G-Minor 119

[shulec]

I did a quick test. Here were my findings:

Spoiler :

I think you are out of luck

 

[Manco Capac]

Hmmm...that's life I guess.

Teacher:
Now, what we have learnt kids...never take every bit of information for a truth on internets because some are nasty.
Me raising my hand: When I'll be fully grown, I'll be more careful on internets.

 

[AgedOne]

Look at the newbie...I AM!!!

Seems good isn't it?

Earliest Conquest victory on G Minor 119 coming right up!


...oh...

 

[Sun Tzu Wu]

Fast early Technology trading with Gandhi:

By killing Lincoln (couldn't resist because of gems), I've lost my last chance to get techs from the AI's, simply Gandhi.

Frankly, how the "We don't want to start trading this technology just yet" still in work when there is no remaining civs, except me. He has Polytheism, Masonry, Monotheism and I want them. Liberate bad situated cities for getting friendly status...hell no...don't wanna put 200 hammers for Gandhi.

Any suggestions...

Your only realistic option is get to Friendly with Gandhi ASAP; a Friendly AI should trade any Technology he has to you. Since he has a +2 Base Attitude that may not be as difficult as one might think. Giving him a City will net you +4 for fair trading (not sure you will get +4 at this difficulty level). You can get +2 for 50 resource turns (for example provide him with 5 resources for 10t would suffice); once at +2, you must provide at least one resource to maintain the +2 diplomatic bonus. Shared War is another option that ramps up +1 every 10 turns.

Espionage and Technology stealing is another option, but you need Alphabet to build spies who will do the actual Technology stealing and a Great Spy (The Great Wall?) to infiltrate Gandhi with. This option will be more useful for stealing later Era Technologies though.

What to do with a t43 Settler?:

A Settler at turn 43...come on! I needed cash! What to do? Settle near stone for early mids or give a city to this egocentric Gandhi who doesn't even want to share his secrets.

Well, the free Settler fits in well with getting the fair trading +4 bonus with Gandhi as I mentioned above (not sure you will get +4 at this difficulty level though).

Otherwise, I would settle adjacent to Stone, built a Stone Quarry and build The Pyramids to run Representation.

Sun Tzu Wu

 

[Walter_Wolf]

Hello

This is my first submission to the gauntlets. After a few attempts, I did a 1200 AD win. I always seemed to make some bad empire/diplomacy management.
In a last attempt last night, I rushed my closest neigbor (Willem), and got two settlers from huts. I didn't settle right away because of the early game economy crash risk. I didn't even have any workers yet. Would you guys reccomend settling asap? At the end Washington and Gilgamesh went to war, and I lost diplo points with both. I know, I know, I should have picked some other AI's for this.


In my submitted game, I got no engineers, so building the UN took 24 turns. That's a 950AD -> 1200AD difference (might have miscalculated).

I probably won't make it to the top 10, but it was fun participating (I still have 3 hours left lol).

Anyway, it was a great learning experience. Expect to hear from me again .

Cheers

 

[AgedOne]

Hello

This is my first submission to the gauntlets. After a few attempts, I did a 1200 AD win. I always seemed to make some bad empire/diplomacy management.
In a last attempt last night, I rushed my closest neigbor (Willem), and got two settlers from huts. I didn't settle right away because of the early game economy crash risk. I didn't even have any workers yet. Would you guys reccomend settling asap? At the end Washington and Gilgamesh went to war, and I lost diplo points with both. I know, I know, I should have picked some other AI's for this.


In my submitted game, I got no engineers, so building the UN took 24 turns. That's a 950AD -> 1200AD difference (might have miscalculated).

I probably won't make it to the top 10, but it was fun participating (I still have 3 hours left lol).

Anyway, it was a great learning experience. Expect to hear from me again .

Cheers

Welcome to the gauntlets, WW!
While you may not make the top 10 with that date, I don't expect to see you in last place either.
It's grimly amusing, the similarities between your game and my best attempt at this gauntlet . Two settlers from huts and one dead AI early on. No Gt Eng really makes the end-game drag!
As you already noted, you could have chosen your AI opponents better. However, it's not completely obvious. At the other extreme, if you pick AI that will get on very well with each other, they may end up voting for your UN opponent rather than you. It happens!
Incidentally, if you get 2 very early settlers, I think you can settle them without crashing your economy - but you have to place them close to your capital and choose the locations wisely for max commerce and growth.

If you fancy one last try - I know from experience that we actually have another 24 hours to the deadline. The cut-off is not at the beginning of 10th May, but almost at the end (GMT that is).

