Experiment 626's Japanese Pre-Game Thread

[Experiment 626]

OK! I'm off! (No kidding, right?)

 

[Experiment 626]

Ladies and gentlemen (and whatever else might be reading this . . . LOL);

I've been threatening to do this for awhile now, but HERE IT IS!:

TRAINING DAY GAME 2, SAVE 1, Entry 1​

4000 BC: I move our Intrepid Settler due South. Our Hearty Worker (renamed ‘Thing One’) begins Irrigation of Wheat. We become aware that our first city will be on the coast.

IBT: We set SCI to 80% to maximize Research. We choose Alphabet to be researched. It will be discovered in 40 Turns.​

3950 BC: Our Intrepid (and now weary from walking for 50 years) Settler founds Kyoto. The Building Queue is set to Warrior, Warrior, Worker.

IBT: Nothing.​

3900 BC: Nothing.

IBT: Nothing.​

3850 BC: Nothing.

IBT: Nothing.​

3800 BC: Thing One finishes Irrigation, and begins to build a Road.

IBT: Nothing.​

3750 BC: For the past couple of turns, I’ve had this strange feeling that I forgot to do something. Checking Kyoto, my feeling was correct. My citizen is working the forest instead of the now Irrigated/Roaded Wheat. I slap the citizen upside the head, and he is now working the desired square. Other than that, Nothing.

IBT: Nothing.​

3700 BC: Nothing.

IBT:Nothing.​

3650 BC: Kyoto builds Warrior (renamed Ugg). Ugg heads NW to check out the proposed site of the second City. Thing One finishes the Road, and heads W to the other Wheat.

IBT: Nothing.​

3600 BC: Kyoto grows to 2 pop. For the moment, I let the new citizen work the same forest that the other one was working. (Is there something in that forest that draws these guys in? Wood Nymphs, perhaps?). Kyoto hasn’t had it’s first (of hopefully many) Cultural Expansions yet, so the second Wheat isn’t in the radius yet. Ugg moves N. Thing One begin Irrigation of the second Wheat.

IBT: Nothing.​

3550 BC: Ugg moves NW, and is now standing on the proposed site of City #2.

IBT: Nothing.​

3500 BC: Looking around, Ugg notices Hills due North. He climbs the Hills to survey the terrain. Sadly, he doesn’t see any Horses yet, but he does notices a coastline to the North.

IBT: Our borders expand!​

3450 BC: The citizen working the Forest is immediately moved to the second Wheat. Kyoto builds another Warrior (renamed Grogg). A Worker (any guesses on the name?) is next.

I see a problem: Kyoto will grow to 3 pop in 3 turns. The Worker will take 10 turns to complete. If I move Grogg to explore, Kyoto will riot in 3 turns! Ergo, I leave Grogg in Kyoto to keep the populace in line.

Ugg moves NW to follow the coastline. In the distance, he notices a Wheat square next to a coastal Fish square (possible site for a future city, perhaps?).

IBT: Nothing.​

3400 BC: Thing One finishes Irrigation, and begins building a Road. Ugg sees more Hills to the West, so he moves there to scout the terrain. Sadly (again), he sees no Horses, just lots of Forests.

IBT: Nothing.​

3350 BC: Kyoto grows to 3 pop. Grogg clobbers the new citizen upside the head to keep him in line. The new citizen works the Forest (and giggling can be heard from within it’s borders). Ugg moves North towards the Wheat/Fish combo. It appears that we are on a ‘Finger’ of land (peninsula?).

IBT: Nothing.​

3300 BC: Ugg moves North, and is now standing on the coastline.

IBT: Nothing.​

3250 BC: Kyoto creates a Worker (renamed ‘Thing Two’). Checking the city, I see that the citizen that became the Worker was taken from Wheat #2. I drag the citizen kicking and screaming out of the Forest, and put him to work on Wheat #2. I realize that this might have been a mistake. With the citizen on the second Wheat, it will take 30 turns to produce a Temple or a Settler. We need one or the other sooner than that, so I move the citizen back to the Forest. (What is it about that place anyways?!!). Now it will take 10 turns produce the Temple or Settler. I leave the citizen in the Forest (You’d think he’d be Happy, not just Content.), and set the Queue for Temple. Kyoto is now 2 pop. Thing One finishes the Road, and moves to Road the Forest. We might as well get some trade out of it, seeing as how everyone loves the place. Thing Two moves to the Forest. Ugg follows the coastline SouthWest.

Odd, I just realized that I haven’t seen any Goodie huts yet. Strange . . .

IBT: Nothing.​

3200 BC: Ugg continues in a Southwesterly direction following the coastline. Thing Two begins building the Road in the Forest. More giggling is heard from within the Forest.

IBT: Nothing.​

3150 BC: To my chagrin, I realize that I accidentally moved Grogg into the Forest, not Thing One. Better fix that, and fast! Grogg moves back into Kyoto (grinning from ear to ear) while Thing One joins Thing Two in the Forest. Even more giggling is heard. (Just what is going on in there?). Ugg continues on his way following the coastline.

