DMOC's Immortal Game #1 - Playing as Darius I

[DMOC]

Probably there is bunch of builders in another continent, and Lizzy is already trading with them. Maybe you could steal her map to get more detailed information?

Internet beeline seems only viable strategy. After settling whole continent you should be able to mass enough units to kill Lizzy, and then head for space.

Don't give up!

I don't think Liz has met them as she refuses to trade me any technologies.

Oh yeah, I won't give up.

-820 AD is very early for lib on immortal
-Your GNP is hanging because you're not improving your capital anymore running scientists there. A bit of a waste imo since there's no NE and no pacificm bonus there. Particularly with a financial civ and a good capital spot like this i'd go cottages, monarchy (HR), academy and growing as big as possible asap. Your capital could have been generating 150-200 beakers/turn now

I usually research Lit before CS, it isn't so much about the GL which is nice if you get it. The NE is extremely important,if the capital has grown to size 12-15 you can generate 100+ GPP/turn in combination with pacificm. My first 2 scientists come from 2 scientists in other cities, one for academy (unless the capital is very bad), the other bulbs philo.
I almost never bulb paper, this tech is too cheap.

So I'm assuming that firing the scientists, working the cottages, and growing the capial to at LEAST size 12 should be a goal of mine next round (perhaps switch to HR?). This means that I will probably stop researching Education, and go for Aesthetcs/Lit for the epics and use the next GS to bulb the rest of Education

 

[Lucky Charms]

You have a vast amount of territory under your control. Once the remainder of your continent is settled and brought up to speed, your research will increase massively and hopefully allow you to narrow the tech gap.

Do you plan on wiping out Elizabeth? You should consider when to do so. The dilemna being you will fall farther behind in technology with a war but will have even more turf to consolidate your gains. You could be without a trading partner for a while, though with the advanced level of the AIs on the other continent it is unlikely that it will be long before they find you.

On that point, you may want to wipe out Elizabeth before the other AIs initiate contact with her as you may suffer a political demerit for "You declared war on our friend".

I cannot look at the save as I do not have Beyond the Sword. Best of luck.

P.S. I bet it's Huayna across the sea.

 

[DMOC]

You have a vast amount of territory under your control. Once the remainder of your continent is settled and brought up to speed, your research will increase massively and hopefully allow you to narrow the tech gap.

Do you plan on wiping out Elizabeth? You should consider when to do so. The dilemna being you will fall farther behind in technology with a war but will have even more turf to consolidate your gains. You could be without a trading partner for a while, though with the advanced level of the AIs on the other continent it is unlikely that it will be long before they find you.

On that point, you may want to wipe out Elizabeth before the other AIs initiate contact with her as you may suffer a political demerit for "You declared war on our friend".

I cannot look at the save as I do not have Beyond the Sword. Best of luck.

P.S. I bet it's Huayna across the sea.

Yes, that was one of my guesses. Fits the them of the game, means 4 financial civs.

My guesses on other continent: Huayna Capac, Willem van Orange, Frederick, and Mehmed II. I eliminaed Mansa Musa as he could have gotten some religions and also Gandhi for the same reason as well.

But I will see soon.

 

[Quotey]

Oh man, the person who got Lib probably took Divine Right with it. Just rubbing it in your face.

 

[Dirk1302]

So I'm assuming that firing the scientists, working the cottages, and growing the capial to at LEAST size 12 should be a goal of mine next round (perhaps switch to HR?). This means that I will probably stop researching Education, and go for Aesthetcs/Lit for the epics and use the next GS to bulb the rest of Education

Agreed, switch to HR and grow to 16-20 working all the cottages. Switch to aest, lit for NE i don't know if you have a second food rich city if so build NE there otherwise in capital the need to get some GS's supercedes even the need for working cottages. But don't run them before you can really run 6+ of them in one go.You'll want to go back to working cottages asap. Use the first scientist for academy. You can use the second for education or research edu manually using the scientist on PP.Or bulb both if you get NE up soon enough.On average in my own games i need 6 GS. academy,philo half of edu, half of lib, most of PP and half of chemistry,after that i'm not that interested anymore and switch out of pacifism reverting to working tiles.

 

[Tyrant Roger]

Agreed. Switch to Aesthetics and Lit. Build NE. Bulb Ed.

Rex continent before other civs arrive. It won't be long because they will have Optics and caravels soon if not already.

Take out Liz with Rifles and Cannon, but it could be costly if she has Redcoats by then.

Once you secure continent, go into space. Be careful who you first trade with when the other AI's arrive.

Spread state religion to all cities if not there yet.

 

[DMOC]

Oh man, the person who got Lib probably took Divine Right with it. Just rubbing it in your face.

Yes, I believe that's what the tech he/she took. Really bad decision, could have been much worse if they took Printing Press.

