Double Your Pleasure

[timberwoolf]

Yes, that's why I don't usually change mods....

But however 2 for a road is really not enough...

It's a pitty that there is no possibility to make some new tipe of roads....
Like- the roads of the 4000bc should be very diffrent from roads that was in the Roman Empire....
Also the railroads are qiute a problem....Like the first railroads should be at about- 12 movement and the more advanced some 25-30...


I don't know why the the civ relesers didn't done it...

I think that everyone has this problem that it takes complitley comlite all the infrastructures( i mean mining and irrigation and roads) and the workers are just worklwss for a 1000 years and then after the rail road becomes possible you build the railroad it takes maby 20 turns( usually less) and then they are almost workless once again....Ohh I just hate it!!!


By the way, I still remember the first time I hae played civ...I don't know why but I just remember the Island I was on and there weere a few ene,yes and it looked preety ugly althow it was 1991 I think....Ye...the graphicks were really bed....Just some big boxes...

 

[Isak]

Originally posted by timberwoolf
Yes, that's why I don't usually change mods....

But however 2 for a road is really not enough...

Why not?

It's a pitty that there is no possibility to make some new tipe of roads....
Like- the roads of the 4000bc should be very diffrent from roads that was in the Roman Empire....
Also the railroads are qiute a problem....Like the first railroads should be at about- 12 movement and the more advanced some 25-30...

I don't know why the the civ relesers didn't done it...

I think they wanted to create a game not a simulation But we would also love to be able to set the movement rate for railroads to something other than indefinite, for sure.

I think that everyone has this problem that it takes complitley comlite all the infrastructures( i mean mining and irrigation and roads) and the workers are just worklwss for a 1000 years and then after the rail road becomes possible you build the railroad it takes maby 20 turns( usually less) and then they are almost workless once again....Ohh I just hate it!!!

20 turns You must have a veritable army of workers...

 

[timberwoolf]

I usually have at least three workers per sity, in the DYp less (becouse I just complete to build all the availible buildings and build some army and workers...and in the original civ 3 ti always happenes...but not in the DYP)
Also before the rail road I usually build one additional worker per sity, it pays of becouse strong infrastructure is the key to the game.


Does somebody knows how can I end diplomatick agremments such as mutual protection pact?

Can I!?
Becouse I never found the option but I heard somtheng about it like it is posiible, is it?!

 

[Lord_all_Mighty]

Go to the diplomacy screen ans at the bootom it will say New, then Active, click on the active it will say peace treaty(If your at peace) and then the MPP, It will also show the number of turns left for the deal. Most of the time, the AI ends the deals at 20 turns.

 

[Turner]

Check out This Thread in the Civ3 General Discussions forum. Its in the Civ3 FAQ. (The link to the faq is in my sig.)

 

[Isak]

Originally posted by timberwoolf
I usually have at least three workers per sity, in the DYp less (becouse I just complete to build all the availible buildings and build some army and workers...and in the original civ 3 ti always happenes...but not in the DYP)

That's good to hear. Preventing people from running out of things to build in the city, was one of the main reasons I joined this team I'm satisfied if on average each city completes about 40-50% of the buildings in DyP, once the mod is complete. I think Kal-el's goal is somewhere along those lines as well.

I think you're going to need a lot more workers in DyP though, as the railroads are more expensive to build IIRC.

 

[pdescobar]

To echo Isak's statements, in testing I have found DyP requires more workers than unmodded civ for my playstyle. In part this is because of differences in worker job rates, but this is also due to tech requirements. In unmodded, they can do almost everything at the start so I can start right away on infrastructure. I can also leave a worker doing stuff around an assigned city pretty much forever as he will fully improve one tile, then move onto another. In DyP, the fact that nearly all worker jobs require techs, means there is a delayed start in improving the terrain and I'm also moving them around (on the slower roads) much more than before.

