Exploration Continued Expanded (Obsolete)

[Natan35]

I have a... Weird request. Could make the ginger benefit from the pantheon that increases food from wheat? I'm asking because I often see them spawn near each other.

 

[hokath]

Thank you, great one. Yeah makes sense with Saffron.
(you typo'd opium in your post)

 

[JFD]

I have a... Weird request. Could make the ginger benefit from the pantheon that increases food from wheat? I'm asking because I often see them spawn near each other.

Sure thing, birthday boy

 

[ppundy]

Thanks for building this nice mod. After playing about 10 games with it, I've never had a scout actually be promoted to "Great Scout" (something indicated that should happen at level 5). All of the scouts get seem to be getting capped at 45xp, and never develop past that point. Is this working as intended?

 

[JFD]

It's meant to cap, but maybe it's too low? I'll bump it up in the next update.

 

[TranquilSilence]

You mentioned that you were considering adding the tribes component back, (presumably into this mod) however that it would be in a new fashion which involved both Consulates and Tribal Lands. Any word on how exactly we can expect Tribes to work, or are they not far enough in development?

 

[JFD]

Basically, it's the old system - build Consulates to benefit from Tribes within your borders - but with Tribes themselves possessing their own borders, which you cannot improve (without colonizing or annexing the Tribe first, I mean) and the tiles in which are possibly in some way buffed either generally or specific to the tribe (I decided to bring back the Consulates system, because coming up with 20 compelling effects for the Tribe tiles simply wasn't happening). The system is pretty much done. I just have to restore the benefits of the Consulates and do some tidying.

If only I could figure how to make an installer like Gazebo has started doing, I could streamline the extra installation steps users will be suggested to take in order to have the Tribe borders show properly.

 

[ppundy]

JFD,

Regarding Scouts not promoting to Great Scouts because they cap at 45xp, I should mention that I've been playing with CP+CBP suite.

Yes, adjust the xp cap or level promotion so that Scouts promote to Great Scouts at the rate you intended. Thank you!

 

[ppundy]

JFD,

I play with almost all of your mods and civilizations (awesome work!) and wish you had a single combined JFD Master Mod for everything (i.e. Explorers, Piety, Mercenaries, Cities in Development, Events&Decisions, YnAEMPv23, and all your civilizations, etc.) with options for CBP and EUI. Does something like that exist already?

If not, providing a combined JFD Master Mod has benefits. As the mod author/collaborator, you would have far more control over mod load order, something which requires a bit of finesse. Second, it would clean up the mod install screen reducing all of the 50+ JFD Mods to a single click.

Thank you for all of your

 

[Chrisy15]

JFD,

I play with almost all of your mods and civilizations (awesome work!) and wish you had a single combined JFD Master Mod for everything (i.e. Explorers, Piety, Mercenaries, Cities in Development, Events&Decisions, YnAEMPv23, and all your civilizations, etc.) with options for CBP and EUI. Does something like that exist already?

If not, providing a combined JFD Master Mod has benefits. As the mod author/collaborator, you would have far more control over mod load order, something which requires a bit of finesse. Second, it would clean up the mod install screen reducing all of the 50+ JFD Mods to a single click.

Thank you for all of your

1. Since the JFD DLC (which is what it should be called - or the EU IV Expansion) is still in development, there would be no reason to create such a pack at this point in time.

2. If an update was required for one component of the JFD DLC, for example the three updates in one day trying to solve the EUI issues with CID, then the whole pack would need to be redownloaded.

3. Does Dropbox have a file size limit? Because this would probably exceed it.

4. Adding the Civs to this DLC would be a bad idea - not only because all of this would need to be redownloaded every time a Civ needs an update, but also would have to be redownloaded every time a Civ is released, which would make releasing Civs a much less inviting proposal. It would also make the download unimaginably huge - Putin is bigger than CID. Putin * 50 + the other mods = Nothing short of a Gb.

5. Mod load order isn't much of an issue; Modbuddy's References and Dependencies system works well enough, and I'm pretty sure that as long as there is a CREATE TABLE IF NOT EXISTS check for any cross-mod tables, then load order doesn't even make a difference (hence why you don't need to lay out your Actions order in Modbuddy to be Art --> Text --> Uniques --> Leader --> Civ --> Mod Support).