Agreed, switch to HR and grow to 16-20 working all the cottages. Switch to aest, lit for NE i don't know if you have a second food rich city if so build NE there otherwise in capital the need to get some GS's supercedes even the need for working cottages. But don't run them before you can really run 6+ of them in one go.You'll want to go back to working cottages asap. Use the first scientist for academy. You can use the second for education or research edu manually using the scientist on PP.Or bulb both if you get NE up soon enough.On average in my own games i need 6 GS. academy,philo half of edu, half of lib, most of PP and half of chemistry,after that i'm not that interested anymore and switch out of pacifism reverting to working tiles.

I will plan on chopping the National Epic in P'yongyang, which has more food than the capital does.

And next round, I will TRY to get my capital to grow to a high population ASAP.

Agreed. Switch to Aesthetics and Lit. Build NE. Bulb Ed.

Rex continent before other civs arrive. It won't be long because they will have Optics and caravels soon if not already.

Take out Liz with Rifles and Cannon, but it could be costly if she has Redcoats by then.

Once you secure continent, go into space. Be careful who you first trade with when the other AI's arrive.

Spread state religion to all cities if not there yet.

I'd better hurry and bulb Printing Press with at least 1 of my great scientsts so I can get to Rifling first...AND I need Nationalism for drafting...eek....

Oh yeah, and I'm 100% sure the other continent already has optics. Liz has it and she doesn't even have Paper yet while the other continent has Liberalism, etc.

 

[DMOC]

I have been coordinating and participating in a bunch of sports tournaments this weekend and will not be updating, unfortnately (or anytime soon until after the June 7/8 weekend). I have also been writing my "French Struggle" story and will be focused on that for a little while.


Any more advice? Specifically, anything referring to the 4 questions I asked in the last round would be greatly appreciated.

 

[DMOC]

Posting again in this thread, but it won't be an update.

I apologize about the length of time between the last update and now, but mainly, I wanted to ask some questions.

1. I had to restore my computer, and therefore had to reinstall everything, such as Civilization 4 and the expansion. However, I try to install BtS and I get "aborting installation" after the game checks for the most updated patch...and spend the next two frustrating hours trying to figure out what is wrong before I figure this out. Hopefully, though, saved games are kept from reinstalling, right?

2. I am suspecting that the source of my computer problems may have come from some of the patches I downloaded on this forum for either Vanilla or Beyond the Sword Civilization 4. I am anxious about downloading any patches and I do not think I will re-update to 3.13 and Bruhric's patch for BtS. Will I be able to continue this game?

3. If I can't continue this game, would you like another game? I can post updates faster during the summer when I have more free time.

 

[humppa]

3. If I can't continue this game, would you like another game?

imo, always a pleasure to read these threads.

 

[Crowqueen]

A shame, but another one would be interesting.

If you can wean me off my Mysticism -> Stonehenge gambit with a good start, then please start one.

 

[Killroyan]

What was the logic behind razing putan? It was well placed, had 2 good resources, was on a river and would have been productive from the first moment with its size 10. Economy wasn't in shambles, distance to the capital was ok, so I am a bit puzzled about that. Other then that solid play so far although liberalism in 820 is really really early and you do have some monster science cities (3 gem mines, woot). Keep it up. And now get rid of the english.

 

[DMOC]

Looking back, I know now that it was a mistake to raze Pusan. Well, what can I say? We all make them...

I am actually thinking of discontinuing the game because of issues with uninstalling/reinstalling/not reinstalling bruhrics and 3.13 patches. I currently can't install BtS because there are MORE computer problems but once I do, I will likely switch to a different leader but still post an immortal game.


Maybe Boudica on a Pangea map?

 

[Killroyan]

That would be too bad DMOC because this game is really nice but it is your call. I can understand why you want to patch up so Boudica on a pangea map sounds really nice. I still can't get her to work for some reason so teach me a trick or two.

 

[DMOC]

Bonus Round: To 1887 AD [End Game]

Okay, so it seems that I am somewhat an idiot, and forgot that I have some saves uploaded on this thread!

I decided to continue this game just to see what would happen. I didn't hpost an 820 AD save so I went back to a save somewhere in the early AD's where I was still warring with Wang so that I could correct some of the mistakes I made.

Actually, the two things which I mainly focused on was:

1. Keeping Pusan and Cheju
2. GROWING THE CAPITAL (this was a critical one--I learned my lesson and from now on I will make sure to grow the capital in the middle ages).

And I also apologize in advance since this "round" covers pretty much the whole game from the mid AD's to 1887 AD (read on to find out what happened). I didn't really have time to focus on detail as I'm already playing my second online game (Boudica).

So what happened?

Well, the war proceeded as normal, but I kept Wang's last two cities. In another great fortune for me, Hinduism automatically spread to P'yongyang so Pacifism would work there! I managed to get a GS to bulb Education (Researched Paper and Philosophy manually).

The weird thing was, I won the Liberalism race in 1080 AD.

It was a very close race. Elizabeth was almost there herself and Willem, who I had just met, was even closer. In fact, I won by ONE SINGLE TURN (I reloaded and stopped research and Willem discovered Liberalism the turn after). Willem, by the way, was definitely the AI who won Liberalism in my other game in 820 AD. And he did this with only 5 cities.

