyone else once we get all the buildings up. We need spies over there, we need money, we need happies. I don't think nuking them will work, this chick is building everything she can, I'll be stunned if she doesn't have SDI in no time if she doesn't have it already.
Good luck, and the save:
pholkhero
Deviant Mind
ChrTh > if back, UP NOW
hamtastic > if back, UP NOW
pholkhero > if no one's back, UP NOW
mucco > Skipped
JesusOnEez >
Sina >
Gaspar~ > just played
ChrTh & Hamtastic ~ if ya'll want to play it, go ahead. otherwise, i'll play the turns tomorrow
hamtastic > if back, UP NOW
pholkhero > if no one's back, UP NOW
mucco > Skipped
JesusOnEez >
Sina >
Gaspar~ > just played
ChrTh & Hamtastic ~ if ya'll want to play it, go ahead. otherwise, i'll play the turns tomorrow
ChrTh
Happy Yule!
Just got back.
A couple questions/thoughts:
How did we get a drydock?
You can chop woods to get Uranium, the rules specify woods-chopping is allowed for resources.
One big thought on the space race: SPIES. GET SPIES. Read LK117 (although they ended up losing) and Sirian's write-up for (I think) Epic II (or maybe Adventure 2). We can use them to sabotage her trades with other Civs, and to sabotage production. However, that'll cost money. Great Engineer would probably be better for Scotland Yard.
pholkhero, go ahead and take a turn before me.
A couple questions/thoughts:
How did we get a drydock?
You can chop woods to get Uranium, the rules specify woods-chopping is allowed for resources.
One big thought on the space race: SPIES. GET SPIES. Read LK117 (although they ended up losing) and Sirian's write-up for (I think) Epic II (or maybe Adventure 2). We can use them to sabotage her trades with other Civs, and to sabotage production. However, that'll cost money. Great Engineer would probably be better for Scotland Yard.
pholkhero, go ahead and take a turn before me.
ChrTh
Happy Yule!
Roster
hamtastic > back soon?
pholkhero > UP
ChrTh > On Deck
mucco > Skipped
JesusOnEez
Sina >
Gaspar~ > just played
PS JesusOnEez, glad to hear you're doing better
hamtastic > back soon?
pholkhero > UP
ChrTh > On Deck
mucco > Skipped
JesusOnEez
Sina >
Gaspar~ > just played
PS JesusOnEez, glad to hear you're doing better
Gaspar~
Warlord
I wouldn't rush Scotland Yard with a GE, its not a particularly expensive build. Once Forges, Factories, Power are online, we can build it in either Rome or Pharsalos in no time (the other should build Ironworks.) We need a plan for getting the kind of cash this is going to take though. If we turn research down/off, we're going to get waxed in the tech part.
No idea on the drydock! It wasn't me. >.>
No idea on the drydock! It wasn't me. >.>
mucco
Warlord
3 gorges dam and space elevator require 2 engineers to complete, I think. A least it's true for the elevator. That 2 wonders should be rushed with money.
IMO some turns can be spent on 100% tax, if it's for the elevator. Nothing more than 3-4 turns should be needed (we do have Kremlin, right?)
IMO some turns can be spent on 100% tax, if it's for the elevator. Nothing more than 3-4 turns should be needed (we do have Kremlin, right?)
ChrTh
Happy Yule!
We don't have Kremlin, Liz does.
Looked at the save, some thoughts. We need 4 techs to get to Fiber Optics: Plastics, Radio, Computers, and then FO. We have 3 turns left on Plastics; however, Science to 70% gets us Plastics in 2 (at -87 gpt), just in time for Rome building its Factory, it can start 3 Gorges, using one of the Great Engineers to assist. If we can get 3 Gorges before Liz (she has Plastics, and London is on a river), we'll have a nice production boost.
We don't need 2 Great Prophets. I would have one join Rome as a Super Specialist. Shangian is going to give us a GP in about 7 turns (might want to MM there, it looks like we have a Citizen working while we're starving). The nice thing is, whatever GP we get will give us enough to start the Golden Age (just don't hire a Priest). So we should have a nice Golden Age to help the building of 3 Gorges along.
BTW, I would recommend getting our Great Engineer out of Sparta...just in case.
Looked at the save, some thoughts. We need 4 techs to get to Fiber Optics: Plastics, Radio, Computers, and then FO. We have 3 turns left on Plastics; however, Science to 70% gets us Plastics in 2 (at -87 gpt), just in time for Rome building its Factory, it can start 3 Gorges, using one of the Great Engineers to assist. If we can get 3 Gorges before Liz (she has Plastics, and London is on a river), we'll have a nice production boost.
We don't need 2 Great Prophets. I would have one join Rome as a Super Specialist. Shangian is going to give us a GP in about 7 turns (might want to MM there, it looks like we have a Citizen working while we're starving). The nice thing is, whatever GP we get will give us enough to start the Golden Age (just don't hire a Priest). So we should have a nice Golden Age to help the building of 3 Gorges along.
BTW, I would recommend getting our Great Engineer out of Sparta...just in case.
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