Have I missed anything, your Modjesty?

 

[hokath]

I should mention that I've been playing with CP+CBP suite.

If you go into Community Balance Patch > Balance Changes > CoreDefines.sql and look for "experience" you can adjust this number. I have it at 100.

JFD, I've decided nature still doesn't seem dangerous enough. Which files should I look at to increase attrition damage? I was going to double it. I know you turned it down before because the AI didn't cope so well, but that should be better with the newest CP improvements?

 

[JFD]

1. Since the JFD DLC (which is what it should be called - or the EU IV Expansion) is still in development, there would be no reason to create such a pack at this point in time.

2. If an update was required for one component of the JFD DLC, for example the three updates in one day trying to solve the EUI issues with CID, then the whole pack would need to be redownloaded.

3. Does Dropbox have a file size limit? Because this would probably exceed it.

4. Adding the Civs to this DLC would be a bad idea - not only because all of this would need to be redownloaded every time a Civ needs an update, but also would have to be redownloaded every time a Civ is released, which would make releasing Civs a much less inviting proposal. It would also make the download unimaginably huge - Putin is bigger than CID. Putin * 50 + the other mods = Nothing short of a Gb.

5. Mod load order isn't much of an issue; Modbuddy's References and Dependencies system works well enough, and I'm pretty sure that as long as there is a CREATE TABLE IF NOT EXISTS check for any cross-mod tables, then load order doesn't even make a difference (hence why you don't need to lay out your Actions order in Modbuddy to be Art --> Text --> Uniques --> Leader --> Civ --> Mod Support).

Have I missed anything, your Modjesty?

1. Exactly.
2. My god.
3. Sort of. It you get too much traffic, they'll shut you down, as what happened to Rob, and as what happened to me when I had the Cultural Diversity Soundtrack on dropbox (before I moved it to Mediafire).
4. My helix.

Yup, that's everything Keep it up and you'll earn yourself a civil promotion

If you go into Community Balance Patch > Balance Changes > CoreDefines.sql and look for "experience" you can adjust this number. I have it at 100.

JFD, I've decided nature still doesn't seem dangerous enough. Which files should I look at to increase attrition damage? I was going to double it. I know you turned it down before because the AI didn't cope so well, but that should be better with the newest CP improvements?

Maybe I'll have to make a hardcore mod In the meantime, you can find the values Attrition/Core/Attrition_Promotions.sql, at the top, under the tags 'EnemyDamage' and 'NeutralDamage' (there's also 'EnemyDamageChange' and 'NeutralDamageChance' if you feel increase the chance is the better option).
*and sell it for 5 bucks like Metro Last Light*

 

[Kesler]

I can attest that JFD's mods take up more than a GB. Civ 5 mods are the leading cause to my C: drive running dry of space.

It would be great if you could release a patcher.exe for every update rather than a full redownload. Gazebo should pass on his wisdom.

 

[ppundy]

Okay, I now understand the constraints of a combined mod. Thank you for considering it, and explaining the issue.

Okay, instead of a combined mod, one thing that can really help is your team's recommendations regarding mod load order. I checked your instructions in multiple places and didn't see much info. If this exists already, where can I find it?

From previous experience with modding in Skyrim, I know how critical the load order is and how subtle minor errors can ripple, but not be obvious at first. When bugs occasionally surface in Civ 5, I'm always a bit suspicious of my mod load order, and wish I could check it against a recommended list.

An example of impact can be seen with "More Luxuries". Though Steam allows you to load it just about anywhere, its load order is important. Loading it early won't cause a major break, but some of the resources won't spawn correctly. This is one of the few mods I've found where the mod author makes suggestions on load order in the Details.

Since we have so many great JFD mods, any recommendations your team makes regarding mod load order would be appreciated!!! It doesn't need to be all encompassing, but referencing other common mods would be really helpful for troubleshooting.

For discussion purposes, here is a common load order i use. (Note: i check to make sure only 1 DLL is active at a time, and I tend to turn off any lua scripts not in use.). I suspect something minor may be broken here because if I try to load JFD mercenaries, i often get CTD somewhere between turn 70 - 180). I uninstalled mercenaries for now, planning on troubleshooting it in the future.

