Geography and History in US school curriculum

[Xanikk999]

It was in 1992.

No there was one more recently and lots of people died actually. It might of been 2005 or 2004 actually.

 

[ChrTh]

It was in 1992.

That explains it; it was before Bush was Governor. I'm sure they're all a lot smarter now.


[Wait, is he serious? Joking? Sarcastic? Who knows!]

 

[Masquerouge]

No there was one more recently and lots of people died actually. It might of been 2005 or 2004 actually.

No, I was in Texas in 1992 sorry about the confusion.

 

[Sidhe]

I havent left out the historical development of western universities since i havent mention them,i was only merely stating that most of the english speaking universities of today is the sole responsible reason of many brain-drain in all of the non-english countries and most of them find more opportunities in American corporations since they have the habit of hiring people who have receive not only english training but have gone to the universities that specialize in esoteric leadership skills.I am speaking the new age elites that have no concept of national boundaries.

China,Israel,Russia and others are the competitions,the last time i'd checked at this present time,most english speaking universities are winning.

In that case I laud your comments and will give you a big

Sorry for my misunderstanding

 

[Irish Caesar]

way to miss the point, who cares about one country of 192, really? One history is as relevant to education as one religion or one nation. The worlds a big place and knowledge of it is better than insular thought.

Way to like the look of your own words!

I made two points. One was that my public school history education was excellent. The other was that I could take on anyone in American History.

Does this imply that I don't know a thing about the rest of the world? I don't think so. As you've been around this board for a while and have no doubt read some of my posts (I hope), does it look like I know nothing about the rest of the world?

 

[Sidhe]

True not at all, but in general it was very negative and you didn't explain yourself at all well. So let's at least get some perspective

 

[willemvanoranje]

"The European Union endorses the euro as the common currency for its members"
Who are the 9% of French students and 7% of German students who got this wrong (link)?!?

Probably idiots, retards and people who did not understand the question.

Anyway, it is amazing how so many things that are considered general knowledge in most of Europe (such as countries and their capitals, religion, basic culture, region, etc.) are considered to be "extra" knowledge in for example the USA.

As to universities.. without a doubt all the Anglo-Saxon countries have many of the greatest and finest universities in the world.. they too have many of the shittiest around though. The differences are bigger. I wouldn't trade a random university in Europe for a random one in the USA.. the chances are too small I'd actually get to go to something of a Yale/Princeton/Harvard/etc. standard.

From my personal US high school experience, I can tell you that the average US teenager knows jackshit about world history and geography.
People asked me if France was in Africa. People told me that Paris was a country by itself. I was the first student that my teacher gave a perfect 100 to on a US history test, and I had been in the States for 3 months.
We had one American exchange student coming here. We went with him to a small village, Clairvaux, that has a nice abbey. He told his parents on the phone he had been to Paris.

Of course that's just my personal experience, and of course a lot of Americans would kick my butt at world geography and history, but on the whole I think Us teenagers do poorly on these subjects. Maybe because they are electives...

Some of my experiences:
"Isn't Buenos Aires the capital of Brazil?"
"Wow, how do you deal with all the monkies on the streets?" (about life in Brazil)
"The Netherlands... isn't that in Europe?"
"So if the Netherlands is there, then where is Holland?"
"Is it German or English that they speak in your country?"

You might want to start by having facts straight.
This has the results of a survey of students before the Iraq war started; I'd be interested in a followup to see what the numbers are. However, only 11% of the students couldn't find the US, a lot less than "Many" as you believe (while it is conceivable that older Americans are less likely to know, I somehow doubt it).

Every single country scored better on question 1: "the population of the USA" than the USA itself. Unbelievable.

I think the results on the question of the largest religion are somewhat biased.. only christian countries were asked, and if people don't know very well it's logical they will choose whatever they know. It's funny that, basically, how better I see consider the general knowledge of a country, the less they answered this question correct. I had it wrong too..

Amazing that the USA scores the lowers on question 3: "The Al Quaida and Taliban were both based in what country?".. especially since the USA was the main attacker.

Also anyone having question 4 (what organisation uses the euro?) wrong is just a plain idiot...

And that goes for question 5 too I think (what is the main region to export oil?)

