Emperor Strikes Back
- Thread starter Unconventional
- Start date
BornInCantaloup
Agent of Chaos
Agreed on principle. What about this particular case, though ?
Animal Husbandry is likely required to feed the 2nd city (1NE of the western cows is a fine spot, grabbing the rice with the capital's border pop).
With that in mind,
Masonry -> Wheel -> AH -> Poly -> Priest seems perfectly functional to me.
You can grow to size 3 the turn the gold is improved so : improve corn, improve gold. At size 3, working gold, corn and a floodplains, you can still grow to 4 in 7 turns. Seems like a lot but it would take 14 working the corn, gold and an improved Ivory. So you're probably best growing to size 4 before stagnating your city again : better grow now than later, when the cost will be higher.
Growing to 4 also gives time to build a few warriors and road to the 2nd site.
What's indeed interesting is that the capital has excellent production capabilities. It could build the Oracle in about 10 turns without marble.
However, maybe one would be better served with Pottery / BW than with Masonry.
Chop is limited : 6 forests in the cap and no large forest cluster close by.
Whip : it will be hard already to grow the cap past size 4-5 (without working farmed floodplains/building a granary). No early whip seems desirable to me.
Regarding Pottery :
Capital has a very high happy cap (7!) and not enough food to work all it's production tiles with only the corn and cottaged floodplains.
However, it has 6 riverside cottageable tiles. A case should be made in favour of early Pottery. Early Pottery + Bronze supports the better REx but limits the Oracle/Masonry options
Another case that could be made :
Save your chops for the Temple of Artemis and enjoy the awesome GP burst (insert Worker/Settler after the Oracle ; maybe finish the ToA with a settler's whip overflow... aka do your best to expand nonetheless. You'll likely get a few priests over the course of the game but it isn't as bad some fear.
There is no clear relation such as : getting better GPs > getting more GPs.
Farming/Mining all over Berlin and spamming wonders there is very appealing. Following the earlier techpath with Writing -> Bronze could make that happen.
Well, that's all very hypothetical as it doesn't say anything about the Oracle's tech target.
Bulbing Mathematics... I'm not sure you need to do that. Getting to War Elephants requires about the same work as getting to Currency + Aesthetics, just slightly less. Is it worth it ? You won't bulb maths easily with only 1 food special ; probably requires a different techpath, something like AH -> Writing -> Something.
Is a rush sensible ? Maybe... there doesn't seem to be that many spots to expand peacefully (little food & AIs met very early). Need to know more before deciding.
Htadus
A and L's dad
I am not sure there really is a big race to the Oracle at emperror. Of couse if an Organized civ with marble in the BFC is in the game, then there is a threat. Then it would not matter anyways since it will go at an unbelievably early date.
The main reason to get Masonary is because the tile is a high yield and provide a useful resource.
@ BIC
ToE is better when an AI owns it for excellent GM trade missions. I just had a trademission that nearly netted 5000 gold in the recent Isabella WOTM. Problem was I did not plan it well and have enough units to promote.
The main reason to get Masonary is because the tile is a high yield and provide a useful resource.
@ BIC
ToE is better when an AI owns it for excellent GM trade missions. I just had a trademission that nearly netted 5000 gold in the recent Isabella WOTM. Problem was I did not plan it well and have enough units to promote.
Unconventional
Young Emperor
I played until 2500 B.C and I think we are doing well in terms of Oracle building. Here what happened:
After Agriculture my plan was to go Masonry (because we have a discount thanks to free Mysticism) =>Wheel=>Buddhism (we also have some advantage because Asoka got it on turn 12 and I suppose we have small discount on that too right?) =>Priesthood =>Writing=>Mathematics then Oracle Construction
I know it sounds crazy to do that without losing the Oracle race but I think we have a shot on that.
After Masonry I went Wheel as planned but guess what happened! After 3 or 4 turns my remainig scout met some benevolent villagers and some gold! (I was lucky with huts this time) I got Wheel almost for free so that means I gained 9 or 10 turns in the Oracle race!
Almost free Wheel encouraged me to push for free Construction with Oracle. There were other factors as well and you'll know them soon.
