GOTM23 Succession Game [civ3]

[smackster]

My logic for attacking Spain is that we might actually get Carthage to actively engage them, whereas France maybe too far. Not sure that we should worry about their past alliance breaking, this could just be the RNG, which might not do the same this time.

 

[AlanH]

My thoughts were to plan what we do after we have dealt with Rome. I agree we can't open up a new front until Rome is reduced to nothing or a shadow of its current self. Since Carthage seem to be spoiling for a fight, and they are between us and the Great Library in Thebes, one option seemed to be to repeat a western mirror image of our Ottomans/Rome campaign.

Getting some civs into an alliance against France sounds a good idea in any case, to slow them down a bit. We might even make peace with the Zulus in exchange for their assistance there.

 

[Alweth]

I won't be able to play this weekend, starting Friday, since I'm going on a camping trip. If Karasu has his game finished by his evening, I'll try and play my turn then, but otherwise you'll have to cycle me to the back of the queue and I'll play on Monday.

 

[AlanH]

OK Alweth. Let's see if karasu gives you time to play your sequence before the weekend. If not Smackster and I will play, and then we'll wait for MacBaldrick to pick up after his weekend of running and beer.

 

[smackster]

Karasu, where are you,
Are you gonna play your turn,
Karasu, where are you,
We wanna see Rome burn.

 

[Alweth]

Well, it's too late for me to play now, but that's okay. You guys go on without me and I'll be ready to play on Monday. Maybe Karasu can even play another turn.

 

[Karasu]

Originally posted by smackster
Karasu, where are you,
Are you gonna play your turn,
Karasu, where are you,
We wanna see Rome burn.

Sorry, folks. Life is starting to get busy to a point that borders the ridiculous... About time for a well-placed holiday, I'd say.

And turns are starting to get a bit longer. Anyway, here we go.



Pre-turn
Madinah set to Forbidden Palace. Basra will starve to pop 2, though. Workers will be sent to irrigate the area.

Hurried Spearman in Basra
Hurried Spearman in Snagha
Hurried Spearman in Hispalis
Hurried Spearman in Bursa
Hurried Horseman in Alexmanistan
Switch Fustat to Temple

Declare war on France (we still have a MA with Spain!)
Give Carthage Monarchy for 24 gps and MA against Zulu and France.
Spain pays us 29 gp for a MA against France
At this point, why refuse to give RoP, WM and 37 gp to India for MA against France?

Egypt doesn't want to join the party, however.


Press Enter.


IT - Roman archers attack Hispalis, killing Smackster's Revenge and Elite Horseman... They will be revenged! :vampire:
The French build the Colossus in Lyons
The carthaginian forces around our border leave for other destinations


Turn 1 - 70 AD
Damascus: horseman - horseman
Jeddah: horseman - horseman
Hispalis: spearman - spearman
Basra: Spearman - spearman
Bursa: Spearman - spearman
Alexmanistan: horseman - barracks
Snagha: spearman - temple

Hurried Spearman in Byzantium
Hurried Spearman in Lutetia

Uthman is resting in Samarra

Five roman archers outside Hispalis. Our defense outnumbered, I withdraw the offensive units from the city to try to recapture it in the next turns.
I just leave the Spearman hoping he can kill at least a couple attackers.


IT - Hispalis falls, two archers killed by our Spearman.


Turn 2 - 90 AD
Diryiah: worker - spearman (to let it grow and use some MP in Madinah)
Lutetia: spearman - temple
Byzantium: spearman - temple

Alawetha founded: Temple

Brundisium captured without losses. Spearman
Units around Hispalis retreat on mountain to heal.

Hurried Spearman in Sirplebidah


IT - Loose wandering Swordsman to Ottoman Archer
Egypt found Avaris just south of Sirplebidah. Will need to move the settler somewhere else.


Turn 3 - 110 AD
Dhahran: horseman - horseman
Najran: horseman - horseman
Sirplebidah: Spearman - worker

Captured Brundisium: spearman. Promotion to Elite
A regular Swordsman stumbles upon his sword and dies while attacking a redlined Ottoman archer at the door of Iznik. The second Swordie manages to score the kill.

