[BTS] Deity Elizabeth (Possible) Great Start

[Snowbird]

I'd do HA visit to Quin. Iron source next to border (desert mine) and Beijing according to espionage is building something big (likely Mids - with industrious I think it is too many hammers for Oracle already).

Not sure why you warriors are that far away from making cities happy, although. Exploring blue border could be worth too... Darius has to have some nice stuff to brake through alpha this early.

 

[Izuul]

You really should've gotten The Wheel and Pottery sooner. Nottingham works the gold mines and London starts growing for cottages. That or with double gold mines you might've been able to do an Alpha beeline and then traded for everything. I think Aesthetics was the wrong choice here.

 

[Revent]

You really should've gotten The Wheel and Pottery sooner. Nottingham works the gold mines and London starts growing for cottages. That or with double gold mines you might've been able to do an Alpha beeline and then traded for everything. I think Aesthetics was the wrong choice here.

I just vaguely recalled reading somewhere that Darius is one of the AI that loves to tech Alpha which is what has turned out to be the case so planning to trade Aesthetics for it (needs one turn into it). So hopefully in next two turns, I'll have cottages being built. If you think it was a terrible decision, I could go back and see what beelining alpha does instead but I don't see it being much better than this as I'll have two trade bait techs.

I'd do HA visit to Quin. Iron source next to border (desert mine) and Beijing according to espionage is building something big (likely Mids - with industrious I think it is too many hammers for Oracle already).

Not sure why you warriors are that far away from making cities happy, although. Exploring blue border could be worth too... Darius has to have some nice stuff to brake through alpha this early.

Is HA rush actually feasible on deity? Do you have any links on where I could possibly see it in action to get an idea of units and timeline? Alternatively, is it better to wait until construction?

Ah yeah, warriors were fog busting and I forgot about them. They'll be coming back home soon now.

 

[Fippy]

Elepult is always tempting, esp if we can get there fast with high commerce
Brennus could start causing problems at any point, looks like he's about to settle more at your borders and already has 7 cities.
He has some peaceweight friends, despite Reli (it's just one of many diplo factors, guys like Qin will still like him more than wussies like Mansa i.e.).

Pigs east should be settled, no matter which way you will choose.
I would agree with Izuul that Aest. was not the best pick here (i would have played towards Construction & Jumbos), but with 2 gold mines it's not too late for all options.

 

[Revent]

Elepult is always tempting, esp if we can get there fast with high commerce
Brennus could start causing problems at any point, looks like he's about to settle more at your borders and already has 7 cities.
He has some peaceweight friends, despite Reli (it's just one of many diplo factors, guys like Qin will still like him more than wussies like Mansa i.e.).

Pigs east should be settled, no matter which way you will choose.
I would agree with Izuul that Aest. was not the best pick here (i would have played towards Construction & Jumbos), but with 2 gold mines it's not too late for all options.

Was the aesthetics move really that bad considering I can trade it for alpha next turn?

Pigs is definitely my next city. And I do think I will go for Brennus next. Although if Qin is building the mids and his only metal source is a border city, he could be a possible shout.

 

[Snowbird]

Was the aesthetics move really that bad considering I can trade it for alpha next turn?

Pigs is definitely my next city. And I do think I will go for Brennus next. Although if Qin is building the mids and his only metal source is a border city, he could be a possible shout.

What if you were not able? At the time you made decision you could not know. It turn to be good, but AI's might have not had Alpha for another 600-700 years. In that case what does Aesthetics do for you? and what do you tech after it?

 

[unas876]

There is Marble to the NE. You can get that with the Rice. It has forests so you can chop out a library or a monument. You can easily go Literature and build the GLib and at some point go for Music. The Artist is always nice and you can use him for a GA, a few easy scientists and a double bulb on Education. Paired with a decent (food could be better) Cottage Capital (Academy!!) you can easily make it to Lib and get the military action started after that.
In Civ there is usually more than one way to victory. Just because a Jumbo rush would have been good here, or maybe it was even optimal for this map, who knows, doesn't mean you have to do it.

Another advantage of the Elepult option that you now need to pay attention to is the diplomacy. Brennus is a dangerous character if he doesn't like you. Getting him to like you by religion is not really possible. Had you gone the Elepult route you wouldn't have to worry about him because you would likely be crushing him soon. So be careful. The map layout may be perfect for a Lib race, but you gotta make sure no AI gets in the way.