I met all of my neighbours and here they are in order of appearance:
None of them are Industrious and except Pacal and Asoka they are not so much likely to pursue early wonders. Besides so far no wonders were build and that means Wonders go slowly because AI wants to grab more land in Pangea maps.
At 2500 B.C I finished Writing. But Mathematics takes 24 turns now
But given the
slowness of wonder building I think we can have a shot. What do you think?
Here's my city and a general view of the map.
As you see I can build Oracle in 11 turns. My first settler has 5 turns to go but I don't know where to settle first. So a dotmap would be really helpful
Now the capital works improved and strong tiles. After the Settler I can build another worker until Mathematics is half way done that I can begin the Oracle then. Anyway now the main question is where I should settle and whether I should risk the Oracle or not. Save is included.
After Agriculture my plan was to go Masonry (because we have a discount thanks to free Mysticism) =>Wheel=>Buddhism (we also have some advantage because Asoka got it on turn 12 and I suppose we have small discount on that too right?) =>Priesthood =>Writing=>Mathematics then Oracle Construction
I know it sounds crazy to do that without losing the Oracle race but I think we have a shot on that.After Masonry I went Wheel as planned but guess what happened! After 3 or 4 turns my remainig scout met some benevolent villagers and some gold! (I was lucky with huts this time) I got Wheel almost for free so that means I gained 9 or 10 turns in the Oracle race!
Almost free Wheel encouraged me to push for free Construction with Oracle. There were other factors as well and you'll know them soon.
I met all of my neighbours and here they are in order of appearance:
None of them are Industrious and except Pacal and Asoka they are not so much likely to pursue early wonders. Besides so far no wonders were build and that means Wonders go slowly because AI wants to grab more land in Pangea maps.
At 2500 B.C I finished Writing. But Mathematics takes 24 turns now
But given the slowness of wonder building I think we can have a shot. What do you think?
Here's my city and a general view of the map.
As you see I can build Oracle in 11 turns. My first settler has 5 turns to go but I don't know where to settle first. So a dotmap would be really helpful
Now the capital works improved and strong tiles. After the Settler I can build another worker until Mathematics is half way done that I can begin the Oracle then. Anyway now the main question is where I should settle and whether I should risk the Oracle or not. Save is included.
Maybe I'm wrong with the calculations, but if u finish building settlers in 5 turns, then researching mathematic has 19 left, and oracle is 11, you still wouldn't be able to oracle construction as math is a requirement. This is also saying as you don't set up a city but if you did by then, your maintenance might go up and research goes to 80s depending where you settle. But with the extra gold, you can boost to 100 you might have a chance. Let me know if I'm wrong.
Unconventional
Young Emperor
I have some gold reserves so maintenance would be affordable. Actually if I connect two cities asap then it means 3 more commerce accelerating math research.
After the settler I might start a worker until mathematics is 11 turns away then switch to building the Oracle.
vranasm
Deity
how you plan to defend the next 40 turns? you don't see copper nor horses...
pigswill
fly (one day)
Its certainly unconventional.
Htadus
A and L's dad
Regarding dot map, any choice you do is fine since you do not know were the resources are located. Just make sure there is enough food for at least 8-10 Pop for early to mid game.
BornInCantaloup
Agent of Chaos
Without Animal Husbandry, you don't have many city spots.
You can still go AH into Writing to Oracle Code of Laws. It could support a heavy REx. (city 1 1NE of southwestern cows & city 2 1S of western Fish blocks 2 more spots ; city 3 3SE by the river and you can try to lock the jungle resources to the south.
You could (presumably) Oracle Construction from where you stand but it will be a while before you have the production to pump catapults & units.
Now you lack the techs to make your cities productive.
You can still go AH into Writing to Oracle Code of Laws. It could support a heavy REx. (city 1 1NE of southwestern cows & city 2 1S of western Fish blocks 2 more spots ; city 3 3SE by the river and you can try to lock the jungle resources to the south.
You could (presumably) Oracle Construction from where you stand but it will be a while before you have the production to pump catapults & units.
Now you lack the techs to make your cities productive.