1) Community Balance Patch Suite (CP, CBP, CSD_for_CBP, Civ4Diplo, CBP_compatibility_files_EUI)
2) Sukritacts Events and Decisions (though I turn Events off because of CTD and just use Decisions)
3) R.E.D. Modpack (v27) and R.E.D. Reduced_File_Size (v23)
4) JFD Cultural Diversity (Core v4)
5) JFD Exploration Contnued Expanded (v8)
6) JFD Piety and Sovereignty (Piety v5)
7) Civilizations
7a. JFD Civilizations
7b. Sukritact's Civilizations
7c. CL Civilizaitons
7d. MC Civilizations
7e. Civilizations by other mod authors
9) Maps
9a. YnAEMP (v.23) with updates by JFD
9b. YnAEMP City States for BNW (v1)
9c. CL YnAEMP Compatibility Patch (v.1)
9d. Other Maps
10. Other Misc. Mods
10a. Unit Path Viewer (v. 10)
10b. Fortress Borders (v. 2)
11. More Luxuries v.155 (loaded near end as recommended by mod author in instructions)

Other mods I occasionally use or intend to use:

* Ethnic Units (v31)
* JFD Mercenaries (Not currently using, seems to cause CTD, but undiagnosed)
* JFD Cities in Development (New, just downloaded, haven't tried it yet)
* City Limits (v.7)

Sorry about the long text block, but thank you in advance for any help you can provide!

 

[hokath]

Thanks boss.
Increased chance in enemy lands vs neutral? NATURE WILL RISE AGAINST YOU!

Edit: Actually might use this to reduce the impact on warfare balance

 

[Chrisy15]

Okay, I now understand the constraints of a combined mod. Thank you for considering it, and explaining the issue.

Okay, instead of a combined mod, one thing that can really help is your team's recommendations regarding mod load order. I checked your instructions in multiple places and didn't see much info. If this exists already, where can I find it?

From previous experience with modding in Skyrim, I know how critical the load order is and how subtle minor errors can ripple, but not be obvious at first. When bugs occasionally surface in Civ 5, I'm always a bit suspicious of my mod load order, and wish I could check it against a recommended list.

An example of impact can be seen with "More Luxuries". Though Steam allows you to load it just about anywhere, its load order is important. Loading it early won't cause a major break, but some of the resources won't spawn correctly. This is one of the few mods I've found where the mod author makes suggestions on load order in the Details.

Since we have so many great JFD mods, any recommendations your team makes regarding mod load order would be appreciated!!! It doesn't need to be all encompassing, but referencing other common mods would be really helpful for troubleshooting.

For discussion purposes, here is a common load order i use. (Note: i check to make sure only 1 DLL is active at a time, and I tend to turn off any lua scripts not in use.). I suspect something minor may be broken here because if I try to load JFD mercenaries, i often get CTD somewhere between turn 70 - 180). I uninstalled mercenaries for now, planning on troubleshooting it in the future.

1) Community Balance Patch Suite (CP, CBP, CSD_for_CBP, Civ4Diplo, CBP_compatibility_files_EUI)
2) Sukritacts Events and Decisions (though I turn Events off because of CTD and just use Decisions)
3) R.E.D. Modpack (v27) and R.E.D. Reduced_File_Size (v23)
4) JFD Cultural Diversity (Core v4)
5) JFD Exploration Contnued Expanded (v8)
6) JFD Piety and Sovereignty (Piety v5)
7) Civilizations
7a. JFD Civilizations
7b. Sukritact's Civilizations
7c. CL Civilizaitons
7d. MC Civilizations
7e. Civilizations by other mod authors
9) Maps
9a. YnAEMP (v.23) with updates by JFD
9b. YnAEMP City States for BNW (v1)
9c. CL YnAEMP Compatibility Patch (v.1)
9d. Other Maps
10. Other Misc. Mods
10a. Unit Path Viewer (v. 10)
10b. Fortress Borders (v. 2)
11. More Luxuries v.155 (loaded near end as recommended by mod author in instructions)

Other mods I occasionally use or intend to use:

* Ethnic Units (v31)
* JFD Mercenaries (Not currently using, seems to cause CTD, but undiagnosed)
* JFD Cities in Development (New, just downloaded, haven't tried it yet)
* City Limits (v.7)

Sorry about the long text block, but thank you in advance for any help you can provide!

