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Diary of a Prime Minister's Aide: The Second Age of Rebirth

Discussion in 'Fall from Heaven Lore' started by Dean_the_Young, Nov 29, 2009.

  1. Lone Wolf

    Lone Wolf Chieftain

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    Wow, the AI's are really pathetic. Guess that's the effect of these OP animals everyone talks about in the RiFE subforum?

    And the Grigori are indeed masters of making excuses for their ruthless subjugation of all the peoples of Erebus.
     
  2. Dean_the_Young

    Dean_the_Young Chieftain

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    Pretty sure it's just a mix of Warlord* difficulty and the End of Winter selection. Plus, as a matter of style and for the Grigori, I always beeline writing, which allows me to catch up with most research areas that other people bee-line to. Adventurers with combat 5 plus heroic promotions provide my early-game defense. So while everyone starts slow, by the time the Ice recedes I already have the foundations for tech growth.

    Now, don't get me wrong, strength 12 cave bears are impressive any point of the game, and the Svartalfar had/have half a dozen beasts outside their borders, but mostly I just beelined writing, expanded early, and the rest flew from there.


    *I'm less interested in a challenge than having fun completing the game, and I've found that Warlord is usually about the point where AI doesn't just build giant stacks of doom and nothing else.

    Ruthless? Ruthless?

    I, sir, am offended: I am quite a tolerant player.

    (Even if a bit unexperienced with Tolerant mechanics. I really should have promoted Kimble to assassin in Amurite lands, not Ljosalfar: the Amurite assassins are far superior.)
     
  3. Lone Wolf

    Lone Wolf Chieftain

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    I take they've merged Sephi's AI prematurely? The non-Sephi's AI is quite acceptable for me at Monarch/Emperor in the army size regard. At least in base FfH.

    The AI's in your game seem to not build much of anything, anyway.
     
  4. Valkrionn

    Valkrionn The Hamster King

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    Sephi's AI is actually NOT merged.
     
  5. Lone Wolf

    Lone Wolf Chieftain

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    Then I'm quite mystified as to what Dean considers a "gigantic stack of doom".

    Anyway, let the whole Erebus be under the tolerant Grigori rule.
     
  6. Dean_the_Young

    Dean_the_Young Chieftain

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    Way smaller than most people's here, to be sure. Any stack over 20, really. That's where I draw my limit. I'm a builder in general, medium-small-army in general, and while I got along in base Civ well enough, the fact that FFH is so biased to huge armies is probably my least favorite aspect. Especially in a double-reward promotion system, where nearly everything becomes pure fodder for your few well-promoted units.

    So while I can have fun even in larger war-mods like Next War, where even the best promoted units are still reasonable, something in FFH2 turns me off against constant military unit building. It just seems pointless unless it's a hero: hey, here's a new fodder. If you're aggressive, you might start with enough XP that he might actually deal damage.

    Every. Single. Unit.


    I do try to oblige...
     
  7. Lone Wolf

    Lone Wolf Chieftain

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    I'd recommend slower XP option and tweaking the difficulty levels so that the AI's will be discouraged from building units (increasing the AITrainPercent, UnitUpkeepPercent).

    Mind you, "FfH is biased to huge armies" and "building non-heroic units is pointless" is a bit contradictory.
     
  8. Dean_the_Young

    Dean_the_Young Chieftain

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    Not sure what slower XP would effect the promotion bonus, but I might try that next time (though it will make fort commanders and workers more of a chore).

    Where would I go to tweak build percent and train percents? I don't think I'd be adverse to lowering AI train percent far lower, and Unitupkeep could be doubled or trippled in my view. It should be expensive to support units outside borders, especially with primitive logistics trains.




    By that I mean it's pointless to build units except as fodder, except for the few strongest. I'm certainly a fan general promotions and situational advantages in general, but FFH takes promotions too far. The only real use for non-best units is as cannon fodder against the enemies best units, to weaken them to a point where your best units can take out theirs and steamroll themselves. Otherwise, combat five anything/combat 1+ anti unit type can crush almost any lower promoted unit, even higher tier.

    It's too virtuous a cycle, and only heroes really stand a good means to counter eachother. Which is why the only other alternative is huge stacks of units, to overwhelm them solely by weight of numbers.


    Meh. I'm not being clear, and I know it. I should have said 'building hero units are the only things that have a real chance of surviving, everything else is fodder.'
     
  9. Lone Wolf

    Lone Wolf Chieftain

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    XML\Gameinfo\Civ4HandicapInfo. <iAITrainPercent> tag is the percentage amount of hammers AI needs to build a unit relative to the human (higher numbers = units are harder to build for the AI). <iAIUnitCostPercent> tag - how much money in percentage the AI pays for its units.

    f you're going to do what you're proposing, I think that the AI needs more bonuses vs. barbs, to escape being PWNed by them in the early game. They are <iAIAnimalBonus> and <iAIBarbarianBonus>, I believe. Negative numbers make AI life easier, positive ones make it harder. Though I don't know how that affects the split barbarian factions of most modmods.

