Does anyone else use lumbermills?

[GenocideBringer]

From what I've seen, everyone chops all their forests...why?

Lumbermills are great. +1 food +3 production is a pretty good tile in my opinion... You could argue that a workshop with state property would be better...but that doesn't take into account two things.

1) You need a special civic for it to be that good

2) No health bonus.



I still chop a bit to speed stuff up...but rarely all my forests. Besides, they give needed production to a commerce or GP city that may have no hills.

 

[grapedog]

im a tree hugger, so i like to leave trees hanging around if i can...especially the wintery trees. but thats just a personal quirk...not out of any bonuses or anything. i wish there was a mode for having trees near your city if you had enough could give you a health or happiness mod.

 

[Esox]

I like 'em myself. The railroad bonus is good too. But generally I only keep forests in the fat cross if I can tell from the early game that I will have health problems in the 'factory' era.

Or if I'm playing an OCC, but that's another story...

 

[malekithe]

Lumbermills are great. +1 food +3 production is a pretty good tile in my opinion... You could argue that a workshop with state property would be better...but that doesn't take into account two things.

If they really did give +1 food, they'd be a whole helluvalot more useful. Instead, at a measely +3 production, they're not of much value, especially since that forest could have been chopped centuries ago for much greater benefit.

 

[suspendinlight]

I chop very early when I need to speed something along, and then I just chop haphazardly when I want to build another improvement there. I generally chop forests from commerce/GP cities to cottage/farm (unless I'm having serious health problems), but leave them in production cities so I can eventually build lumbermills, which I have recently begun to like using.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

They don't give +1 Food

Just +3 Production (compared to a deforested tile)
exactly the same as a workshop with State Property

Admittedly, they require no Civic and give health, but they aren't that good of a tile.

and grapedog... try looking at the Environmentalism Civic (its a lousy Civic Otherwise)

 

[Esox]

i wish there was a mode for having trees near your city if you had enough could give you a health or happiness mod.

It's already in the game, hippie
Seriously, research Medicine and use Environmentalism. It sounds like just the thing you are looking for.

 

[Dr Elmer Jiggle]

How do you get +1 food from a lumbermill? +3 production is a bit misleading too. You get 1 from the forest itself, 1 from the lumbermill, and the third hammer doesn't come until you lay down a railroad.

I usually try to keep at least 2 forests in any production city. More if possible, but not if it's going to hurt early production. If there are tiles that won't be worked anyway, because I don't have the population, then they stay as forests.

In commerce or food oriented cities, I usually clearcut.

Hills are always chopped, since a mine gives exactly the same benefits that a lumbermill does but much sooner.

I usually chop any riverside tiles. You regain the lost commerce that way, and if you really wanted the production, you can replace the forest with a watermill. That gives you the same production benefits until Railroads plus additional food with State Property and/or commerce with Electricity.

 

[binhthuy71]

I chop selectively but I never clear cut unless there's a profound need for it. So I generally build lumbermills when they finally become available. It's not a strategy, it's that usually by that point in the game my Workers are leaning on their shovels and a few more hammers can't hurt.

 

[gunkulator]

For a non-river plain/forest or tundra/forest tile, a lumbermill is probably the best improvement. Chop the rest.

 

[Esox]

^ Good point about tundra forests. It's about the only way I ever manage to make use of tundra.

 

[suspendinlight]

Definately do not chop forest/tundra...you can't do anything with it besides build a farm if there is fresh water. I agree with most of what Dr. Jiggles says about mines vs. lumbermills. I only build lumbermills on production city hills when I found or capture a city late in the game and I have already discovered the lumbermills tech.

I usually chop any riverside tiles. You regain the lost commerce that way, and if you really wanted the production, you can replace the forest with a watermill.

Actually lumbermills get +1 P +1 C on river/forests, so you don't need to chop to get the +1 C.

 

[Dr Elmer Jiggle]

Actually lumbermills get +1 P +1 C on river/forests, so you don't need to chop to get the +1 C.

Right, but then you've lost that commerce for how ever many hundreds of turns it took you to get to Replaceable Parts. I wouldn't chop the riverside forest after Replaceable Parts (ex. in a captured city), but early in the game I'm not going to keep the forest there just because when 1850 rolls around I can get the commerce back.

 

[GenocideBringer]

You misunderstood me.

A forest with a lumbermill on grassland in total gives 1 food, 3 production. That's pretty good.

And you need SOME production for your commerce/GP cities. Forests are good for that purpose, even before lumbermills.

 

[malekithe]

You misunderstood me.

A forest with a lumbermill on grassland in total gives 1 food, 3 production. That's pretty good.

A lumbermill on a forested grassland can give a total of (choose one): 2F2H, 2F2H1C, 2F3H, or 2F3H1C. I don't know how you coaxed a grassland into only giving one food.

And you need SOME production for your commerce/GP cities. Forests are good for that purpose, even before lumbermills.

You do need someproduction, but that's why you chop the forests or pop-rush. Spending turns working a forest in a commerce or GP city is a waste of valuable turns that could be spent on more useful endeavors.

 

[Dr Elmer Jiggle]

You misunderstood me.

A forest with a lumbermill on grassland in total gives 1 food, 3 production. That's pretty good.

On grassland, a forest with a lumbermill gives 2 food (even better!). Civ3 forests had a food penalty, but that's gone in Civ4.

And you need SOME production for your commerce/GP cities. Forests are good for that purpose, even before lumbermills.

Right. I don't always clearcut. If the only source of production is forests, I would probably keep them. Usually you have a few hills, some horses, somewhere you can watermill, or some other source of production. It's definitely a case by case judgement call.

Still, usually in a commerce city, by the time lumbermills are available you're getting production from your towns via Universal Suffrage. In a food city, you can get production from specialists (engineers and/or priests). I might keep the forests if I was desperate for the health benefit, but I don't think I'd keep them (in commerce or food cities) just for production.

 

[Leif]

I always use them, they really help out in the latter part of the game when you have enviromentalism.

 

[drkodos]

I regularly go Paul Bunyan on all the woods since I try to have my game finsihed and won long before the extra hammer from a lumbermill would add up to something equal to the hammers produced by after-math chops with a forge (and even more so with the right civics--Org. Rel.)

Last time I checked, they were not real living trees, only illustrations of trees that yield an incredible bounty of usuable hammers early game when the production means a lot more relative to what needs be built.

I never allow my real life philosophie get ion the way of what I need do to win a computer game.

Slavery is not something I practice or condone in the real world either, BTW.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

Last time I checked, they were not real living trees, only illustrations of trees that yield an incredible bounty of usuable hammers early game when the production means a lot more relative to what needs be built.

I think you'll find the hammers aren't real hammers either.

 

[binhthuy71]

"Last time I checked, they were not real living trees, only illustrations of trees that yield an incredible bounty of usuable hammers early game when the production means a lot more relative to what needs be built."

"I think you'll find the hammers aren't real hammers either."


But, but, but, that means it's all just a game. Oh noooooooooooo!