Question 6 is already a bit harder. Which countries fight over Kashmir. Anyone who has followed the news in the past few years should know.. but still a lot forget/have forgotten.

Same goes for question 7, which might cause some confusion because it is a little vague. Most people should've heard of El Niño though...

Question 8, about what continent has most AIDS infections.. shouldn't be too hard. The Japanese and Mexicans score low on this because their own regions (Asia and Latin-America) have a lot of trouble with AIDS as well.

Question 9: awfully low scores in almost all countries.. what countries have a population of more than one billion people? it's so easy...

Question 10: they must've asked mainly women to read a map in mexico.. 29% doesn't find the most western city on the map.

Question 11: 21% of the English mistaked Colombia, Canada or China for the USA in this question (or they answered 'don't know')

Question 12: ..although I must say I'm very surprised that 38% of the americans couldnt find russia, the biggest enemy of the 20th century.

Question 13: 2% of the Japanese couldn't find their own country. In the Anglo-Saxon countries not more than 46% found the right piece of land. In all other countries (except mexico) this is at least 30% higher.

Question 14: Japanese and Britts have no idea where mexico is..

Question 15: The USA is the only one to score abysmal on the location of Italy. Even Mexico had 20% higher scores!

Question 16: It shouldn't be that hard to find Sweden!

Question 17: ..or the pacific ocean (Swedes???)

Question 18: Afghanistan.. now it gets more complicated.. but wasn't that country a lot in the news??

Question 19: nobody outside of europe seems to care where Israel is..

Question 20: only europeans and mexicans know argentina?

From the results:

Others outside the U.S., most notably young adults in Mexico, also struggled with basic geography facts. Young people in Canada and Great Britain fared almost as poorly as those in the U.S.

Glory, glory to the Anglo-Saxon educational system!

And Mexico is a developping country, so...

 

[ChrTh]

I'm curious about "local" versus "world" focus in the rest of the world.

In the US, we spend tons of times on American History; typically 1 year (or semester, depending on how many years are in the curriculum) each from pre- and post- Civil War. An equal amount is spent on the world. So we spend the same amount of time covering 300 years just in the US that we spend covering 5500 years in the rest of the world.

In terms of geography we have a huge burden compared to most countries (excepting Russia, maybe China and India) because our country encompasses so much diversity both naturally (two major mountain chains, several distinct climate zones) and artificially (50 states, numerous large major cities) ... which isn't an excuse, just an explanation. As a result, though, more time is spent on our national geography than world geography. Curious if it's the same elsewhere?

How does it work in the Europe, for example? What's the typical time spent teaching national history versus world history? Or is it subsetted so that European history is taught separate from world history?

EDIT: I'm referring up to the Secondary level; at the college/university level, the amount of history/geography you study is student's choice.

 

[willemvanoranje]

here we get very little dutch history.. we barely get taught anything on our independence war, a little about the revolution in 1795 (which is obviously combined with the french revolution and napoleonic era) and some about post-WWII. Basically we get almost everything in a world- or at least european-perspective.

Of course most of it is European-history actually, but most of the world only has a European history (left). The "other histories" were destroyed.. so yes, we do learn about extinct cultures in america for example, but it is nothing compared to western history. Other than that we had some chapters about China and Japan (together one semester I think).. other than that it's western history.

 

[Irish Caesar]

I thought that 20-question test was a bit too easy...but then, it would be hard to do not-multiple choice on the internet, what with spelling and stuff.

 

[zjl56]

Don't know what if this means much but it shows something about what our education system focuses on.
I showed a small number of people a picture of Stalin, and asked who it was in the picture. No one answered correctly. First answer some used-I don't know. Second answer some used-Hitler.

 

[Atlas14]

Im a strong supporter of more emphasis needed to be placed on history and geography. Even some of the kids in my AP Modern European History class, the supposed "cream of the crop" of our school's "intellectuals" couldn't tell you the historical background of the Persian Gulf War, any Arab-Israeli conflicts, or any battles Napoleon fought. Now is the last one important? Maybe not, but I believe that kids who pay attention to details in history will gain a greater knowledge of the true story, not the biased-overtold textbook stories we are all bored of hearing time and time again. Geography and History helps kids in their world perspectives, especially in times of war like we're in now. Though science and math are far more important, kids should largely be taking it upon themselves to become learned in history and geography.