 

[Revent]

What if you were not able? At the time you made decision you could not know. It turn to be good, but AI's might have not had Alpha for another 600-700 years. In that case what does Aesthetics do for you? and what do you tech after it?

I see, I guess this was all just from my hazy memory on Darius preferring to go alphabet If not Darius, I would have gone straight to Alpha.

There is Marble to the NE. You can get that with the Rice. It has forests so you can chop out a library or a monument. You can easily go Literature and build the GLib and at some point go for Music. The Artist is always nice and you can use him for a GA, a few easy scientists and a double bulb on Education. Paired with a decent (food could be better) Cottage Capital (Academy!!) you can easily make it to Lib and get the military action started after that.
In Civ there is usually more than one way to victory. Just because a Jumbo rush would have been good here, or maybe it was even optimal for this map, who knows, doesn't mean you have to do it.

Another advantage of the Elepult option that you now need to pay attention to is the diplomacy. Brennus is a dangerous character if he doesn't like you. Getting him to like you by religion is not really possible. Had you gone the Elepult route you wouldn't have to worry about him because you would likely be crushing him soon. So be careful. The map layout may be perfect for a Lib race, but you gotta make sure no AI gets in the way.

Brennus will likely be taking that city in the next few turns. I think I will be aiming for Elepulting him still.

 

[Revent]

The key question now though is what next is best? I am aiming for Brennus, but would someone else be a better option? Is it better to Elepult or peaceful expansion until something like Cuirs.

 

[Gasp]

This is a strong start, I wouldn't wait until someone to attack me. HA rush on Qin as suggested could be nice. Elepult on Brennus is definitely a good option Attack your close neighbor is a principle you should follow
You have to be more careful with happiness here. Settling east next to these Pigs while researching your military tech is what I would do.
You have a wonderful land here (lacks some food north though) I'd like to try this map on Deity as well (never played that difficulty level).

 

[Revent]

So I did an elepult rush towards Brennus. I remember Seraiel once saying 10 elephants and 5 cats at 500BC is a reasonable army size. Perhaps that was for marathon speed I started war around 400BC and capped him at around 350AD. Took me ages and I was completely backwards on tech by the end of it, he even managed to get LB's towards the end of the war which was annoying.

Spoiler Brennus Caps :

At 600AD, Darius discovered Lib. Is that a normal date and at 900AD he had OU built and was researching Corps.

Spoiler 600AD :

He also had corporations at 900AD

Spoiler 900AD :

At 1190AD, I managed to win a diplomatic victory. If I didn't win, I had a steel monopoly and would have bribed everyone else to join in against Darius considering we were all religious zealots

Spoiler Victory :

 

[Fippy]

Well done, winning on deity is always great

10 Jumbos + 5 Cats is not really balanced imo, normally you want ~50% of your army being siege cos those are the units you sacrifice.
Did you add some Axes? Cheaper cleanup units are good to increase numbers, and they protect vs. Spears.
My suggestion would be 7 Jumbos, 8 Cats and 3 Axes as better starting army goal.

600AD Lib is actually rather slow, for deity AIs
Usually you are in danger of losing Lib starting at around 250-300AD.

 

[Revent]

Well done, winning on deity is always great

10 Jumbos + 5 Cats is not really balanced imo, normally you want ~50% of your army being siege cos those are the units you sacrifice.
Did you add some Axes? Cheaper cleanup units are good to increase numbers, and they protect vs. Spears.
My suggestion would be 7 Jumbos, 8 Cats and 3 Axes as better starting army goal.

600AD Lib is actually rather slow, for deity AIs
Usually you are in danger of losing Lib starting at around 250-300AD.

Thank you! I did have 2 axes and a spear as well somewhere in my stack although the axes were built after the start of the war. In total, I had 30 elephants and 20 cats built by the end of the war although most did die and all cats were dead.

Wow, I think I just need to play a lot more to remember the key gambits, trade baits and key dates. I was surprised by the the tech speed whereas in my previous warm up emperor game, I comfortably got lib after 1000AD.

 

[Revent]

This is a strong start, I wouldn't wait until someone to attack me. HA rush on Qin as suggested could be nice. Elepult on Brennus is definitely a good option Attack your close neighbor is a principle you should follow
You have to be more careful with happiness here. Settling east next to these Pigs while researching your military tech is what I would do.
You have a wonderful land here (lacks some food north though) I'd like to try this map on Deity as well (never played that difficulty level).

This is a good map for starting deity imo. I've not played Civ in a long time and I was able to win and I'm not exactly the best of players so you've got a good chance too.