Hurried Barracks in Baghdad


IT - Barb horseman captures lone worker near Snagha
Two roman archers start chasing one arab horseman


Turn 4 - 130 AD
Baghdad: Barracks - horseman
Riyadh: horseman - horseman
Jeddah: spearman - horseman
Samarra: temple - worker

Hurried temple in Iznik


IT - Roman units try to head to Lutetia.


Turn 5 - 150 AD
Sogut: Spearman - settler
Iznik: Temple - settler

Kill roman horseman+archer north of Hispalis; lost a horseman and a swordsman on the archer.
Kill two defending Archer in Hispalis (no losses). The city is destroyed (was at pop 1).

Make peace with Ottomans for MA against Rome. This will divert some of the roman troops, and allow our stack to go for Rome more easily.
I don't feel like detaching our troops to conquer Izmit right now. We will come back on the Ottomans as soon as the romans are done.


IT - Roman galley approaching Khurasan
The Egyptian built the Great Lighthouse in Thebes -Now we will have to wait for Cataphacts for our Golden Age.


Turn 6 - 170 AD
Damascus: horseman - horseman
Khorasan: Spearman - spearman

Switch Sirplebidah to Temple

Monotheism is around. We are getting Engineering in four turns.


Turn 7 - 190 AD
Fewer roman troops around. Our big stack is almost ready.
Kill a roman archer, two horsemen redlined (there must be something between my horsemen and their archers...)


Turn 8 - 210 AD
Makkah: Settler - settler
Diryiah: Spearman - worker
Dhahran: horseman - horseman
Najran: horseman - horseman
Basra: spearman - horseman


IT - France signs peace with Spain and Carthage (India is left). Doesn't look like a game in which the AI care too much about their reputation...


Turn 9 - 230 AD
Baghdad: horseman - horseman
Jeddah: horseman - horseman
Hurried Spearman in Anjar
Hurried Spearman in Bursa


IT - A Persian lone horseman has crossed the entire continent to approach Giza. What is it up to? Barb hunting?


Turn 10 - 250 AD
Anjar: Spearman - temple
Bursa: spearman - spearman
Alexmanistan: barracks - horseman

Engineering!
Trade it to Egypt for Monotheism, WM, 35 gp and 2 gpt, MA against France and Zulu
Sell Engineering to India for Feudalism, WM, 6 gp (all he has) plus Alliance versus Zulu
Sell Engineering to Spain for 4 gp (all he has) and another MA against France (he was close to discovering Engineering anyway)
Carthage agrees to pay us 20 gp for a new alliance against the French

Destroyed Dijon (north of Baghdad). Two horsemen redlined.



Conclusions:
I have left a small number of Swordsmen close to Persia if we feel like blitzing them.

Chivalry is due in 20 turns at 40% science, -2 gpt. A lot of time... But I doubt that switching to Republic now would help (large army).
I think we should keep some research on anyway, as being closer to it will lower the price we have to pay if we end up buying it.

Free-for-all

 

[AlanH]

Good fun! Well done Karasu, nice touch letting the Romans take Hispalis and then retaking.

Got it. I'll play this evening

Roster:

Karasu: As we have three days before MacBaldrick and Alweth are back in the saddle, could you take a sequence after me and Smackster? If Smackster picks it up straight after me you'll have all weekend to fit a set of turn in, but as it's been a hectic week for you, don't kill yourself.

Her's the roster on that basis ...

AlanH (playing)
Smackster (on deck)
Karasu
MacBaldrick
Alweth

 

[Karasu]

If I find the time, I will love to give it another go.
I will try to pop into the forum tomorrow and see how things go.

Of course, I have (involuntarily!) sabotaged Alweth's turn, so I am ready to pay my turns-debt as soon as we have a chance.


We have a better looking stack two-three turns from Rome, which we woul all like to see burn
It grew to size 8, though, so we may take some losses.

After that, it's open to debate. I left it open to attack Persia, as they have not connected to the Iron yet and we may be able to afford a short war with them while the bulk of our forces are busy with the romans.

Sun-Tzu has not been completed yet. My bet is Egypt...

 

[smackster]

I'm still in shock about the loss of Smackster's Revenge.

One word of advise, attack Rome from the south, note the river running through its northern side. Also make sure Madinah completes the FP before rushing the palace in Rome.