 

[kingjoshi]

I remember conversations where it became apparent that people thought Chicago was a state. In everyday life, it just doesn't register to people.

Growing up in Columbus:
6th grade: we had a general social studies course
7th: Ohio history
8th: US history
9th: half World Geography/studying for Ohio standards tests
10th: can't remember...
11th: US history
12th: Democracy/Citizenship

World geography got little to attention. The 6th grade and part of 9th is total time in my public schooling is where I had the chance to learn about world religions, cultures, etc. Needless to say, those that weren't interested learn very little.

And even after the years of education I received on the topic, I know/remember very little. I don't remember all the president's names like I used to, much less remember what each did. The school system and tests they administer doesn't encourage utilization of knowledge or long-term memorization.

In math, you can't but build upon that knowledge one course after another. In these topics, you memorize, regurgitate and forget. And the US is not the only country afflicted by this system. It just so happens that the nations in Europe are smaller and are more directly affected by other nations (heck, there is an EU). It just so happens that people are much more likely to meet people of other nationalities or travel abroad, whereas I had friends in college that have never left their state!

Don't know what if this means much but it shows something about what our education system focuses on.
I showed a small number of people a picture of Stalin, and asked who it was in the picture. No one answered correctly. First answer some used-I don't know. Second answer some used-Hitler.

Is a face of a man really important? I have no idea what Socrates looked like, or know even if the books attributed to him are mostly Plato's works. But that seems pretty inconsequential compared to the idea's he's credited for bring out, for the ideas he stood for, etc.

 

[I am the Future]

I agree with you 100%.
At my school freshmen can't even take a history course.

 

[willemvanoranje]

Is a face of a man really important? I have no idea what Socrates looked like, or know even if the books attributed to him are mostly Plato's works. But that seems pretty inconsequential compared to the idea's he's credited for bring out, for the ideas he stood for, etc.

Not very important indeed.. although it's almost impossible to not know the face if you've studied the second world war and the cold war period..

 

[JtheJackal]

New report timed to Civilization Fanatics thread:

Study: Geography Greek to young Americans

Thirty-three percent of respondents couldn't pinpoint Louisiana on a map.

Fewer than three in 10 think it important to know the locations of countries in the news and just 14 percent believe speaking another language is a necessary skill.

Two-thirds didn't know that the earthquake that killed 70,000 people in October 2005 occurred in Pakistan.

Six in 10 could not find Iraq on a map of the Middle East.

Forty-seven percent could not find the Indian subcontinent on a map of Asia.

Seven-five percent were unable to locate Israel on a map of the Middle East.

Nearly three-quarters incorrectly named English as the most widely spoken native language.

Six in 10 did not know the border between North and South Korea is the most heavily fortified in the world.

Thirty percent thought the most heavily fortified border was between the United States and Mexico.

When it comes to teaching geography going from nothing to something would be a large improvement.

 

[Desmond Hawkins]

Yeah, knowing the capital of Slovenia (Ljubliana or some variant on spelling) is surprisingly useless in the grand scheme of things.

Actually I knew that exact fact.

I had a Slovenian driving instructor, and I asked, "so are you from Ljubljana?"

He was so happily shocked with my knowledge of his homeland that the rest of the lessons were very pleasant, and we spent most of the time talking about Europe and the way it differs from Canada/US.

 

[MobBoss]

The reason our kids suck at geography is because of geography teachers like this guy: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jay_Bennish

When teachers use their classroom as a bully pulpit to advance their poltical views, everyone loses.

 

[CartesianFart]

The reason our kids suck at geography is because of geography teachers like this guy: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jay_Bennish

When teachers use their classroom as a bully pulpit to advance their poltical views, everyone loses.

I've read it,and that person should be revoked of his teaching license.Politics in the classroom is dangerous especially an individual using absurd analogy of Hitler.

 

[Desmond Hawkins]

When teachers use their classroom as a bully pulpit to advance their poltical views, everyone loses.

Congratulations, you have clearly found an accurate cross-section of the American geography teachers.

And good point about not advancing political views. I expect you would object to any teacher that says America is the greatest country in the world as well.