 

[Turner]

Yeah, the worker aspect of DyP sucks. I mean, it's really challenging! j/k RobO, Isak, & Kal-el. . .

But it is more challenging. . . I'm not happy with the extra price tag on the resources, but it evens out. Workers dont' stay just workers, they get more as tech progresses. It evens out.

Also helps keep the pop down, as I too tend to make more workers in the earlier ages.

 

[Therapyfailedme]

First off, I DL'ed the 2 files and have been stuck to this infernal machine for 2 days straight. So, after about 36 hours of straight DyP (just discovered Repeating Rifle) and thinking things over at work today, here's my thoughts (for what they're worth):

Early game workers can't do squat but build road, which is completely fine with me. I agree with the historical reasons for it, and frankly, if they were able to do more than just road, it would throw the whole balance out of whack (more on that later)

I normally play an extremely pacificistic game, never start wars until I'm sure i can really drop a hammer on the opponent. 100 modern armor, anyone? The Egyptians have been a fav for a while, but they seemed to be quite overpowered in this game i have going. By the time the rest of the civs' cultural boundaries had butted against mine, i had triple, sometimes quadruple, the number of cities they did. The shaman seems a little cheap for what they do...more shield cost maybe?

With my workers only being able to make roads, and my propensity for internal growth, once a city ceased growing, i would pop out a new serf every couple of buildings. This led to an insane amount of money in the bank. After a while, i didn't let anything fully build an improvement, I would just give it a turn or two to get some shields into it to lower the price, then just buy it outright. As it stands now, all my cities have absolutely everything they can possibly make (except Hanging Gardens and the sea wonders....drat those Germans and their harbors).

The second thing I don't agree with is serfs being free of support. IMHO, that's broken and just begging for exploitation. Example- once a city topped for food or at 15, they would pump out a serf every so often. By the time i saw i'd be building railroads soon (about 10 turns away), all cities made serfs. By the time high explosives rolled around, i had well over 300 serfs sitting, with another 100 or so laborers on the way to the rally point. Poof- upgrade all the serfs, eat the support for a few turns and every single city's full radius was fully RR'ed and irrigated, in about 4 turns. At that point, they could support themselves to 15 (except a couple holding down saltpeter) and i dumped the laborers back into them. All in all, i lost about 2000 gold and now have an utterly ridiculous advantage.

Other than that, the mod is absolutely magnificent. I'm going to work all the way through it and see if anything else pops out, great work to all involved.

Oh, i only read this thread through page 40-ish, so i don't know if this is resolved, but has anyone tried pulling buildings from simcity4, or the simcity urban renewal kit?

Also, i vaguely remember someone kvetching about the early game shield production for some squares. Is there a way to make a city improvement that will give (for example) +1 shield from a forest tile in the city radius? I've been playing Stronghold for too long, and it'd hard to give up my woodcutter's huts

 

[timberwoolf]

Therapyfailedmå- I just want to advice you not to play on chieftan lavel, it's really easy...
( I think that you do plays in this level becouse it's really imposible to overbuild your oponents in for times while playing Monarch or at least Regent...Not talking about Emperor...)

I don't know how do you manage to build all the building also, I didn't build my military in the DYP until a was very cloze to discover railroads....

I aslo can't understand how in 36 hours of game play you are justdiscovered repiting rifle...
I always play on huge maps and it takes 14 hours max to be very cloze to modern time...( I think in my currtnt game (Monarch difficult) it took at about 11 hours... (without big military conflicts, with them it is probably may take 8-10 ten hours more)


The Shaman is one of the relegious civ advance!

By the way,I wont to thank everyone that helped me with this diplomatick stuff!


I think the workers are allright in the DYP!

 

[Isak]

@Therapyfailedme:

That does sound like an unusual experience (at least to the best of my knowledge) - are you sure you're not playing with accellerated startup or something similar?

