German unique ability is overpowered and crazy

[H4run]

Ottomans UA is probably the worst in the game, but it's not actually entirely useless. In fact, it can be incredibly helpful. I often see a pirate boat starting out, usually several. If you get one, then you can sail it around the map and meet everyone. It's a huge advantage if you get one. And you dont even have to destroy the ship to get it. Just get next to it and bang 50% chance its yours. IMO, ottomans have easilly the best UUs outside of greeces riders of doom.

im agree with u in the part "probably the worst in the game" because there are any other candidate nation that compete with them. In that statement i notice that u do sense the lame aura or atmosphere of lame inside it, we dont have to argue because we know and already agree about it, they ability just dont help preety much.

But my main concern it just not that, it just a perk, but an explanation behind why that perk is apply to nation, if it related to nation then it must be have historical explanation.

But what is the base so they put the unique ability in Ottoman recruiting barbarian naval unit? or German also recruit barbarian in their camp, as Bismack? they have civilopedia this show us that this game have explanation on each unit history so do they perk and unique have it explanation, so we can demand the same thing on this

what is the base that they use to add recruting barbarian as german ability as nation? Which German leader are barbarian recruiter? when the event happend?

Please teach me history, maybe there are thing that i miss. But even that kind of event do exist, that cant be a unique abbility since many of nation recruting slave, outlaw, prisooner to aid them at war.

Why they dont sense German are strong in culture and literature, name it, Goethe, Bach, Nietzsche, Schopenhour, Marx, Hegel, Kant are all from German, why dont they add something like "+10% great person on german" that have a logical explanation.

the Caliph of Harun Al Rasyid. Why set trade +1 trade route? he is not focusing his goverment on trade, while he being famous for his appreciation toward litterature and philosphy at his time, and the emerging of science are so great that even all the europe scholar are studying at damascus and cairo, to study philosphy, science, math, and other discourse. Why not set 20 percent advantage on building library on university, it have more logical explantion.

Ottoman or Utsmani being strong for keeping foe and people loyal to them as it mention in Machiavelli "THe Prince". He said, there are no need to build castle, Utsmani not build any of them, but they maintain the happiness and wealthiness of their people, and not executing noble from their rule. Why dont make them a half cut on unhappiness in occpied city?

If they set and place thing, in a right place, both in fact and logical and have a responsible explanation behind that. There are no complain in this forum. Im just wonder is it because the Arian are start as a Vandal, that wonder as nomadic to one nation to the other that is why they related it to recruiting barbarian. But its still seem not important and a bit lame for a explanation.

It maybe not important to other, but it do important for me.

 

[Lyoncet]

this is so unreal, so game, this ability has been set as german unique ability as it not really being a fundament on German civilization, they ability to convert barbarian what a lol.

Yeah, because Americans have 40/20 vision, oil deposits double in size when tapped by OPEC, and every time the Aztecs killed a captive they got closer to unlocking Communism.

Of course it's not a simulation of a real-life trait; it's a game-appropriate facsimile of something the civ was known for, just like every other UA. Don't see what the problem is.

[edit in response to previous post]
UUs, UAs, and UBs are not specific to a leader. They are specific to the civilization they represent, hence trade boosts for Harun, great scientists for Nebuchadnezzar, Ancien Regime for Napoleon, Mainfest Destiny for Washington, etc. Even some of the names don't match the leader they're associated with, like Sun Never Sets, which referred to the fact that it was always sunny somewhere in the British Empire, which wasn't true during Elizabeth's reign. In fact, it had hardly been an empire for more than a few generations at that point. I agree that they could have gone with some sort of non-military benefit for Germany, especially an industrial or economic boost, but I also see no compelling reason not to have selected Furor Teutonicus.

 

[H4run]

every time the Aztecs killed a captive they got closer to unlocking Communism.

cant help myself laughing when reading this line, ya we know there are human sacrifies in aztec culture, but thats not really what make them unique, it happend in many other tribalic culture. As for me thing that make them unique are their bit pharaoh type of culture (including the pyramid stuff) and their richness of Gold, which is the reason why they being rob by the conquistador. And monty is not really that hostile and unwelcome toward foreigner, he wellcome the spanish, give them present, make them important among their people and treat them well as honorable guest. Not until the spain found out the tons of gold then take Monty as prisoner to press the aztec giving up their hold. While we know he sail up to aztec with stolen ship, to seek wealth and fortune from robbing the new wolrd.

That sacrifies plus culture thing, is not come-up from realistic idea, it just a pick-up from one of the scenario in BTS.

This is the reason civ4 better, there is one time that i get really screw up seeing the strenght base on praetorian are as the same as Maceman : 8. then i open-up the civilopedia and it being explain to me that praetorian are being use by the roman and sill effective in battle until medieval era. And this, what i really want to be appear in civilization.

