With Frederick the Great in the game, Germany seems a possible candidate for a culture civ this time around, as well.
Frida Kahlo as curveball leader for Mexico
- Thread starter Hilton1
- Start date
I don't know. I could see the civ itself be militaristic and economic like it always has been.
Now the cultural part could definitely come from Frederick the Great himself, but he won't have to be paired with Germany.
Most leaders so far have themed pretty well with their "historic" civ, though (even if some of them theme even better with another civ--e.g., Trung Trac and Maya).
Evie
Pronounced like Eevee
It'S not like you *need* Ben Franklin to have more than enough founding fathers to fill a whole roster of unique civilian units.
I mean I could still see both of them sharing the militaristic trait, so it's not far off. I could also see them giving him two personas: one focused around his military career and the other focused on culture and science (Philosopher-King).
You're not wrong. It would just be ironic to have a non-president Founding Father as leader, and then have unique Founding Fathers that became eventual presidents.
seasnake
Conquistador
I agree with this completely. However, after Ada Lovelace and Harriet Tubman, it doesn't matter anymore. All bets are off, and we are no longer concerning ourselves with "leaders" leading nations but "personalities" playing a game with you.
Evie
Pronounced like Eevee
Neither Nichollo Machiavelli (sure, he was involved in politics, but he was no leader of nations) nor Ibn Battuta led nations, and they were revealed before Harriet or Ada, but somehow it's those two that are the harbinger of doom, not the ones that actually came first.
Mudkip1001
Warlord
- Joined
- Sep 30, 2017
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- 143
Bump this, Humankind has already done a Frida-esque event, lets shake it up
seasnake
Conquistador
I agree with you about Ibn Battuta as well, I forgot about him. It's like having Marco Polo as a leader, which yes, would also be bad.
Disagree on Machiavelli though, he was actually a statesman and diplomat in Florence at a time when Florence as a major center of power. Combine his life experience with his connections to the ruling class and influential governing philosophy which shaped the polices of a nation/state, and he's much more like Confucious or Ben Franklin, thought leaders of their time. Frida, Ada, Harriet and Ibn Battuta, not so much. They had accomplishments, but they're not really leaders.
My argument was not so much that she wouldn't be included as a leader, but rather that she shouldn't.
seasnake
Conquistador
I understand, and I agree with your reasons. I am just resigned to the fact that Firaxis will just use whoever at this point without regard to those qualities that would have been necessary to make someone a leader not even five years ago. I don't think it will make the game worse, just something that is different about this iteration.
Thenewwwguy
Deity
i love the implication here because i guarantee you that laika the dog is a historical figure with far more cultural relevance and proximity to political leadership than you or i most likely have ever had or ever will
Bonus to air combat
ehecatzin
Emperor
- Joined
- Jun 29, 2007
- Messages
- 1,854
You say that but historical animals as leaders would make for an incredible April's fool game mode. Laika, Bucephalus, St. Guinefort, Wojtek the bear, Balto, Hachiko
sudden ck2 flashbacks.
Nice to see this thread resuscitated, especially as the discussion over more curveball leaders resonates with the thread about Ada Lovelace today.
I think it's interesting that the majority of posts in this thread were hostile towards the idea of Frida Kahlo as a leader, some on the grounds that she wasn't important enough politically, but the majority in the forum seems to have rallied in approval of Ada Lovelace.
I wonder if this is a shift in opinion between November and now since we've had more leaders revealed, reflective of other dynamics (perhaps the Civ/gamer community is more favourably inclined towards and/or familiar with computer scientists than revolutionary artists?) or simply a difference in opinion on them as individual choices?
I think it's interesting that the majority of posts in this thread were hostile towards the idea of Frida Kahlo as a leader, some on the grounds that she wasn't important enough politically, but the majority in the forum seems to have rallied in approval of Ada Lovelace.
I wonder if this is a shift in opinion between November and now since we've had more leaders revealed, reflective of other dynamics (perhaps the Civ/gamer community is more favourably inclined towards and/or familiar with computer scientists than revolutionary artists?) or simply a difference in opinion on them as individual choices?
ehecatzin
Emperor
- Joined
- Jun 29, 2007
- Messages
- 1,854
Just to clarify, my issues with Frida is not about her being a woman or a curve ball, is that to foreign audiences she represents the "mexican artist" archetype, HOWEVER, it represents it due to pop culture overload and cartoonish simplification, (Che Guevara on T-shirts levels of overload) that have little in common with the real Frida. (I mean just look at Coco for a quick example)
If you had to add a mexican female artist, you've got Sor Juana Inez, Leonora Carrington, or Remedios Varos for example. I'll play devils advocate on my own point, but if Firaxis think that they can pull off an historical Frida, deeply in pain and miserable (but fashionable af), give it a go. If you are going to make her a bubbly missunderstood colorful artist please refrain.
Now if you want an exploration age feminist Icon that can represent multiple cultures, was a poet, writer, philospher, composer and had a fiery personality to boot...
*points furiosuly at Sor Juana Inez for leader*
man I think I'll keep this as signature hahaha
If you had to add a mexican female artist, you've got Sor Juana Inez, Leonora Carrington, or Remedios Varos for example. I'll play devils advocate on my own point, but if Firaxis think that they can pull off an historical Frida, deeply in pain and miserable (but fashionable af), give it a go. If you are going to make her a bubbly missunderstood colorful artist please refrain.
Now if you want an exploration age feminist Icon that can represent multiple cultures, was a poet, writer, philospher, composer and had a fiery personality to boot...
*points furiosuly at Sor Juana Inez for leader*
man I think I'll keep this as signature hahaha