IBT: Nothing.​

3100 BC: Thing One helps Thing Two build the Road. At least, I hope that’s what they’re doing in there! Ugg continues on his way.

IBT: Nothing.​

3050 BC: Ugg continues on his way, and is getting close to Kyoto.

IBT: Nothing.​

3000 BC: Thing One and Thing Two finish the Road, and (reluctantly) leave the Forest to go start improving City #2's Wheat. Ugg continues getting closer to Kyoto. He sees a couple of Tobacco nearby. A possible city site, perhaps?

End of Turnset: 32 Gold (+2 per turn); Temple (Kyoto in 5; Settler next); Alphabet in 6.​

Here is Our Territory:

And here is Kyoto:

Any comments, suggestions, and advice are (as always) greatly appreciated!

 

[CommandoBob]

Does Ugg buy ugly houses?


Random Thoughts on Ugg and Grogg
Anyway, I think Ugg needs to move due east for a while and then fog-bust around Kyoto. If Kyoto makes a settler instead of a temple, well, even then Grogg will be needed to keep peace in Kyoto, since it will soon grow back to size 3. Ugg is five turns away from Kyoto, so he could replace Grogg if Grogg were to leave after a settler is born (if a settler is born).

You've got room for 2 or 3, maybe 4 cities to the NW, which is nice, since they should be fairly safe cities, with little AI interference.

I'd just feel better with more land around Kyoto visible.

 

[Ansar]

You have the tools for a Settler Factory - use them.

 

[Experiment 626]

You know, the way that you good and patient people waited for me to get past my health scare and other RL issues, I would have thunk that I would have had more than 2 responses to the first Turnset of the first save.

In the immortal words of Pink Floyd:

Is there anybody out there?

 

[Marsden]

Is there anybody in there?

Sorry I've been Comfortable Numb and whilst I made sure to read your post I completely forgot to reply.


Here's some things. First, I find myself thinking in 2 parallel ways. Maybe just it's just Dissociative Identity Disorder.

Well...

I'd just like to say, I like the posting style. You've got the first game down and now your not meekly starting out graduly making funny comments but starting from the begining, that's what made your first game so darn popular, it was really entertaining. I think I'll PM AutomatedTeller and see what he's up to. I know I gave him a challenge, not personally, but the current HOF GIII gauntlet is a 20k on Sid so I'm sure he's busy.

Now to the game. (You're probably sorry now, all that and I didn't get to the game yet! )

The automatic governor that assigns new citizens picks the "best" and 2 shields of the forest wins. All of my personalities agree, mine that bonus grassland asap, you can road it first or not, but mine that and there's your 2 shields + 2 food and 2 trade so I would have done all that instead of roading the forest first. But no problems, worker management is very important but also hardest to do best. Now don't build the temple you need the settler ASAP, and keep building settlers. Don't bother bringing a warrior back for MP duty just use the entertainment slider. The warrior is better off exploring. It might be worth it to have MP but if you're going that route than it would be better to make 1 or 2 more for that purpose rather that recalling those. Get them out and searching. More Settlers. The new town can build more units. So maybe the first builds in your second town can provide 2 warriors for MP duty in the captial. EDIT: I just realised your second warrior is already in the capital. You can keep him there but I think it's worth it to just send him searching and use the entertainmet slider to keep things under control. You've got plenty of gold why not kick some back to the people until you get a few luxuries.

You have a good high food location, Ansar said it best, SETTLER FACTORY, NOW! Mine and road the BG your worker is on then do the one across the river and then the one north of the one you are on now, then it's 4 turn settlers until the world is covered with Green Japaneses.

When I said about building temples, that was later, sorry I didn't specify that and out of the core areas. You can build temples in the core, too but not yet, you need more units first. Your goal is conquest, so you need units. But also you need a good working core to build those units so get that core up and running as fast as possible. That's your main goal now. When you get the "we want the forbidden palace" message you want to double the current amount of towns, I think it's after 8 or 10, so after 20 towns, then you can start the new totally corrupt towns on temples. But by then I hope you've found at least 2 or 3 of your playmates opponents and see how that looks to determine further. And this would all be happening after you get to republic asap.

However, the other way to do it, a way despised by many, is to build temples for contentment and go monarchy and use lots of MPs and no entertainment slider. This is simpler as you don't have to pay attention to as much stuff, but simpler isn't always better and you'd lose out in the end. Although with a straight conquest there isn't as much to lose so it could still work. You can do both to compare to see the difference. later on





But

 

[AutomatedTeller]

Reporting for duty!!!


The state of the civ:

Nice start!!! Good place to move the settler, good job on checking on whether the city would riot (I've been doing HOF games for over a year now and I STILL see my capitol rioting early in games sometimes - even with CivAssist, which TELLS you that it's going to riot...)

Don't worry about missing moving the citizen - that stuff is annoying.

Too bad our scout found the end of the known world as opposed to another civ but at least we know we have a bunch of land that is ours and no one elses!! MWUHAHAHA!!!!

