Forts & Citadels

[adrianj]

Citadels give 100% defensive bonus, and deal 3 damage to any enemy unit that enters an adjacent hex. I would probably put a tank there, but I havent played a game that far yet.

Oh sorry... I was thinking the metaphorical tank unit, not an actual tank. One that can defend very well - which would typically be a high strength melee/gunpowder unit.

 

[QuixotesGhost]

I guess I'm more curious as to when they would have a strategic use. It's rare to find a nice bottleneck so most of the time an enemy can just go around rather than even have to deal with the fort.

I mean I would love every map to have a Thermopylae style bottleneck where I can just toss a citadel and pray some poor fool would try to break through, but 90% of the time I'm on the coast with a full spray of open hexes.

Funneling the enemy armies into a narrower column is pretty handy, even if they can go around, since it means less units that your archers and artilery have to pick off per turn.

 

[Bibor]

I guess I'm more curious as to when they would have a strategic use. It's rare to find a nice bottleneck so most of the time an enemy can just go around rather than even have to deal with the fort.

I mean I would love every map to have a Thermopylae style bottleneck where I can just toss a citadel and pray some poor fool would try to break through, but 90% of the time I'm on the coast with a full spray of open hexes.

That's not their only use. As you know, units now have Zones of Control. This can be used to your advantage as it helps protecting your artillery/archers. Thus, a fortified "generic unit" (i.e. not having vunerabilities), possibly the best unit for the era (longswordsman, rifleman etc) in a FORT that is adjacent to your city (or any other critical spot basically forces enemy units to move 1 tile a turn. This gives your arty enough time to burn them down.

This also works well with river crossings. The unit becomes super-tough especially if its promos are planned for the terrain type the fort is on.

Also forts can be used to protect your flanks while your arty/archers focus on the main enemy offensive.

I once had 3 forts surrounding my city located on a giant riverside grassland because of stupid Arabs constantly declaring. It really did help me win. Loosing a longswordsman that takes 10-12 turns to build to lazyness is just bad economy

 

[slowjames]

Since you have to put the citadel inside your borders, it's hard to find a place to put it (in my opinion). But in my current game, one of my cities has a single desert tile next to it, so I put one there and stationed an archer in it.

Get ready to have your mind blown. GA + GG = Citadel inside enemy culture.

 

[Bibor]

Get ready to have your mind blown. GA + GG = Citadel inside enemy culture.

You're doing something wrong if you are on the offensive and you need this kind of a citadel to help you win.

 

[slowjames]

You're doing something wrong if you are on the offensive and you need this kind of a citadel to help you win.

No doubt, but it strikes me as a pretty excellent kind of FU move. GA could also be used as a kind of ultra pillage, because can you even get back those lost tiles? If you can I do not know how. If you could get a 7-hex covering of some important enemy resources, for example his only copy of gold, etc., it could prove very painful even if you can't take his city.

 

[Bibor]

No doubt, but it strikes me as a pretty excellent kind of FU move. GA could also be used as a kind of ultra pillage, because can you even get back those lost tiles? If you can I do not know how. If you could get a 7-hex covering of some important enemy resources, for example his only copy of gold, etc., it could prove very painful even if you can't take his city.

You'll get more everything by burning that artist and general on a Golden Age.

 

[slowjames]

You'll get more everything by burning that artist and general on a Golden Age.

Granted, and once again, I'm not trying to say it's the right strategic call. It's just interesting.

 

[Thalassicus]

In one game I had a single fort on a flank of my empire, with a musketman in it and cannon behind, both on hills. The musketman's zone of control made it difficult for enemies to reach my cannon. Those two units alone held off their whole army while I conquered cities on the other flank of the empire. Siege units can dominate a 5-tile-wide stretch of terrain (7 with artillery!) making that single fort guarding nearby much more powerful.

Citadels desperately need to give access to resources under them, though, given the massive cost incurred in producing one (lose a golden age).

 

[evanbgood]

One thing to note (and I'm 90% sure this is true), while Citadels must be built within your own territory, forts can be built in neutral land by a well-protected worker. Though this is certainly not a solution for every war, a long road leading to a fort could be an interesting way to hammer a tough enemy's border and to field well-protected arti units quickly.
If I was to say there should be any improvement to this aspect of the game, I think it would be handy if forts or citadels had a minor great general effect of surrounding tiles, perhaps even just a defensive one, or one that works only on ranged units. And, I think it would help if an archer was considered beefier inside a fort than, say, a swordsman. After all, one of those two people doesn't need to use a door