Frustrated with immortal
- Thread starter jorissimo
- Start date
I think you can just wait and take peace due to war success. The religious situation is the best possible - Korea is completely isolated.
Not totally sold on the monarchy idea (well I'm pretty sure it's wrong) though can't open the save now. You can get poly though and then try to get monarchy via trade (they will ALWAYS trade it because it doesn't unlock any unit/building). Just go HBR then.
Oh Monty certainly has more than two cities, it's just that he doesn't talk to you so you don't have access to his city number, so it just shows the ones you see plus capital.
Not totally sold on the monarchy idea (well I'm pretty sure it's wrong) though can't open the save now. You can get poly though and then try to get monarchy via trade (they will ALWAYS trade it because it doesn't unlock any unit/building). Just go HBR then.
Oh Monty certainly has more than two cities, it's just that he doesn't talk to you so you don't have access to his city number, so it just shows the ones you see plus capital.
a pen-dragon
Prince
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- Jun 8, 2024
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- 386
I think it is possible to go for Wang regardless. Monty just lost his initial stack, so a garrison of 2-3 axes, 1-2 spears and a few troops in the vicinity that you keep producing will be sufficient to defend against him. This is greatly helped by your border, since you will see him coming.
Now it is Monty, but even he will probably be willing to speak to you soonish. If he wants something, giving him a (cheap) tech or two is absolutely worth it, especially considering he will probably be plotting again before your peace treaty is up.
Now it is Monty, but even he will probably be willing to speak to you soonish. If he wants something, giving him a (cheap) tech or two is absolutely worth it, especially considering he will probably be plotting again before your peace treaty is up.
Well that wasn't expected .You never quite know which way Monty will go on maps like this.
You could almost do a choke point on the forest hill for Monty with axe and spear. This is not a disaster. I don't think Monty's attack will go anywhere.
The primary objective should still be Koreans. I think you could use some more melee units here. 9 catapults will be enough to declare on Korea. You can add more catapults once you replenish the melee lost.
The only worry is how quickly Monty sends another stack. I think 2-3 axes and 1-2 spears will stop anything he sends. It does pay to scout out AI. Generally if their stack is on your border you are likely a target.
You can micro Angkor Thon to finish the catapult to finish in 1 turn. (use mine) Learn to whip catapults into axes or swords. Never good to have more than 20 hammers in a catapult unless you can finish it or whip another unit into it.
Angkor Wat can borrow the cow from the capital for a turn and use the forest tile to build an axe in 1 turn.
You should not be running scientists. Never great unless golden age.
I still like the HBR plan for when you have ivory. If Korea gets phants that will be annoying.
You could almost do a choke point on the forest hill for Monty with axe and spear. This is not a disaster. I don't think Monty's attack will go anywhere.
The primary objective should still be Koreans. I think you could use some more melee units here. 9 catapults will be enough to declare on Korea. You can add more catapults once you replenish the melee lost.
The only worry is how quickly Monty sends another stack. I think 2-3 axes and 1-2 spears will stop anything he sends. It does pay to scout out AI. Generally if their stack is on your border you are likely a target.
You can micro Angkor Thon to finish the catapult to finish in 1 turn. (use mine) Learn to whip catapults into axes or swords. Never good to have more than 20 hammers in a catapult unless you can finish it or whip another unit into it.
Angkor Wat can borrow the cow from the capital for a turn and use the forest tile to build an axe in 1 turn.
You should not be running scientists. Never great unless golden age.
I still like the HBR plan for when you have ivory. If Korea gets phants that will be annoying.
pigswill
fly (one day)
If you squash defenders with cats melee losses will be minimal to non existent so you have enough units at the moment. Couple of defenders on hill forest (75% defnece) should be enough until Monte builds a serious stack. Capture Ivory City then peace out with WK.
Plan B: Forget elepult and stomp Monte.
Plan B: Forget elepult and stomp Monte.