5. Mod load order isn't much of an issue; Modbuddy's References and Dependencies system works well enough, and I'm pretty sure that as long as there is a CREATE TABLE IF NOT EXISTS check for any cross-mod tables, then load order doesn't even make a difference (hence why you don't need to lay out your Actions order in Modbuddy to be Art --> Text --> Uniques --> Leader --> Civ --> Mod Support).

As long as all foreign tables are given a CREATE TABLE IF NOT EXISTS check, it doesn't matter if they are referenced or not. Referencing is more useful for telling the user what the mod supports. (JFD, plz confirm - I have a tendency to spurt AssignStartingPlots.lua when I explain things)

Just an FYI, be aware of circular mod references crashing the game. I had an issue with the Sioux referencing Piety, which in turn referenced HR, which referenced the Sioux, because I had forgotten to update them appropriately.

Sukritact pointed this out earlier, and it's worth bearing in mind before referencing every mod on the internet.

but referencing other common mods would be really helpful for troubleshooting.

JFD's Civs reference anything they support, so I'm not sure what else they're meant to reference...

From previous experience with modding in Skyrim, I know how critical the load order is and how subtle minor errors can ripple, but not be obvious at first.

[Disclaimer: I don't know much about Skyrim modding, or the real inner workings of Civ] The difference here is that when you're modding Skyrim, you're either adding an object, or changing things. Adding items shouldn't be much of an issue, but if two mods change the same thing (say, you accidentally install two Whiterun Overhaul mods), then you encounter issues. It's the same with Civ. Adding things, like a Piety mechanic, won't interfere with other mods (H&P sounds like it was just bad luck that it didn't work with CP); but changing things, like a building's database values, will cause issues if two mods try to do two different things to it. Therefore, as long as you don't use mods that change the same thing twice, you should be fine. In a scenario where you have to, then load order becomes an issue. Even then, it's unlikely that a building being changed twice will cause an error as bad as a CTD.

Out of interest, what's this in aid of? You haven't said that you're having issues with anything; why are we having this conversation!? If you are having an issue, just report it with your Database and Lua logs, so that the developer can work out what's wrong.

your team

There's a team...

 

[JFD]

Okay, I now understand the constraints of a combined mod. Thank you for considering it, and explaining the issue.

Okay, instead of a combined mod, one thing that can really help is your team's recommendations regarding mod load order. I checked your instructions in multiple places and didn't see much info. If this exists already, where can I find it?

From previous experience with modding in Skyrim, I know how critical the load order is and how subtle minor errors can ripple, but not be obvious at first. When bugs occasionally surface in Civ 5, I'm always a bit suspicious of my mod load order, and wish I could check it against a recommended list.

An example of impact can be seen with "More Luxuries". Though Steam allows you to load it just about anywhere, its load order is important. Loading it early won't cause a major break, but some of the resources won't spawn correctly. This is one of the few mods I've found where the mod author makes suggestions on load order in the Details.

Since we have so many great JFD mods, any recommendations your team makes regarding mod load order would be appreciated!!! It doesn't need to be all encompassing, but referencing other common mods would be really helpful for troubleshooting.

For discussion purposes, here is a common load order i use. (Note: i check to make sure only 1 DLL is active at a time, and I tend to turn off any lua scripts not in use.). I suspect something minor may be broken here because if I try to load JFD mercenaries, i often get CTD somewhere between turn 70 - 180). I uninstalled mercenaries for now, planning on troubleshooting it in the future.

