Diplo victory help needed

[Big Firework]

I recently got kind of bored of Domination/Conquest victories, so I'm trying to refine my Diplomacy skills.

I just won a game (actually the most recent Monarch Student game) via the UN, but it took a few reloads to get Gilgamesh to Friendly. He was picky (I signed an unnecessary Defensive Pact with Louis and Giggles did not abide...the extra -1 knocked him down to Pleased).

What I'd like to know is if there's a spreadsheet or article that lists exactly what you need to do in order to get a leader to Furious, Annoyed, Cautious, Pleased or Friendly with you.

It seems that it varies by leader. Gilgamesh needed to be at like a +8 or 9 I think to go to Friendly, whereas Hammy seemed to flip to Friendly at +6 or 7 or something. I could have that wrong.

Also, do you need a Friendly relationship to get any leader's Diplomatic victory votes? Will any of them do it at Pleased? I think I saw that all of them need to be at +7 for a Diplo vote, but Giggles was at +7 and still only Pleased in this game, so he still wouldn't vote for me.

One last question for now: Is there a way to see how much population the other Civs have without counting the population of their cities manually? I can see one Civ's population percentage in the victory conditions screen, but I'd like to know if there's a way to see the smaller Civ's pops so that I can tabulate how many votes I will/won't be getting.

 

[CarlH]

If u use the bug mod, it has a good prediction of the likely outcome of UN and AP votes in the victories screen. This will help with the later part of your question. As to the former, you will have to wait for someone more knowledgable than I to respond.

 

[BigTime]

+8 is the minimum including hidden modifiers.

 

[Big Firework]

What kind of hidden modifiers are there?

 

[BigTime]

These are the five that I copy-pasted from DaveMcW's Show Hidden Attitude Mod

First Impression: A combination of iBaseAttitude, iBasePeaceWeight, iPeaceWeightRand, iWarmongerRespect, and iAttitudeChange.
Team Size: The AIs don't like permanent alliances or unbalanced teams. Unless they are on the best team!
High Score: Several AIs care about who has the better score.
Low Score: AIs are more willing to cooperate if you are both on the bottom half of the scoreboard.
Losing War: Losing a war makes AIs mad.

Basically, first impression is the innate +/- that the AI has. Montezuma for example, has an innate -2. Team Size is usually irrelevant for normal games, but with permanent alliances enabled, if they are on a losing team, you get a demerit. Some AIs care if you have a higher score than them, giving a demerit diplomatically. Some AIs care if you have a lower score than them, giving a positive diplo point or two. Last, if you have more war success than an AI, it gives demerits.

I believe there is also an innate -1 for any level noble and above.

 

[Izmir Stinger]

Team Size is usually irrelevant for normal games, but with permanent alliances enabled, if they are on a losing team, you get a demerit.

With teams it isn't about winning or loosing, its about how balanced the teams are. If you have a permanent AI ally then your team size is 2. If an AI is by himself, his team size is 1. He would then have a hidden -1 towards you for the disparity.