I scouted his capital not so long ago and there was nothing there. But he's building swords, one popped up in the ivory city.
So your suggestion is to get the ivory city, peace out, build an eleforce and then take the rest (or go after Monty)?
So long term objectives here. You need more happiness resources and Koreans have several calendar resources. Ivory is useful for war too. You won't win this game on 4 cities. You need to double your empire or all this whipping and chopping was a waste.
You could attack the Aztecs. They are not protective but they are spamming chariots, axes and swords. My view is Monty will attack a lot of his neighbours and generally not get anywhere as he is normally backwards. He hates the Koreans and likely could attack HRE too. He already views that he is losing the war but some Ai need 7-10 turns before they will talk. At which point he will be offering you free techs. You have not scouted him out at all so go in blind.
If you attack Aztecs and take them out your borders will be directly next to Vikings who may decide to attack you if you don't get them to pleased.Hopefully religion will help.
You have built up a big army here. The closer you get to 1ad the closer the Ai will be to feudalism. 8-9 catapults and 8-9 melee will take the Koreans first city. He will have a few units just wandering about and will whip. The border city has no walls. So you can bombard and attack on the same turn or bombard and attack following turn if he has 6-7 defenders. 3-4 attacking catapults should eb enough. 0% defences is not always needed but helps combat odds. He has a sword roaming in your borders so you need to see where this goes when you cancel open borders as you will want an axe to cover this off. Generally pending on dice rolls you may lose 1-3 catapults on a city and 1-2 melee if unlucky.
The ivory city will be swallowed up in Korean culture. Personally I would not build a 18-20 stack army take 1 border city and take peace. You can tech towards HBR with capture gold. You don't need to take peace. I doubt Koreans would take peace in 4-5 turns anyway. The key objective of any initial attack is ivory and the capital all 3-4 tiles from your borders. Unlike the Aztecs who could be further away. Here you can see exactly what you might capture. Great wall has no value now anyway.
Get to point where you have taken ivory city and upload. If you have 8-9 melee and 7-8 pults then just move on. You need to replace lost units and will need 1-2 units to defend the ivory city. Hopefully the AI just hides in the cities while you attack.
You could attack the Aztecs. They are not protective but they are spamming chariots, axes and swords. My view is Monty will attack a lot of his neighbours and generally not get anywhere as he is normally backwards. He hates the Koreans and likely could attack HRE too. He already views that he is losing the war but some Ai need 7-10 turns before they will talk. At which point he will be offering you free techs. You have not scouted him out at all so go in blind.
If you attack Aztecs and take them out your borders will be directly next to Vikings who may decide to attack you if you don't get them to pleased.Hopefully religion will help.
You have built up a big army here. The closer you get to 1ad the closer the Ai will be to feudalism. 8-9 catapults and 8-9 melee will take the Koreans first city. He will have a few units just wandering about and will whip. The border city has no walls. So you can bombard and attack on the same turn or bombard and attack following turn if he has 6-7 defenders. 3-4 attacking catapults should eb enough. 0% defences is not always needed but helps combat odds. He has a sword roaming in your borders so you need to see where this goes when you cancel open borders as you will want an axe to cover this off. Generally pending on dice rolls you may lose 1-3 catapults on a city and 1-2 melee if unlucky.
The ivory city will be swallowed up in Korean culture. Personally I would not build a 18-20 stack army take 1 border city and take peace. You can tech towards HBR with capture gold. You don't need to take peace. I doubt Koreans would take peace in 4-5 turns anyway. The key objective of any initial attack is ivory and the capital all 3-4 tiles from your borders. Unlike the Aztecs who could be further away. Here you can see exactly what you might capture. Great wall has no value now anyway.
Get to point where you have taken ivory city and upload. If you have 8-9 melee and 7-8 pults then just move on. You need to replace lost units and will need 1-2 units to defend the ivory city. Hopefully the AI just hides in the cities while you attack.
pigswill
fly (one day)
Like Gumbolt said go for Korea, leave 2 axes and a spear on forest hill to cover Monte, move rest to Korea, capture Ivory City then review. Don't forget to build a medic.
a pen-dragon
Prince
- Joined
- Jun 8, 2024
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- 386
Nice!