1) Community Balance Patch Suite (CP, CBP, CSD_for_CBP, Civ4Diplo, CBP_compatibility_files_EUI)
2) Sukritacts Events and Decisions (though I turn Events off because of CTD and just use Decisions)
3) R.E.D. Modpack (v27) and R.E.D. Reduced_File_Size (v23)
4) JFD Cultural Diversity (Core v4)
5) JFD Exploration Contnued Expanded (v8)
6) JFD Piety and Sovereignty (Piety v5)
7) Civilizations
7a. JFD Civilizations
7b. Sukritact's Civilizations
7c. CL Civilizaitons
7d. MC Civilizations
7e. Civilizations by other mod authors
9) Maps
9a. YnAEMP (v.23) with updates by JFD
9b. YnAEMP City States for BNW (v1)
9c. CL YnAEMP Compatibility Patch (v.1)
9d. Other Maps
10. Other Misc. Mods
10a. Unit Path Viewer (v. 10)
10b. Fortress Borders (v. 2)
11. More Luxuries v.155 (loaded near end as recommended by mod author in instructions)

Other mods I occasionally use or intend to use:

* Ethnic Units (v31)
* JFD Mercenaries (Not currently using, seems to cause CTD, but undiagnosed)
* JFD Cities in Development (New, just downloaded, haven't tried it yet)
* City Limits (v.7)

Sorry about the long text block, but thank you in advance for any help you can provide!

Unlike with Skyrim, the issue of load order can be handled by the mod author, which is what references are for. Generally, if a reference hasn't been added, its not needed. There is therefore no need for the user to worry about load order, generally. The bigger issue is in using outdated mods, or mods which have database errors which were not resolved by the mod author (this can be especially true of older mods).

A CTD with Mercenaries does not necessarily mean an issue with your setup or load order. It could be an issue with TSL, which Mercenaries uses, which has reported to be a bit unstable. To resolve this, I'm considering switching the method of registering what contracts have been taken (to dummy policies, which whilst less clean would use the game's own caching system), but this will be exclusive to Trade & Prosper (as it'll be too much work otherwise).

Incidentally, I don't think the CL YnAEMP Comp. Patch is needed anymore, as all (most?) CL civs have internal support now.

As long as all foreign tables are given a CREATE TABLE IF NOT EXISTS check, it doesn't matter if they are referenced or not. Referencing is more useful for telling the user what the mod supports. (JFD, plz confirm - I have a tendency to spurt AssignStartingPlots.lua when I explain things)

There's a team...

Almost. CREATE TABLE IF NOT EXISTS will usually resolve any conflicts, however, issues will arise if one of those tables adds a column that does not exist in the other. So if Mod A uses CREATE TABLE IF NOT EXISTS with ThisTag and Mod B uses CREATE TABLE ETC. but omits ThisTag, if Mod B loads last, anything trying to access ThisTag will fail. This has been one of the bigger problems I've had to deal with, as I continue to add options in Civilization_JFD_CultureTypes for CulDiv. The resolution to this is for the user to always have CulDiv active, as if not (or, if you use a mod that doesn't reference CulDiv - i.e. More Civs India) there will be a conflict, often resulting in the lack of decisions issue (this being the more noticeable side effect).

Chris(y?), look for your name in the Imperial Announcement coming later today

It's mostly just me on these secondary mods (secondary to my civs), with Jan, Sukritact, Viregel, the Pope, and others proving indispensible but irregular help. Which is why so many bugs can slip through

 

[Kesler]

TSL being true start location? How does that effect mercs?
Do you know what civ mods still require their own individual YnAEMP patch? I don't plan to use YnAEMP until that update comes out, but curious none the less.

Are there any popular mods you would recommend not using in conjunction with yours (until the respective mod has a comparability update)?

Looking forward to the Imperial Annoucment

 

[Tarmont]

TSL being true start location?

Table saver loader

 

[JFD]

This TSL.

All (most?) of LastSword's still need the patch, and possibility Leugi's civs.

The Community Balance Patch. Overhauls are in conflict with my design. I only support CBP out of deference to Pope Gazebo. Eventually, I hope to offer Society Divided as an alternative to things like Reform and Rule, which will be more balanced toward my entire catalogue of mods. Then there are things like MC's India, which does not have proper mod support. I'd personally stick with only MC civs that were done by Sukritact or were recently updated, as the rest tend to not have proper support (especially because of XML), sometimes (like India) outright causing harm to one's mod list.