Anyway. It's good to see another new participant. I hope we do see you around some more

 

[Ozbenno]

If you fancy one last try - I know from experience that we actually have another 24 hours to the deadline. The cut-off is not at the beginning of 10th May, but almost at the end (GMT that is).

In fact, I think I'm doing the update tomorrow and it will be pretty much 24 hours from this post, so you have plenty of time for another try!!!

 

[DJMGator13]

I'm not going to have time to complete this one. I've made a few starts and have abandoned them all. But the discussion has been good. I can't wait to look at cas' BC save.

 

[Walter_Wolf]

Unfortunately, I didn't have the time for another try today.

Thanks anyway.

It's good to know about the 24 hours exploit

 

[Manco Capac]

At the other extreme, if you pick AI that will get on very well with each other, they may end up voting for your UN opponent rather than you. It happens!

Speaking of which, I've met such sweet situation.

Spoiler :

Not only I've had on hand two fails by killing everyone and thus disabling diplomatic victory in the process, but in a attempt, where I succeeded oracling Radio, at the moment of secretary-general vote, Lincoln was favored by one damn diplomatic point from bros of faith. In the end, this was an epic fail. If this continues, I'll be the buffon of gauntlets...oh wait.

Nonetheless, my ire was so intense I was able to surpass myself for once (or is it favors from RNG Gods?) and obtained:

Spoiler :

Exhaustive Write-up.

Starting Location: two gold tiles, two pigs and stone supply in the first culture ring. Rare case indeed. Furthermore, I am surrounded with forests.

Spoiler :

Northern position...near to tundra, then it is reasonably possible to find a civ in the near south and by looking the warrior location, it is favorable to go there for early incursion.

Everyone here seems to love free settlers from tribal huts, but I do prefer early workers over settlers. Especially on a crowded map like cold climate lakes, it is easy to fetch two additional cities, and usually good ones thanks to the normalizer, building a later fourth city isn't the end of the world. Getting two workers or better three is quite something, having its great deal of impact by:
- Avoiding making early workers in every city, which stunts growth
- Working improved tiles at moment usually impossible to do so (like a strong gem tile at turn 4, it happened to me once in my earlier attempt).

Anyway, I moved my warriors southward and villagers view me so promising that they gave me instantly workforce. Getting a worker at turn 0 is a strong motivation as I place myself in a deity AI position. Then, I directed the newly-hired worker west-north to see if I don't do any mistakes by going south: nothing around.

Spoiler :

3960 BC:

The next turn I was joyous to see a neighbour and a good one: Lincoln. If it was Mansa, it would be a bummer.



3880 BC:

Spoiler :

Time to claim and become the brittish empire. Note I do the small trick to stock beakers for five turns before choosing the tech in order to avoid partial tech gifting from huts, which is extremely annoying.
I decided to avoid Hunting because I know Mansa will pursue it and its use is a bit limited compared to Agriculture even though I only have livestock around. This doesn't mean the same for newly conquered capital.
Early tech order:
Agri. => AH => Writing => Alpha => Currency => Math => BW => CoL => CS => ...

Thanks Cabert for that idea. I realized soon how powerful it is to have Alpha and Currency early.

3800 BC:
After completing my first warrior at turn 4, I decided to pop the tribal hut north west to find another worker. Two workers at in the five first turns is extremely strong. This cast in stone (pun intended) my will to pursue this game to the end and avoid risky moves that screw everything.

Spoiler :

3440 BC:
I trained a second warrior for a total army force of three warriors. To avoid ugly situation where the first doesn't even scratch the defender, I prefer train one more, especially in situation I'm placed on a PH.
My first raid went well, too well. My first warrior won at 3.6 % prob. of winning. Woodsman II as an artificial scout then.

Spoiler :

3160 BC:
Aesthetics from a tribal hut; in my attempts, this was strangely the most common tech from huts. Anyways, it may be a useless tech at first, but gunning to music means I just save at best one turn of teching.

Spoiler :

2880 BC:
Alpha at turn 28. Sufficiently early for me.

Spoiler :

Here are the following trades:

Spoiler :

Each moment where both had one tech, I obtained the tech from Hatty to balance trades and avoid uselessly catapulting Mansa tech wise.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Because Mansa Musa was my slav...err...partner in science...I readily want to scout his territory to see if he has nice land to tech fast and to preview in advance what would be his tech order.

Two high-yielding mining resources , that's awesome for him, but regarding food-wise, yuck.
He founded a religion and has accessible marble under third culture ring. Of course, after exploring all area that might contain a tribal hut (then excluding icy regions), I kept an eye on him even though he's not a high wonderhogger.