Concerning your stack I am surprised that it is on the floodplains, the forests would have had two advantages: first there is the defensive bonus, second since your workers are idle two of them could have joined the stack and roaded the forest with your stack, speding up reinforecements and connecting the city. As things are now the city is not connected to your main trade network, thus the other cities will not have access to ivory. This road needs to be done ASAP.
Arguably it might also have been better to not reinforce the city and let Wang recapture it. The reason for this is that both your army and Wang's troops have an offensive focus. Since the units are not fortified the attacker will get better odds. With the current situation you will likely loose two units in the city defending, more if he has units in the fog that can attack, or the combats are unlucky. Had you not reinforced the city you would have lost the sword that captured it and possibly a cat or two, OTOH this is slowing the conquest by one turn. Now that you have committed to reinforce it in this situation I think that the axe belongs in the city.
Regarding stacking unhappiness, IMHO as long as a city can grow to size 4 it can reasonably be whipped. Stacked unhappiness is not very nice but definitely better than losing (or stalling) a war. Obviously reckless whipping will stall your economy, but in this case I believe that troops are more important. As a rule of thumb, as long as you think that your current units are insufficient, whip more. 2-4 unhappiness can reasonably be stacked, especially since the current happiness situation is not too bad. After the war monarchy will come around and the troops can be spread as MPs to make up for the anger. As soon as you get the prerequisites a Monarchy trade should be available, so it actually is only about 5 turns away.
Resource-wise ivory will come soon and Huayna is willing to trade gems. Up to factories happiness is more important than health, so feel free to trade away single health resources. Cow, Sheep and Deer can all be traded away, if possible in that order due to different abundancies. If you do not think that you will be able to hook up the Ivory, trade for it, Huayna has some surplus. If you decide to go for it that should be done now, as I think the price will go up once you have the tech to build elephants.
Your capital could be whipped as you will soon have HBR and it currently does not have any whipping anger.
Concerning your stack I am surprised that it is on the floodplains, the forests would have had two advantages: first there is the defensive bonus, second since your workers are idle two of them could have joined the stack and roaded the forest with your stack, speding up reinforecements and connecting the city. As things are now the city is not connected to your main trade network, thus the other cities will not have access to ivory. This road needs to be done ASAP.
Arguably it might also have been better to not reinforce the city and let Wang recapture it. The reason for this is that both your army and Wang's troops have an offensive focus. Since the units are not fortified the attacker will get better odds. With the current situation you will likely loose two units in the city defending, more if he has units in the fog that can attack, or the combats are unlucky. Had you not reinforced the city you would have lost the sword that captured it and possibly a cat or two, OTOH this is slowing the conquest by one turn. Now that you have committed to reinforce it in this situation I think that the axe belongs in the city.
Regarding stacking unhappiness, IMHO as long as a city can grow to size 4 it can reasonably be whipped. Stacked unhappiness is not very nice but definitely better than losing (or stalling) a war. Obviously reckless whipping will stall your economy, but in this case I believe that troops are more important. As a rule of thumb, as long as you think that your current units are insufficient, whip more. 2-4 unhappiness can reasonably be stacked, especially since the current happiness situation is not too bad. After the war monarchy will come around and the troops can be spread as MPs to make up for the anger. As soon as you get the prerequisites a Monarchy trade should be available, so it actually is only about 5 turns away.
Resource-wise ivory will come soon and Huayna is willing to trade gems. Up to factories happiness is more important than health, so feel free to trade away single health resources. Cow, Sheep and Deer can all be traded away, if possible in that order due to different abundancies. If you do not think that you will be able to hook up the Ivory, trade for it, Huayna has some surplus. If you decide to go for it that should be done now, as I think the price will go up once you have the tech to build elephants.