After Liberalism, I started meeting the civs on the other continent, which were Willem (Cre/Fin), Huayna Capac (Fin/Ind), Ramesses II (Spi/Ind), and Joao II (Imp/Exp). I REALLY hate Huayna and Joao, and these games proved to be no exception.

My fears in the early game were confirmed when EVERYONE on the other continent was Jewish, making one big happy family. Willem actually converted to Free Religion because he had the S. Paya and wouldn't you know it -- Joao declared war on him. The war was a cakewalk for him. In the beginning of the game, Joao had outrexed everyone and had about 15-ish cities while Huayna had 8 and Willem had 5. Over time, Joao obviously managed to take advantage of his extra land and soon reduced Willem to 2 cities.

(Yes, Willem was reduced to 5 cities and STILL was the tech leader until I built the internet. Creative AI's are even more powerful than I thought.)

Now for Huayna and Ramesses, they were also quite advanced (though Ram didn't know Code of Laws until 1300) and had defensive pacts together, so I knew that I would have to do something to stop them in the future.

Now, after I discovered Liberalism, I began to expand, razing/resettling barbarian cities and growing the cottage economy. I teched towards Astronomy as I needed the trade routes and no one had it (that actually was my lifeline--discovering technologies that no one else had and trading). After Astronomy, I went for monopoly techs like Scientific Methold, Steel, Steam Power, and Radio. I was still woefully behind in GNP as you can see when I discovered Steam Power in the following screenshot.

And radio:

I HATE it when other civs on a continent are all friendly.

I did manage to get some wonders in Seoul, my Ironworks city.

Now before I built the Eiffel Tower, Willem had already completed Apollo Program in 1740 AD. These Immortal AI's are crazy.

Oh yeah, Joao II decided he didn't like me and declared war. Oh joy. Thankfully, he only pillaged some of my fishing boats (with destroyers!) while he never loaded a single troop onto my land. Easiest war ever. And soon, he went back to declaring on Willem.

I really couldn't afford an AI to assault me overseas, so I signed this lovely deal with my friendly neighbor who I never attacked.

With me woefully behind in tech, it made sense to go for the internet (which after all is a lifesaver in high levels). I beelined to Computers and was the first there.

Tech before/after:

[To be continued in next post]

 

[DMOC]

[Continued from previous post]

After the Internet, I researched Fiber Optics and went for Fusion to get the free Great Engineer. I already had 4 other great people before the engineer, so I managed to get 2 successive golden ages, really helping me kickstart my space race.

Now, it wasn't the nice, relaxing cruise I thought it would be. You see, Huayna had kind of sorta decided he wanted to attempt a cultural victory. I did some math and found out that Huayna would probably get to a culture win before I won by space, so I had to do something.

First of all, I focused all my espionage points on him.

Second of all....

Then a few years later...

Ramesses II and Huayna had a defensive pact and were ultra-friendly towards each other. So how did this happen? I sent a crapload of spies over and one of them succeeded in converting Huayna to Free Religion, meaning that he and Ramesses II lost +7 in diplo.

And the wars weren't phony either. NINE great generals (I counted from the replay) were born on both side. The wars eventually resulted in Huayna vassaling Ramesses II and, for some reason, Willem also vassalized to Huayna (voluntarily IIRC). The good news, though, was that the wars reduced the rate of Huayna's culture victory, as he went from hundreds of culture per turn to less than a hundred in his top 3 cities. I also converted Huayna to State Property via espionage so that he wouldn't get the culture points from all the corporations he had.

Here is one last view of my glorious cottaged empire before I create workshops for the space race.

(And the map a few turns later.)

So did Huayna manage to get his culture victory?

Nope. He was a good 25,000 away from his third city which had been slowed down drastically on its quest to get 75,000 culture.

And finally, in 1887 AD:

My empire:

Oh dear, where have the cottages gone?!?

Other continent.

And some statistics.

The total game length was 12 hours and 44 minutes. This was my first space race victory on immortal level. It was fun!

 

[mystyfly]

Congraz on your win

It's kinda sad the game died out earlier but nice you played it out. I definitely understand you didn't want to play single rounds and sit another month on this game

 

[DMOC]

Yeah, considering I've got a succession game and a second immortal game here.



PS: Ramesses II's power graph is awesome.

 

[CivSetä]

Good job!!!

 

[hal08]

Just got around to reading this great report.

Not being able to trade much with Liz due to monopoly definetly slowed you down. A better approach would have been to try to get her to friendly so she would trade, as she is pretty easy to get along with. You had -2 for refusing to help her, but if you had given her Alphabet, would have been +1 for helping her and at least a couple of +modifiers for fair trade relations, which could get eventually to +4. Then another +1 or +2 for supplying resources. Some or all of this should have allowed tech trades.

Once you met the other civs you could decide if you wanted to keep her around or continue trading. The latter may have been better since you wouldn't run into WFYABTA and concentrate on developing the rest of your continent. Also once she changes to free religion, her favorite civic, you can also run it, keeping her happy while avoiding pissing off the other continent.