Defeat, how does it work?

[zup]

What are the conditions under which a civ is defeated? Is it losing all cities and every unit capable of founding a city? Is it tied to a specific unitclass (unitclass_settler) or the ability to found a city? Is it possible to play a civ that completely lacks the ability to own cities and not get defeated automatically? All of this assumes 'require complete kills' is off.

 

[Vehem]

What are the conditions under which a civ is defeated? Is it losing all cities and every unit capable of founding a city? Is it tied to a specific unitclass (unitclass_settler) or the ability to found a city? Is it possible to play a civ that completely lacks the ability to own cities and not get defeated automatically? All of this assumes 'require complete kills' is off.

More than 10 turns into the game and have no city I believe are the only requirements for defeat. Even if you still have your settler at that point, it should remove you from the game. Base BtS/FfH method of handling it.

 

[xienwolf]

No victory can happen in the first 10 turns, but defeat CAN happen.


Defeat happens when you lose ALL of your units (every last one of them) if you haven't settled a city yet, or if the "Require Complete Kills" Gameoption is enabled.

Otherwise, Defeat is instant upon loss of your last city (but due to how equipment is currently handled, you might remain on the scoreboard temporarily if one of your units was carrying droppable gear)

 

[WarKirby]

Losing if you don't found a city seems a bit odd. I one heard of people playing sidar, using the interesting tactic of casting their worldspell on turn 1, and then going adventuring with your invisible starting settler, looking for a perfect site for a OCC

Maybe it would be best for it to require the destruiction of all cities AND settlers.

 

[xienwolf]

Until the moment you own your first city, you are considered to be in Requires Complete Kills. If you really wanted to be a jerk you could cut yourself down to a single scout in an isolated corner and just delete your settler and let people wonder what where you are all game long.

 

[WarKirby]

Related. If you annihilate all other civs within the first 10 turns, the game can never end, as you can't kill them again, and victory isn't automatically declared at the 10 turn mark.

Ran into this while spawning Auric Ascended for myself on turn 1 while testing on duel maps, and going to kill stuff.

I found that I can win by using the WB to place some units of the defeated civ. I?t automatically declares me winner at the end of the turn.

 

[Vehem]

Until the moment you own your first city, you are considered to be in Requires Complete Kills. If you really wanted to be a jerk you could cut yourself down to a single scout in an isolated corner and just delete your settler and let people wonder what where you are all game long.

Are you sure it's working that way? I've had a couple of games testing things where I didn't settle and was "defeated" on Turn 10. Was a couple of versions ago though...

 

[Valkrionn]

I actually had that happen to me on patch N while I was testing a mod. Rather surprised me......

 

[Tarquelne]

Are you sure it's working that way? I've had a couple of games testing things where I didn't settle and was "defeated" on Turn 10. Was a couple of versions ago though...

I associate that as being linked to 2 player games. When testing a 2 player game I settle to prevent the game from ending. In 3+ player games it's not a concern.

 

[Vehem]

I associate that as being linked to 2 player games. When testing a 2 player game I settle to prevent the game from ending. In 3+ player games it's not a concern.

Ah - that makes sense actually - I tend to use Duel for quick testing and it'd count as a conquest after 10 turns...

 

[xienwolf]

Phew. I was worried since this isn't a part of the code we have touched and I KNOW that it says how I stated it Hadn't thought about Conquest on Duel

 

[zup]

So I could make a civ that stays alive without cities because t

 

[Iskar Jarak]

Like some kind of playable barb civ?

 

[Vehem]

So I could make a civ that stays alive without cities

You'd need to handle them specifically in the checks for Conquest victories, but other than that, yes...

 

[xienwolf]

You would absolutely require using the DLL to do something like that. As soon as you attempt to raze a city it creates a city in your name, thus disabling your Requires Complete Kills status (pretty sure it wouldn't even give you a choice of razing it, but just force you to take it as a capital city outright, since if you DID raze it you would instantly lose)

 

[thadian]

i was playing as elohim, changed to basium - them elohim was DESTROYED by the horseman. every city, and their death message came up. i was alone in the world of evildoers.

there was nothing elohim on the map whatsoever - but then it happened.

i captured the barbarian owned Glens - and was opted (and did) liberate. i was confused i could liberate to a dead civ but it made me happy. makes me wonder if it works in that dust-filled civ4 bts.