Discussion on what makes levels easier

[ANewGuy]

Good thread, I have always said that "true difficulty" is a mixture of many game factors, which include difficulty level, play speed, leader traits, map, etc.

Of course, individual play preferences also play a role. Speaking for myself, I do better on watery maps where I can build the GLH and REX to reasonable islands and lots of coastal sites on the main land mass. I do less well on Pangaea type maps with lots of AIs right in my face.

Eh. I tried playing Watery Non-Isolated maps, didn't do to well. But make it Isolated, and suddenly, I may not be the power leader, but I out-tech everybody and have the infrastructure and tech to out-military Shaka or Monty in a matter of turns. (IE: Rifles and Cannons vs. Muskets/Maces and Cats)

So IMO: Watery Non-Isolated - +.5, Watery Isolated - -.5

 

[r_rolo1]

I would put that exactly reversed

 

[ANewGuy]

Heh.

I'm learning to Warmonger, but I usually end up reverting to peaceful building tactics if my leader isn't Aggressive or have a Classical/Rennasance UU for Warfare. So my military just fogbusts until Astronomy, upon which I send out Caravels (Usually with Confucain Missionaries abord) to meet everybody.

Then I weigh my options and decide how to handle my enemies. Be it the Gun or Diplomacy.

 

[r_rolo1]

Watery non isolated is all about trade routes, so it is rather simple after some practice games with the GLH. And AI is dreadful in water wars

 

[ANewGuy]

Hm.

I can't say that I'm dreadful in Naval Assult myself, and I don't have to deal with BTS 3.17 siege issue (I only play vanilla), but I find my enemies to be a bother.

Got DoWed by Louis at Cautious while I was preparing Military to defend (Saw "We Have Enough on our Hands" a little too late... :/) so he came over and pillaged me. Also got beat to the GLH. First attempt on Noble, about a week ago.

My basic Isolation Strategy: REX, Fogbust, GLH, Collossus, Found Confucainism/Taoism en route to Liberalism, taking Astronomy (Usually)

From there, tech to Rifles/Canons if I have an aggressive opponent, Marines/SEALS and Artillary if I don't. Build up the navy, and prepare for war against the strongest enemy. Use a 3-pronged attack against their costal cities, and fight it out.

 

[Dirk1302]

I haven't played too much watery non isolated maps but together with the GLH and clumsy ais who can't wage war over waters effectively it's at least a level easier. This is imo the easiest map to play.

I like isolated and below Deity i think that it makes the game a tad easier there always comes that point after getting astro that your research rate explodes and you just catch up, since they never knew you WFYABTA is almost never a problem also. Playing Deity it depends on the others a lot, you'll be very much behind on first contact and if there are strong AIs like Zara or for instance MM with some good lands it'll probably just be too difficult too catch up. If it's all warmongers i'd like an isolated start on Deity as well.

 

[r_rolo1]

Beleive me, AI is dreadful in complex enviroment wars ( like watery ones, since this is a all land game ( unfortunately ) ). And it has a bad reinforcement code ( The first transports will go home if they can and only come back if they are all filled because AI will not degroup them ...it is written in the code ), making that the first wave of attackers will probably never be reinforced in that war. If you can hold the first attack, you won the war..... besides the fact that the AI will rarely re-embark a SoD for attacking other landmass.

 

[ANewGuy]

Heh. Is that something that I would only notice on Monarch/Emperor?

When I've been DoWed (Except for the Louis incident), I had Battleships to pick off all of the transports and escorts as they came. :/

 

[civvver]

The earth 18 civs scenario with rome is like -8 difficulty. Immortal would be like a 1.

 

[ANewGuy]

I've only played 18 Civs as America. I detest the Incans, and it's the closest one can come to Isolation on that map.

But Rome in general should be -2 if you're any good at warmongering.

 

[r_rolo1]

I would put Earth 18 civs as +1 if you're playing the Incas

 

[ANewGuy]

Yes. That starting location is absolutely crap.

Just for fun, I used World Builder to put another mountain in there, completely cutting them off from the rest of South America.

And after Rushing Monty, I had all of the Americas to myself.

 

[civvver]

Yes. That starting location is absolutely crap.

Just for fun, I used World Builder to put another mountain in there, completely cutting them off from the rest of South America.

And after Rushing Monty, I had all of the Americas to myself.

Even still America can be challenging. You get crappy trade routes with capac, so you really can't rex all of n. and s. america or you'll tank your economy. The only way to get ahead in tech is by well planned research, taking things the AI usually won't have and then trading to backfill techs and money once you make contact with the old world. I wouldn't say it's exactly hard to win as a new world civ on earth18, but the old world civs are easier.

 

[ANewGuy]

Heh.

When I play 18 Civs, my computer lags pretty badly by the time Monty dies and I have 6 cities. So I don't ever get there.

That's why I don't play Huge Maps.

 

[Bleys]

Eh. I tried playing Watery Non-Isolated maps, didn't do to well. But make it Isolated, and suddenly, I may not be the power leader, but I out-tech everybody and have the infrastructure and tech to out-military Shaka or Monty in a matter of turns. (IE: Rifles and Cannons vs. Muskets/Maces and Cats)

So IMO: Watery Non-Isolated - +.5, Watery Isolated - -.5

I would put that exactly reversed

So would I. I dont go so far as to make it -1 that Dirk does, but I will concede -.75. Of course, I actually worked on playing these starts quite a bit, playing M&S maps with nearly every leader and building the GLH with them all to get a feel for each trait/starting techs/situational combo.

One thing I think a lot of people dont realize, if you use the Random Script to choose your maps, you are far more likely to get a non-isolated watery start than an all-land one. There are a LOT of water maps in the pool, M&S, B&S, Arch, even Fractal is not hard to play as a Coastal REX GLH based game. I personally think the GLH is more powerful than the Pyramids, because it allows me to REX more cities, grabbing more land, while maintaining a fairly healthy economy for research.

 

[ANewGuy]

By Random Script, do you mean the "Shuffle" option?

 

[r_rolo1]

He means Refar Random script , not shuffle.

 

[ANewGuy]

Oh.


Something with BTS, I assume, because I don't see it in Vanilla.

 

[r_rolo1]

From BtS , patch 3.17 .... it is a expanded shuffle.

 

[ANewGuy]

Ok.

I don't really know much of the Changelog except for what's been explicitly mentioned in games like the RPCs and ALCs, or that Deity game.