Spoiler :

2800 BC:

It was time to erect a nation whose values are tightened to science, so right after building the first library in the world, I hired a scientist for a fastest great scientist to enlightened people with education.

Spoiler :

[/URL]

2720 BC:

Ennerved by ignorant masses miners and breeders, I decided to speed up Education of people about the virtues of knowledge. So important it was I neglected the training of the next workforce squad, which was scraped later.

Spoiler :

2600 BC - Currency is on. Time to build wealth and become rich, rich and rich.

Spoiler :

Hatty's BFC was revealed:

Spoiler :

Nothing interesting so far, but I kept an eye on her to see how fast she expands and develops. Nonetheless, she ended up building SH at a respectable date and Oracle around 900 BC. Damn you Hatty.

2480-2440 BC :
My earliest Great Scientist in my attempts. Time to educate people with an Academy. 16 additional beakers. Nice.

Spoiler :

2440 BC: I decided to tech Math before BW mainly because I hoped Mansa would reveal to me its secrets but he was preoccupied with other objectives. Can't blame him looking at his pitiful amount of forests and already good defenser online. At the same time, I began working on a quarry to build asap the Mids for getting benefit of Scientists. My lands have few rivers, thus cottage-wise strat. was out of question.
Mids ASAP.

Spoiler :

2400 BC : Ensuing with BW for chopping the Mids. At the same time, I did my first civic change to put even more pressure on my population: Slavery and OrgRel. Yeah, no freedom for a bit. I did civics changes by pair because the anarchy time is the same as one civic change early in the game. Slavery was really an in-between civic:
I only pop rush once...a library in Washington to take benefit of this two corn tiles.


[To be continued...]

 

[Ozbenno]

The gauntlet is now closed.

G-Minor 119 - Diplomatic, Warlord
1^st cas 50BC
2^nd tachywaxon 100AD
3^rd AAA 250AD

Congrats to the medal winners

Also thanks to everyone who took part in the discussion. It was very interesting to hear everyones views on this gauntlet and actually inspired me to take part in my first gauntlet for over a year!!

 

[Manco Capac]

Woot! I won second place once again.

 

[Sun Tzu Wu]

The gauntlet is now closed.

G-Minor 119 - Diplomatic, Warlord
1^st cas 50BC
2^nd tachywaxon 100AD
3^rd AAA 250AD

Congrats to the medal winners

Also thanks to everyone who took part in the discussion. It was very interesting to hear everyones views on this gauntlet and actually inspired me to take part in my first gauntlet for over a year!!

Well done everyone!

tachywaxon, I enjoyed the story of your 100AD victory (so far). Please do finish it.

Sun Tzu Wu

 

[Manco Capac]

tachywaxon, I enjoyed the story of your 100AD victory (so far).

Nice to see your interested by my 100 AD saga...that would turned out earlier (come to think) if I had put hammers into Oracle to dissuade Hatty building it around 900 BC.
I wouldn't built Oxford then and keept all forests for completing the UN to make up the second GE (You'll understand what I'm babbling in my next parts).

Nonetheless, I would like to see cas describes a bit more of his game; I just checked his game...I thought he would get early Workers and Settlers, nope. How did he manage to win so early then. I notice early Mids though, hmmm. I thought early worker was the key, but he made me doubt it.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

2360 BC : My hubris for eternal life brings me to the corner and I wanted a monument as big as my megalomania: The Pyramids of London...eh...

Spoiler :

2160 BC : I beelined towards CS, passing though CoL for another religion, hoping it would end up in Washington for better cultural popping. It did and this religions will bring to people a good way to live and good principles. My free missionary was doing a pilgrimage to London, the light city.

Spoiler :

2040-2000 BC :

My grandeur feelings satisfied, the society waved and science became the law. Time to hire scientists everywhere!

Spoiler :

[To be continued...in a new post]

 

[kcd_swede]

The gauntlet is now closed.

G-Minor 119 - Diplomatic, Warlord
1^st cas 50BC
2^nd tachywaxon 100AD
3^rd AAA 250AD

Congrats to the medal winners

Also thanks to everyone who took part in the discussion. It was very interesting to hear everyones views on this gauntlet and actually inspired me to take part in my first gauntlet for over a year!!

Very impressive finish dates! Just shows what can be done when the community shares ideas. I've been taking in as much of it as I can, even if the games were played so far above my skill level I focused my efforts elsewhere after getting my best diplo finish ever. Thanks for the discussions, guys! (and gals?)