Your capital could be whipped as you will soon have HBR and it currently does not have any whipping anger.
Just to clarify the stack position: there was a sword on the floodplain that I preferred to take out there rather than in the city. Then it seemed logical to move everything onto that tile in order to not have any loose units hanging around. Oh and I forgot the thing about the road. Should have sent some combat engineers along. Thanks for the tip about the gems, I already traded some other luxuries from HC and still have enough resources to trade to him. Btw, Ragnar is plotting, and I'm just going to pray he is not also coming my way.
Not ideal that Korea has 6 units outside your city. Tough call. At present you lack the forces to take his capital. You will need 6-7 melee for this. Which you have just produced.
Whip Angkhor so you can complete the catapult following turn.
Agree about trading hapiness resources. You need road to Ivory too as not connected.
For now see what units you lose to his 6 units.
3 workers on one mine? Not sure why you would put 2 workers on borders with Aztecs when you know you are at war with him. I guess 1 turn tp chop that forest but if Aztecs won't take peace you will need 3 units on the worker next turn. Speeds up axe.
Ragnar will usuually attack someone he has borders with.
My gut is Aztecs would skip the forest hill. Maybe time to move the units back? Fingers crossed Aztecs offer peace soon to free up units.
What are all the f's for? Please do not farm the plains a complete waste.
Overall not bad. Capital is more than doable in a few turns. 4-5 melee can follow a turn later if needed. Medic unit would be good. Wounded catapults can still move with stack and just bombard.
Whip Angkhor so you can complete the catapult following turn.
Agree about trading hapiness resources. You need road to Ivory too as not connected.
For now see what units you lose to his 6 units.
3 workers on one mine? Not sure why you would put 2 workers on borders with Aztecs when you know you are at war with him. I guess 1 turn tp chop that forest but if Aztecs won't take peace you will need 3 units on the worker next turn. Speeds up axe.
Ragnar will usuually attack someone he has borders with.
My gut is Aztecs would skip the forest hill. Maybe time to move the units back? Fingers crossed Aztecs offer peace soon to free up units.
What are all the f's for? Please do not farm the plains a complete waste.
Overall not bad. Capital is more than doable in a few turns. 4-5 melee can follow a turn later if needed. Medic unit would be good. Wounded catapults can still move with stack and just bombard.
pigswill
fly (one day)
No medic means no medic3 GG , a really good way to speed up an invasion.
Just stick units in captured city, heal and move to capital.
Just stick units in captured city, heal and move to capital.
He has a great general in his capital. Can be attached to the axe once it leave the capital and lvl3 medic sorted. Lack of road is the main issue.
Maybe better to attach to warrior give combat 1 and lvl3 medic and use free upgrade. You could keep as warrior so it never defends.
Maybe better to attach to warrior give combat 1 and lvl3 medic and use free upgrade. You could keep as warrior so it never defends.
Fs are for spreading irrigation to the corns and the rice (not sure it will spread through the desert city though). Didn't really know what to do with my workers. But of course should have used them as military engineers.
Qactus
Romani ite domum
I still remember the game where after a bunch of cats, trebs and maces against a city I accidentally attacked with such a medic3 general warrior ... and somehow won the fight. Realizing that I just sacrificed my super medic, then realizing it actually survived, then realizing the resulting bunch of XP from that most improbable of improbable fights allowed me to add Woody3 on top of the medic promos...
Can't open the save so I don't understand if the captured city is connected or not? Quite a big mistake if not.
I would likely not sacrifice the GG for super-medic, normal medic is fine for me and it's more important to get some lvl3 (edit: hmm or is it lvl4?) cats i.e. I'd attach to a bunch of cats trying to hit 10xp.
I would likely not sacrifice the GG for super-medic, normal medic is fine for me and it's more important to get some lvl3 (edit: hmm or is it lvl4?) cats i.e. I'd attach to a bunch of cats trying to hit 10xp.
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