    Collateral and mass damage spells tend to mitigate it a bit for me. Fireballs/Cats/Maelstroms FTW! Non-best units should be used as a mopping-up team after the mass cat/spell damage harmed the enemy stack to the point of these units having okayish odds after your hero/few highly nurtured units destroy the few units in the enemy stack that are still able to offer some resistance after mass damage swarm. Unless you are fighting an Apocalypse Pony or an AI hero, in which case they are indeed fodder. But such cases are rare, because heroes can't be everywhere at once and the AI's are being rather bad at using their heroes and nurturing powerful units in general. The experience diversity of an AI army is rather low.

    Mass damage is the key.

    Maybe the AI xp bonus at higher levels contributes to your "fodder" feeling?
     
  10. Dean_the_Young

    Dean_the_Young Chieftain

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    Grigori Picture 1.jpg

    Kalm is founded. With Kalm, the North, or the East of the North, is pretty firmly settled; there isn't much else unique to the North to claim, and future efforts will likely chain west and south, bringing our empire closer together.

    Still, Kalm provides an important gain: as our settlement solidifies and its borders expand, we will be in possession of lucrative iron deposits. By the time our mages finish their study of sorcery and master ironworking, we will be in a position to exploit those mines for iron weapons.

    ---

    Grigori Picture 2.jpg

    South of the Jotnar, the land of giants, are a people of marginally lesser stature. The Khazad dwarves inhabit a continent, and have developed it well.

    Firm followers of the Earthmother, soldiers of Kilimorph make a great portion of their ranks. We observe an easy peace with them, for now: however, we already speak to convince them to dedicate their lives to themselves, and not to god or gold.

    ---

    Grigori Picture 3.jpg

    West of the Svartalfar lands lies a a continent inhabited by a people calling themselves the Mechanos. They are equal parts admirable and horrifying: while they renounce all gods, they merely place that devotion and unquestioning faith into their rickety machines. Their gods are their own creations, though they have so much to offer otherwise.

    Their minds, their ability to work without need of the Gods, could be a great inspiration for our people. When our caraval returns to port, we will send Kimble and another Adventurer to their continent, to show them just what can be done by mortals who follow gods, real or artificial. Perhaps then they will understand.

    ---

    Grigori Picture 4.jpg

    Having finally sent a ship to the north of the Calabim lands, we have found their northern neighbors, the Kuriotates. They are led by a centaur named Yakut, and rule from just one massive metropolis. Even so, I wonder how well they compare to their southern neighbors.

    ---

    Grigori Picture 5.jpg

    The last nation of Erebus, the Bannor. Escaped from the flames and ashes of hell, it seems as if their continent remains trapped in a perpetual blizzard: they only recently have organized for another settlement, and remain malnourished and impoverished.

    Though our cities our busy now, we will soon organize a relief effort: ships to carry men and material, and soldiers to guard these brave souls.


    Post Scriptim: The Prime Minister woke suddenly last night with a loud cry, struck by a strange dream. He dreamnt of starlight and fire, and did so on the eve of our discovery of the Bannor. Hearing of the Prime Minister's fears, Comillo has volunteered to lead an initial expedition to those lands, maps of which the Bannor refuse to share with us.
     
  11. FireBlaze

    FireBlaze Chieftain

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    Thanks Dean. Now anytime says they're coming to help me, I assume that they're coming to destroy my entire (Whatever I'm using). You should be more honest about your warmongering policies :lol:
     
  12. Dean_the_Young

    Dean_the_Young Chieftain

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    Well, just between you and me, this is the first of a three-game series, and the only one I'm doing a conquest victory for.

    Think of it as setting the stage for numbers 2 and 3...
     
  13. Lone Wolf

    Lone Wolf Chieftain

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    That game inspired me to think about removing the Tolerant trait from the Elohim and giving it to the Grigori. The Grirori uniting all the cultures of Erebus in their Mistheist crusade sounds very poetic.

    Let the Elohim get the TweakMod improvements, as well as some other stuff.
     
  14. Valkrionn

    Valkrionn The Hamster King

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    I don't like it on all Grigori, but yes, this leader was basically designed around it. Way back when Notque's 'Minor Leader' mod was active. ;)
     
  15. Dean_the_Young

    Dean_the_Young Chieftain

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    Quick question: Does Tolerant allow temples (besides Pagan Temple substitutes) to be built in foreign cities? In another game, I'm looking for a Altar victory, and while I still go by the logic Lunnotar = Altar stage, more GP would be nice enough.
     