I would get that other warrior out scouting. I never mind running 10, 20 or even 30% lux in the early game - getting the most out of your early shields is most important, which means getting contacts so you can trade for the other techs that you don't have - you start with the wheel and you are the ONLY one with that, so it's a great trade item.

We have barbs, but they are sedentary ones (correct?) so we don't have to worry about barb camps and all we need to be careful about is popping a hut near a worker.

The AI is Regent, so they don't start with free units and their build order will be something like warrior/warrior/settler, even in cities that can't get food up in time

What I'm trying to say is that it's pretty safe to let leave the capitol unguarded for awhile.

As for the temple:

This is a game where you plan to win by conquest, correct? I think so, I don't remember. While temples are useful (the produce culture which helps keep captured towns from flipping), what you need is towns to create military. Culture is nice, but if you build 0 temples this game, that's ok. Libs are a little different, cause they help you get to samurai

Better to make that a settler, in my estimation.

 

[gmaharriet]

Is there anybody out there?

Oops!!! I was so busy giggling in the forest with the rest that I forgot to respond.

Seriously, some of your advisors are better players than I am, and I'm reluctant to give advice that may conflict with theirs, but I'm definitely here. I even have the thread subscribed to receive daily summaries by email.

You've been given good advice. I definitely agree you should hold off on temple building and get your warriors out there exploring. I have nothing new to add, but if verbal agreement with the others means anything, you've got it.

 

[Norton II]

Oops! Haven't looked at this thread in a while, so I didn't even know you'd started. I've only got a couple of things to add, though. First, I'm assuming you're going to research pottery next--the sooner you get granaries built, the better. Second, you might want to consider three 6-turn settler pumps instead of one 4-turn pump. I'd settle 1 NE or 1 E of the northernmost wheat, then on the tobacco 1 SE of your warrior.

 

[Marsden]

How we doin'

Here's your Indiana state quarter for you.

 

[Ansar]

@Mardsen:

 

[Experiment 626]

Now, Marsden, was that nice? Funny, yes, but was it nice?

Actually, looking at the pic, one of the 'tendrils' looks like it goes through my city. That would explain a HELL of a lot!

As for the game, when I get a chance, I'll run 20 moves of Save #2. If everybody wants to start dissecting the pic of Save #2, feel free to offer advice on what I should do.

Good night, all.

 

[gmaharriet]

@Marsden - I LOVE the quarter. If you elongated it just a bit and changed the state name, it would look very much like California and I'd be right in the center of the crossroads.

 

[Marsden]

Last game update was 09/14/07. Don't you want to play with us anymore? Took your football and went home? Why?


BTW, about the quarter, you said that wasn't nice to the Warmaster who's first, last, and middle advice is kill, Kill, KILL?

 

[Experiment 626]

Sorry. RL has been hell lately.

Then again:

Originally posted by Experiment 626: (3 posts ago)

As for the game, when I get a chance, I'll run 20 moves of Save #2. If everybody wants to start dissecting the pic of Save #2, feel free to offer advice on what I should do.

I've been waiting for advice.

 

[CommandoBob]

Sorry, boss, we weren't paying attention.

Game stats are at Post 39 of this thread.

This is Save #2:

Save #2

Minimap:

 

[Marsden]

You clever Just blame everyone else when it's all you.

I'm just happy to hear you're ok. There, that's enough warmth, yuck.



With start 2 I'd cross the river to the SW and settle on turn 2, or settle in place, then start up a settler factory, just like all these starts. That's the thing about giving yourself all good starts, the thing to do is start a settler factory, with a not so good start is when you really get into "different" strategies. Irrigate and road the wheat and then road the square your on and mine and repeat with the other two bonus grasslands. A variation on this is to road with the worker on spot and then walk to the wheat as it saves a worker turn of walking but wastes 3 turns of waiting for a road you aren't going to use right away, so that's a tuff call IMO. Spit out a warrior or 3 and a worker and settlers, with all new cities making more troops.

How's that for your answer.

 

[CommandoBob]

The Situation
You are the North West corner of the world.

In the East you see Wheat.
You see a BG to the North.
You see a BG to the Northeast.
Due South you see Game.
You are standing on a BG.
You are next to a river that runs Southeast to Northwest and meets the ocean to the Northwest.

What ToDo?
I would move NW onto the grassland. Then all 3 BGs can be exploited fully. The Wheat will become available in 10 turns with the first culture expansion.

First worker turns would be to mine the starting BG, then road, then move to irrigate and then road the Wheat.

 

[AutomatedTeller]

Are we playing Civ, or Zork? Can I pick up the bottle and say "PLUGH?"

 

[AutomatedTeller]

Both initial moves (NW or SW) will give you all 3 BG's (which are important).

I think I would go SW, for 2 reasons:
1) You work the deer in the forest, which gives you an extra shield to start with.
2) You will probably expand south and east, and being south of the river means your settlers dont' stop on crossing the river.

Choice #3, btw, is to just settle in place, but that doesn't put you on the coast.