 

[Karasu]

Originally posted by smackster
I'm still in shock about the loss of Smackster's Revenge.

He fought bravely, but was overnumbered by the traitorous roman archers.
It is said that he was stabbed in the back, and still managed to take down one more foe before falling.

A statue was erected in his honour by our Arab troops where Hispalis used to be.

And the great Saliddin himself promised to rename our next city after him (Alan? )

 

[AlanH]

I have a high priority interrupt to deal with. The gotm25 file set is out, and I need to build a Mac installer for it. It's slightly more complicated than the previous ones because some sound files have to be copied around. I figure this will take me the rest of today, so I'll probably play my set on Saturday. I hope this is OK with you guys. If I need a break from the installer I might fit my ten in earlier

 

[smackster]

No problem this is meant to be a game for players with less time. I'll spend my evening on the Mongol quick game.

 

[AlanH]

Originally posted by smackster
No problem this is meant to be a game for players with less time. I'll spend my evening on the Mongol quick game.

if I get the installer done I'll be getting a bit of that as well, as it'll be a useful test bed for the installed mod.

 

[Keath]

Hi everyone! This is my first post and I am learning a lot about this fascinating game and this site. I have been following your moves with anticipation and playing the ten moves to compare my results.

My attempts have been pretty novice mode so I hope to follow along and if I can think of anything intelligent to add I will do so.

I am surprised at the huge stack ready to attack Rome. Good stuff, Karusa! How do you do that?

Keath

 

[smackster]

Keath,

Welcome to our little game, glad that you found it interesting, it certainly has been fun for us playing it.

That stack is a good lesson. Try to take Rome from the end of my last turn by just throwing troops at it and you'd probably fail. A large city like Rome (size 8) gets defensive bonuses, and is probably defended by maybe 4-5 spears. The best way to get it is with a big sustained attack all in one turn, with no chance for the defenders to rest. Karasu showed great patience as he only had 10 turns and probably wanted to take it.

Smackster

P.S. What is the breakout of the stack, haven't played it yet to see?

 

[Keath]

Smackster,

Even when I play the game through with Karasu's (apologies for spelling) move list, I don't end up with near the units in that area as there are in that one stack. Patience, I guess is important, and planning.

Thanks,

Keath

 

[smackster]

What is in the stack?

 

[AlanH]

Welcome to CivFanatics, Keath.

We have 16 units assembled on the moutain west of Rome, 10 horses and 6 swords. The build up has no doubt been accelerated by the fact that we now have Engineering, so troop movements have speeded up from the production center round Makkah to the front line. I was finding rivers were impeding movement a lot before. We can now probably get a horseman to the front line in Rome in three moves from completion moving at 6 tiles per turn along the roads.

The key is getting a strong production base in the core cities and then concentrating on building a big enough force to do the primary job in hand immediately rather than by slow attrition. We now have over 20 swords, over 20 horses and over 20 spears in our army, which is a tribute (a) to the focus we have had on military build-up and (b) to careful use of units during attacks and counter-attacks, avoiding heavy losses.

Ten cities each producing a horse every 5 turns gives you two new horses per turn. We are deliberately building a big army of horses, as we shall have Chivalry soon. At that point we shall be able to upgrade our horses to Cataphracts (aka Ansar warriors in PTW), which are able to move nine tiles at a time over roads, and have the attack strength of a swordsman plus the retreat attribute - they will often pull back before they are killed. They should be unstoppable in the hands of our resident warmongers. The only fly in the ointment is that we would need twice as much gold as we have right now to upgrade our current horsemen, and we are currently shrinking our treasury. So I am wondering whether we are wise to push so hard on the research button.

 

[smackster]

I don't think the cash is going to be a problem. Within a couple of turns we will have Rome, the FP in Madinah, rebuilt the palace in Rome, and then if we convert to Republic we'll probably find our cash situation much improved. As we capture the rest of the Roman cities it will only get better. As we will have the Pyramids our growth will allow us to grow to an unbeatable strength. As soon as we attack with the UU then our Golden age should give us a boost that we can start attacking everyone.

I noticed on the Mongal quick game forum one of the PTW SG23 players said they had nearly finished. Not sure what year they are in though.