I hope you understand what i mean Lyon

 

[vendur]

But what is the base so they put the unique ability in Ottoman recruiting barbarian naval unit? or German also recruit barbarian in their camp, as Bismack? they have civilopedia this show us that this game have explanation on each unit history so do they perk and unique have it explanation, so we can demand the same thing on this

You might want to search google for the name "arminius" or "herman the german", as far as the ottomans, you could search for the barbary pirates.

I don't mind the german ability much as far as being historical, but it's a little ridiculous when they do the intro to talk about Germany beng an "upstart" civilization, only to drag out a roman cliche for an ability. Pick one or the other: ancient or new, and stick with it.

 

[EverNoob]

Historically speaking germany's UA is fine. Sure they could've picked other parts of german history, but maybe in a future expansion we'll see another non-warlike german leader. It's just for game purposes.

I have to agree that germany's UA is weak. But that's to balance germany's awesome Landsknecht. It's as strong as a swordsman, yet cheaper, counters mounted units and doesn't require strategic resources!!

Most games I destroy on average 4 encampments, which nets me on average 2 brutes and 50 gold extra. Obviously it's not much, but it serves as an early boost for germany's real early game goal: Landsknechts

 

[vendur]

Historically speaking germany's UA is fine. Sure they could've picked other parts of german history, but maybe in a future expansion we'll see another non-warlike german leader. It's just for game purposes.

I have to agree that germany's UA is weak. But that's to balance germany's awesome Landsknecht. It's as strong as a swordsman, yet cheaper, counters mounted units and doesn't require strategic resources!!

Most games I destroy on average 4 encampments, which nets me on average 2 brutes and 50 gold extra. Obviously it's not much, but it serves as an early boost for germany's real early game goal: Landsknechts

They are nice if you rush CS, but they quickly become useless. You can't upgrade them until rifleman. And the computer doesnt seem to use horsman much at all from what I've seen. If they actually did, it would be a much better unit. I've played a dozen diety/immortal games, and other than horse arches I've rarely seen a mounted units at all. It's weird. Surprised no one has mentioned it actually.

 

[H4run]

You might want to search google for the name "arminius" or "herman the german", as far as the ottomans, you could search for the barbary pirates.

I don't mind the german ability much as far as being historical, but it's a little ridiculous when they do the intro to talk about Germany beng an "upstart" civilization, only to drag out a roman cliche for an ability. Pick one or the other: ancient or new, and stick with it.

that bold thing is what i really meant. I mean if i want to play a fiction game i go play poypoy or moymoy or some-other cute name. Or if i want to play tale, legend, i go play neverwinter, dragon age, but this is civilization.

Hey Vendur, thanks for the info, i will check it after this.

 

[Cyberian]

that bold thing is what i really meant. I mean if i want to play a fiction game i go play poypoy or moymoy or some-other cute name. Or if i want to play tale, legend, i go play neverwinter, dragon age, but this is civilization.

Hey Vendur, thanks for the info, i will check it after this.

You could argue that the german UA actually represents the conquests of knightly orders like the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teutonic_Knights in "non-christian barbarian lands" on the eastern borders of the holy roman empire.

But then they should have named the germans Holy Roman Empire right away (which makes sense with a unit like Landsknechts).

 

[H4run]

You could argue that the german UA actually represents the conquests of knightly orders like the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teutonic_Knights in "non-christian barbarian lands" on the eastern borders of the holy roman empire.

But then they should have named the germans Holy Roman Empire right away (which makes sense with a unit like Landsknechts).

I dont know if the Teutonic order/guild settle a mission for recruiting the non-christian barbar in the east. Im only know, they form this knighthood thing for an exclusive group that have a mission to help pilgrim, aiding crusade and volunteering charity act.

But please i like to hear if i do miss something about the Teuton, because im not a german myself i do have limitation on that knowledge.

 

[Cyberian]

I dont know if the Teutonic order/guild settle a mission for recruiting the non-christian barbar in the east. Im only know, they form this knighthood thing for an exclusive group that have a mission to help pilgrim, aiding crusade and volunteering charity act.

But please i like to hear if i do miss something about the Teuton, because im not a german myself i do have limitation on that knowledge.

They had extensive possessions in eastern Europe and played a big part in Christianization (usually by sword) of several Baltic tribes (for example the Prußen http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Prussians)) in what would later become Eastern Prussia (now part of Poland/Russia).
They also did some bloodshed in the name of Christ in todays Lithuania, Estonia and this region.