 

[Manco Capac]

Regarding the tech trades, I forgot to put attention to one detail I've recently met:
Disregarding the "We don't want to start trading this technology just yet", some ancient times techs are readily accessible for trading even if it is not Mansa Musa.
Monarchy and Monotheism are two those techs. Probably people knows it, but I didn't in my first attempts except the one before my 100 AD DV. Knowing that and Hatty predisposition for Monotheism, I strategically let her tech it for me, without the fear of monopoly. Each turns count and let the AI at the lowest levels tech the first ancient times for you. Regarding why those techs, I think it has to do with enabling civics or they're not bringing any wonders the AI wants to keep for itself.


Let's continue.

1800 BC:

After attempts, I gained confidence it is possible to oracle Radio and didn't want to Oracle CS nor Education. Almost bulbing Education with Great Scientist (Bulbing is strong at smaller maps) and teching myself CS is better. 8 turns for CS and 1800 BC isn't bad at all.

Spoiler :

I revolted the next turn because I had to wait another turn after earlier civic change.

Note still only have three cities. I focus on teching. Later the next city for the Oxford University, which was built near the end just for accelerating the Mass Media self-teching. Why self-teching. You'll see why bringing Hatty is bad and not putting hammers into Oracle early can be treacherous sometimes.

1640 BC :

In Washington, my strongest city food-wise with only two corns, I avoided augmenting my population and put my city in starving situation so as to hire more scientists than the actual population can bear. I did it to match with Paper discovery. Next turn, Education bulbing. Dramatically better than my first attempt where I Oracled Education at 1000 BC.

Spoiler :

1520 BC :
My fourth settler ,gathered only from chops at Delhi to avoid any hammer put in anything than wealth, founded my fourth city with two correct food source and hammer-wise tiles.

Spoiler :

Few forests, but I where to find better land.

Spoiler :

My three other cities development:

Capital London:
After chopped an aqueduc in one turn, I began chopped the Hanging Garden. This is an autosave screenshot; in my game I barely put hammers at anything except wealth.
I chopped diagonally to maximize forest re-growth. It was time to accelerate the Great Engineer spawning as I refuse to screw my game by hiring a scientist.

Spoiler :

Washington:
Letting the city grows for hiring more than four scientists later.

Spoiler :

Delhi:
Unfortunately for that city, three scientists till the end.

Spoiler :

1360 BC:
Hanging Gardens built. Going for Astronomy.

Spoiler :

1240 BC :
Third Scientist born in Delhi. I didn't bulbed anything before access of Astronomy. I prefer let my population increases a bit for a slight (rly slight) better bulbing.

Spoiler :

950 BC:
Fourth scientist born in Washington. Saved it while I self-teched PP. It wasn't pressing because I only had two cottages in my whole empire. Early Mids prooved to be more powerful than early cottages. Nonetheless, if it is possible to lay down a few ones before 3000 BC, then it nice. It happened to me once when I had grassland gems.

Spoiler :

925 BC: Hatty stole me the Oracle. Damn . She did respectable dates for wonders in that game: SH in 1440 BC. When seeing SH built message pop-up, I felt a bit less nervous losing the Oracle knowing Mansa still didn't hooked up his marble site and Hatty not having marble. Of course, I should've put somebody else less attracted to wonders, but this OrgRel diplomatic bonus eases the job. Plus her Monotheism obsession. The attempt where I oracled Radio, Hatty was dead, dramatic difference.
Furthermore, putting hammers in a wonder early dissuades the AI to begin it, supposedly. I was too much self-assertive because of my last attempt.

I'm going for the Music route for the Great Artist. Not for bulbing but for a golden age that'll let me save some turns to go for Pacifism. I remained in OrgRel to accelerate the wonders, which puts great engineer points into bank for its purity. Especially the Hagia Sophia because I didn't have marble.

Spoiler :

850 BC:
Hagia Sophia. Enfin, the 100% great engineer was the next great people. Finishing my last wonder, the next turn, I automatically change for Pacificism for getting the last great scientists fast. The Oxford University is still not build, but if the Oracle were still around, the nexts techs needed only bulbing, that's it combined with Oracling Radio and Mass Media as free tech from Liberalism.

Spoiler :

725 BC:

After finishing PP at 750 BC, I obtained a small gift from an event for Astronomy: Patron of Knowledge event. I bulbed Astronomy with one of my great scientists. The fourth was for SM. No, it's not Sadomasochism time.

Spoiler :

The next turn (700 BC), my Great Engineer was arrived.