Otherwise, I would very much like a savegame or two, to see how you pulled it off

About lumber, remember that you can mine forests in DyP - that's our Lumber Mill

 

[Turner]

It would be nice if the workers could build forests earlier. Johnny Appleseed was by no means 'modern,' and that's what i think of the tech to build forests. Maybe slide that into Sanitation? Still kinda late for it, IMHO.

There are a lot of early improvements to increase shield production. Mining comes with construction, and that's a lot earlier now. Forges, mining jungle and forest tiles, plains. Guilds, Town Clocks, Mills, Wind Mills.. . you can boost your prouction quite a bit.

 

[Kal-el]

now if only the AI woudl build all those production boosters it would provide a much stiffer challenge int he later stages of the game.

 

[Lord_all_Mighty]

Sorry to ask again, but is the update out yet? I haven't seen any updates on the DyP website and you guys talk like it's been released.

 

[Isak]

We willl just have to make sure the AI has read the manual, before Civ3: Conquests is released.

@Lord_all_Mighty:

We're betatesting it, so you will have to join the test team to get your hands on it now

 

[pdescobar]

The newest current official release version is still 1.05x for PTW, .91r for vanilla. The development of the next release (1.10x/1.00r) is actively going on and is being tested by myself and many others. We always hope it will be soon, but it will only be released when Kal-el thinks it is ready.

If you want to have a look at the beta (current beta is version 04 for regular which came out a couple weeks ago and beta 05 for PTW which came out a day or two ago), all you need to do is sign up to be a tester at the CDG forum (check the link in Kal-el's sig or if you have problems locating it, PM one of us) and download it. There are no special qualifications for being a tester, you just need to sign up at the forum; you don't even *have* to give feedback, although that is highly encouraged and you may find some angry bovines in dark glasses and trenchcoats at your door if you don't

 

[Therapyfailedme]

Isak - That does sound like an unusual experience (at least to the best of my knowledge) - are you sure you're not playing with accellerated startup or something similar?

woops, my bad- it was on accelerated. Time to scrap that one and restart. And keep the roommate of my 'puter, too.

Turner- i agree, the early shield production is fine with me the way it is. 'Primitive' societies weren't usually known for their industrial capacity, as far as i am aware of, so having to be setting near a forest, as well as mining it, makes perfect sense to me.

 

[Turner]

I wouldn't forsake AP... it has it's uses. I use it with all my games. . . DyP takes so much longer that it really helps out.

I was going to post the suggestion for a lumber yard, but it occurs to me that a mill fits that bill quite nice.

 

[dreadknought]

Originally posted by Kal-el
now if only the AI woudl build all those production boosters it would provide a much stiffer challenge int he later stages of the game. [/QUOTE

hI, I play a mooded version of dyp all the time now that is alot of fun. As far as AI production I mod the game in this way and it helps the ai.

1.0 I have my govt (MUST PLAY with some corruption) but the ai govts must have minimal corruption . They dont adapt well to late game corruption issues as they expand out.


2.0 I give certain land types an extra shield so that the ai does not need developing land as much but I charge myself 1 extra gold per unit upkeep to offset this. This lets the ai compete better as the human players units are limited by gold more than production. However the bombing of ai lands does not cripple them as much as it did which I like.

3.0 I greatly increase city natural defense bonus to make it harder to assault cities by all. This tends to allow all civs to get stronger over time as cities are not captured as much forcing the ai to then rebuild structures. I think I made this 200 percent all sizes my current game.

4.0 I down size pollution (all structures) to help the ai not be crippled by late game pollution

5.0 Lastly I limit cities (can explain this later) but greatly increase culture for huge maps so that smaller amounts of cities can expand over large ares. This way the ai has more resouces in its areas without too many cities which slow the game. On a huge map the total city count is normally around 100-120 with 10 civs playing.

All these things combined give you a stronger and quicker ai that does not tire out but instead get stronger. I have some other tricks that I use to help the ai but thats a few of them....

 

[Therapyfailedme]

Silly question- are the effects of Mill & Wind Mill cumulative?