 

[H4run]

They had extensive possessions in eastern Europe and played a big part in Christianization (usually by sword) of several Baltic tribes (for example the Prußen http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Prussians)) in what would later become Eastern Prussia (now part of Poland/Russia).
They also did some bloodshed in the name of Christ in todays Lithuania, Estonia and this region.

indeed its related then, at first i think Mongol is more fit for having recruiting barbarian from camp ability since Genghis Khan himself gain his power over uniting divided mongolian tribe (still it looks a bit strange to play as Genghis Khan who over and over uniting barbaric enchampent through continent and far beyond it until future era). But with this explanation recruiting barbarian through sword and spreading of gospel it can logicaly implemented.

Thank you for the explanation Cyberian. I found it helpful

 

[Lyoncet]

cant help myself laughing when reading this line,

Yeah, I was just ribbing you.

 

[Gaizokubanou]

every time the Aztecs killed a captive they got closer to unlocking Communism.

Or maybe Aztecs human sacrifice is the true origin of the Soviet Gulag/prison camps!

 

[SuperSmurf]

but honestly, where's the challenge in Marathon? I challenge you to do the same in standard pace and watch as the Deity AI settle and expand like a maniac,

I setup game conditions in my favor and won. News at 11! (not like winning is a stretch anyways but, yeah)

Where have you guys been when people were winning their Deity games in Civ 4 thanks to cross trading cheese ?

 

[stii]

It's worth trying especially if you get marble and/or pop growth from a hut.

Err marble doesn't help you in the slightest. To use it you need to research mining and masonry and build on the marble. That takes longer than building stonehenge assuming you go straight to calendar. Stuff like this makes me wonder if you have ever tried it


You can get it about 50/50 on deity straifght rushing for it the AI builds on average 2600BC which is about when you get there too. A pop hut, a chop, lots of good resources each cut a few turns off this but oyu will rarely get all of them and sometimes the AI will build it before you are even close.

 

[Uranus Reamerz]

Playing games could be considered a dumb Idea ... so the Germans UA may too be considered a dumb Idea ... well by some whos opinions overwhelm theyre Brains.
The German Special ability works just fine. What makes a game early is the huts and what you get out of them. 30 cult, 1 pop and wep upgrade gtg. Barbs spawn and respawn as long as ther is uncontrolled areas. As a german I try and leave a "Barb Rez" so I can harvest gold and units into the mid game. Build an archy a scout and your original warrior you should be able to pop 'em and as the eras progress you will get better units ... not to speak of the experience enhancement your units recieve before your first civ v civ war

 

[Zenstrive]

Pretty soon the whole map is empty except for barb camps, puppet caps, city states and you.

I often do this, but with Arab and on King. Feels so empty. I end up park my camel archers outside of barb camps to harvest experience points

 

[Lyoncet]

Err marble doesn't help you in the slightest. To use it you need to research mining and masonry and build on the marble. That takes longer than building stonehenge assuming you go straight to calendar. Stuff like this makes me wonder if you have ever tried it

Unless you have an unusually high-hammer start, you should never have any trouble gunning straight for calendar, starting Stonehenge, then getting mining/masonry and setting up the quarry. Depending on speed and variables like starting area yields, it's feasible to knock off 3-4 turns by hooking up the marble before 'Henge completes.

Makes me wonder if you've ever tried it.

 

[JudgeDeath]

So, you think it makes sence to use "bypassing tactics" to overcome a tactic, a tactic that's possible thanks to the great gamedevelopers ?

The game is flawed, in many wayes. Instead of crippleing my homosapiens gifted creative power, my brain: i choose to not play this game at all. Give us a game that truly challenge us, instead of a "bag of tricks" which, if you look from a distance to it, is one big joke.

owwait. I confess. I will stay playing it. But just for fun, not for the win. There's simply no challenge in winning for me, the battle AI sucks and alot of other things suck, things you see discussed all over the place here. So i take it as it comes , with all the flaws. And i use anything to my liking, if the game allows it. Not my fault that they "made it possible" that way. Game Over.

This is completely off topic. Please get back in your box.

 

[Ahriman]

I agree with Celevin in general on the germans. The ability is too much of a crapshoot. Either there are lots of camps, and I swarm other civs early, which is effective but isn't particularly fun or satisfying, or there aren't, and I'm playing a dud civ.

Landsknechts also aren't really that fun, since on lower difficulty levels combat is far too easy, and on Immortal and Deity its about unit preservation and getting 4:1 or better kill ratios. A slightly cheaper unit doesn't help much here.

Its not just about strength, its about fun to play.

I find Germans, Ottomans, Aztecs and Americans very dull to play, whereas everyone else their ability influences playstyle in an interesting way. [Egyptians not so much either, since I tend no to go for wonders early game, and I don't like war chariots.]