650 BC:

SM. Next I had to tech a bit of physics and Liberalism to the last turn when waiting for my next great scientist. I delayed Washington Great Scientist to let Delhi its chance knowing three scientists was the max hiring compared to 5 and more for Washington. Won't do the same mistake as AZ in his Cho-ko-nu rush.

Spoiler :

450-375 BC:
Delhi first for the Great Scientist, then Washington with 6 scientists and 7 for a short time.

Spoiler :

300 BC :

Double bulb Electricity and some self-tech. One Great Scientist from Physics, the other from Washington. Note the actual great people bar behind the tech screen. True, I'm trying to get another Great Engineer if I lacks forests. If I recall, one Great Engineer only provides 640 for the United Nations. Without the Oxford, I had enough forests. Unfortunately, I was one turn short for the United Nations.

Spoiler :

275 BC : Radio from Liberalism. Oxford chopped for reducing the time to self-tech Mass Media. 12 to 7 turns with some adjustments via gold from Mansa and Hatty, Wealth and Science production, including some added scientists.
During that seven turns I gathered all my 4 workers to chop more forests and let it accumulate during wealth/science from hammers period.

Spoiler :

200 BC: I got lucky; another Great Engineer at a prob. of 54 %. It permitted me to save one turn for the United Nations. The accumulated hammers from chops were redirected to a wonder (Shwedagon Paya) for score sake. Better be cautious with AAA around.

Spoiler :

100 BC: Mass Media. Nothing much to say.

Spoiler :

75 AD: See how RNG Gods were favorable...

Spoiler :

Nonetheless, with free religion (no religion then), I easily made the joy of Mansa.
In the end, Mansa was friendly at +16 points.

100 AD : DV.

Spoiler :

Conclusions:

*On cold climate inland sea with max AI's, two workers or more are better than settlers because it is easy to capture two cities.

*Cottages aren't necessary as I managed to sustain myself in science thanks to early Mids. Thus early Mids are the key.

*Beeline Alpha and let the AI tech other worker techs and early religious techs.
(Credit to Cabert)

*Beeline Currency for total control of economy. Then, instead putting hammers in science, put it in wealth for a continual 100 % science slider.

How to progress:

- Better secundary cities. At least my captured cities were choked with forests.
- More popped workers to avoid building some and stunt in the process growth.
- Access of Marble
- Earlier Oxford and Pacifism.
- Popped a settler or a strong tech like currency.
- Oracled Radio, which would save me 7 turns for Mass Media and the forests used for the Oxford would make the second Great Engineer.
- Great Library aren't necessary at all and even a waste of hammers. Same for Parthenon and National Epic without Marble.

Hope this write-up will be useful for players hidden in the shadow...
Late but can be useful for later gauntlets.

 

[Sun Tzu Wu]

Regarding the tech trades, I forgot to put attention to one detail I've recently met:

...

Hope this write-up will be useful for players hidden in the shadow...
Late but can be useful for later gauntlets.

Wonderful Ending to a Great Gauntlet Story!

Filled with Excellent Strategy and Tactics for other Players to Follow!

Very good use of Pictures too.

Congratulations Tachywaxon on a Story Extremely Well Said.

Sun Tzu Wu

 

[Manco Capac]

Wonderful Ending to a Great Gauntlet Story!

Filled with Excellent Strategy and Tactics for other Players to Follow!

Very good use of Pictures too.

Congratulations Tachywaxon on a Story Extremely Well Said.

Sun Tzu Wu

Thank you Sun Tzu. It's nice you encourage me so much.
About Monotheism and Monarchy note, is it true what I said?

Just noticed the increasing number of views, an ~ two additional hundreds, who are looking dead gauntlets that much.

 

[Sun Tzu Wu]

Thank you Sun Tzu. It's nice you encourage me so much.

You are welcome. I like your enthusiasm for playing the game. Also, you have shown that you understand the game quite well and can apply that understanding effectively playing the game and convey it clearly to anyone willing to read this thread. You willing to share your ideas and willing to discuss them with people not even playing the gauntlet (like myself) and maybe learning something in the process. I hope you continue to play gauntlets and participate in the gauntlet threads in this fashion well into the future.

About Monotheism and Monarchy note, is it true what I said?

Yes, as well as all worker Technologies. Alphabet is also another notable technology that nearly all AI Leaders will trade immediately, even if they are the only Civ that has it.

Just noticed the increasing number of views, an ~ two additional hundreds, who are looking dead gauntlets that much.

Perhaps, you and the other players have fans? (I might even be one of them.) Or perhaps, more players are reading the gauntlet threads because they are learning something from them? (Probably more likely this for most readers of this thread.)

Sun Tzu Wu