  16. Valkrionn

    Valkrionn The Hamster King

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    .......I think so. It won't allow you to adopt a religion, but Grigori can't build temples because they have NONE as a UB for all of them. I'd assume that since Grigori UU/UB's are ignored in conquered cities, then yes, you can.
     
  17. Lone Wolf

    Lone Wolf Chieftain

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    In base FfH at least, to build a temple you need the tech of respective religion. Since Grigori are forbidden to research religion-founding techs except Honor and Deception, they can build only Empyrean temples in conquered cities. And if you disallow them these techs, they they'll be able to build none.
     
  18. Dean_the_Young

    Dean_the_Young Chieftain

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    Grigori Picture 1.jpg

    Today marked the first, and last, meeting of Undercouncil, though we did not know it at the time. With the Khazad, we pledged funds to joint research projects and to develop protections against intellectual theft.

    Grigori Picture 2.jpg

    Tya Kiri, though dethroned as ruler of the Amurites, has been the most vocal supporter, and her genius alone nearly mastered Arcane Lore just as our smiths were finishing the understanding of Iron Working. Such a feat inspired another Great Sage who has tried to follow in Tya Kiri's footsteps by creating an Academy in the city of Costa de Sol.

    Grigori Picture 3.jpg

    ---

    Grigori Picture 4.jpg

    On the island of the Mechanos, the strange inventors have not been impressed by our Adventurers who have come among them. They were, however, willing to listen to our offers of membership in our alliance of city states, but only after we could prove that we had things to teach them.

    Several contests and challenges were set up, with lethal consequences for failure. Tricks and traps around their city must be overcome, and after a grueling challenge course our champions must best theirs in single combat.

    Even Kimble the Quick has been slowed, though eventually he would master avoiding the Mechanos steam-powered rapid-fire archery traps.

    ---

    Grigori Picture 5.jpg

    A strange, strange man was found in Kalm today. Wearing otherworldly clothes and constantly muttering to himself, he wandered Midgard for hours talking to himself before the city guard took him off the streets.

    I met the man, but he barely paid me any heed. He was fixated on the past, even asking about Cassiel. Our healers suspect some bump on the head of some sort.

    Regardless, he's brilliant. He handles some of the most complex Mechanos gadgets as if they were archaic, but he's literate and extremely capable in math and basic alchemy.

    I think Prime Minister Esirce is intrigued by such a strange face; the man is currently being housed in the palace until some better place for him can be found.

    ---

    Grigori Picture 6.jpg

    The last of the Mechanos trials have been completed, and as promised they have agreed to integrate themselves into our nation after a period of transition.

    Maeer, the leader of the Mechanos, took his leave with a group of other stalwarts and left into the wilderness once the final contest's results became obvious. I don't think we've seen the last of him and his branch of the Mechanos, by any means.

    ---

    Grigori Picture 8.jpg

    After his ship was diverted by Kraken, Comillo landed far south on the continent of the Bannor. Far south indeed, at the source of the Southern Lights that can be seen across the land.

    When he emerged from the twilight, he was not alone: a most beautiful woman followed him, having pledged service to our cause. She is Brigit, the ArchAngel of fire.

    Brigit and Comillo make their way to the Bannor. With Brigit's flames, warming those chilled lives will be easy.

    ---

    Grigori Picture 9.jpg

    In Celo, the former Sidar capital, Alchemists studying the nature of the Sidar waning have made another discovery of sickness and health.

    Mary, an orphaned girl who may or may not have been abducted for those experiments, has been taken into the custody of the state. She is on her way to Midgard as we speak, guarded by a small garrison.

    Prime Minister Esirce confided to me that he hopes the same processes that tied sickness to her body could be reversed, to spread health instead. I barely did not call him a fool.

    ---

    Grigori Picture 10.jpg

    Hephaestus has betrayed us!

    The Jotnar have spent this time in the process of Liberating the old armies of Mulcarn. They could only have intended to send them against us, for there is no other foe on the continent.

    Taranis, ArchAngel of Ice, has appeared on our continent, east of the Ljosalfar. It was barren lands already, now made frozen, but they are most mountainous lands indeed.

    Though we have not fired the first shots of this new war, we have not forgotten what Mulcarn's descendants did to our people. Taranis is no different. We are recalling our heroes, and Brigit. While some of our Champions are already in the east, at a recently established fort outside the Jotnar lands, many have to be called from overseas. We are training adepts to deal with frozen lands, and will build catapults to break down the ice walls.

    But before that, the Jotnar will fall.
     
  19. Valkrionn

    Valkrionn The Hamster King

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    One thing: Maer is actually a female leader. ;)
     
  20. Dean_the_Young

    Dean_the_Young Chieftain

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    Then why do you have a standard-bioshen-male picture for the leader? :confused:
     

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