Hegemon! Of the Classical Greek World! Jul '22

[Rambuchan]

PiotrG - Great screen shots! Thanks a lot. Very interesting.

Did you win your Athens game?

In your Crete game it looks like Sparta have been wiped out....by Elis! Is that right? What happened?

Really good to see you've started a game as Macedon. That is one of my favourite civs to play as. It's a very different experience. Do you have a plan to win it? There was quite a bit of advice which I gave to Keroro - further back in the thread - when he was playing as Macedon.

 

[classical_hero]

I have noticed that with irrigation it basically keeps the same description as the regular, but Electricity will never be discovered in this game, so the third sentence should be removed.

Plant forest seems to be the same also. Just remove "After the discovery of Engineering".. Barricade needs the link to be linking to Standing army instead of Construction.

 

[PiotrG]

I have a question.

What to do next? I do not have a specific idea to continue the game. Any suggestions?

Peonian skrimisher a great robber, inhibiting expansion of the south

 

[Rambuchan]

Classical:

Thanks for spotting those. I think I have already cleaned those up for the little patch but I will double check. Hope you're enjoying the Classical Greek Hero experience!

PiotrG:

My long term advice is:

Go for either a Hegemonic or Domination Victory with Macedon. You must be careful that Athens and Lydia, and maybe Sparta, do not get a Tribute victory first though.

My short term advice is:

(a) Conquer Chalkidike soon. They are easy pickings for you. They have good fertile land, which you can grow a large population on. That population will be good for cash and techs and, later, the population % required for the domination win. Their land will also give you access into the Aegean Sea for taking on Athens and Lydia later in the game. And, as you will soon find out, that land will give you a good buffer against the Thracians. And, believe me, you will need that sooner or later.

(b) Hellenise your army as soon as possible. That means going for techs like Synoikismos and Hard Iron. Once Macedon start getting their Hoplites and Hellenised units they are pretty much invincible on the battlefield.

(c) Play a long term diplomatic game with the barbaroi around you - Illyria, Thrace and Chersonesos. If you can get them to go to war with each other that is the perfect situation. If not, they will overrun your lands and you will be in trouble. You may need to give them some concessions to go to war with each other. But that is better than having to deal with both of them at the same time. They will bring big hordes of warriors against you. Once you have your Hellenised units you will be able to crush them easily. But before you do that you will have to play a shrewd diplomatic game with them.

Remember, I have given strategy advice for every civ on the second page of their Tribe Pedia entry.

Good luck! And keep us updated on your progress.

 

[classical_hero]

Will there be a MP version brought out?

 

[Rambuchan]

Enjoying it that much?

I'm not entirely sure how one makes a scenario MP enabled. My crude understanding is that there is a limit of 8 human players (the rest being AI) and that the map needs to be a certain size. Is that right? What else?

The 8 players bit is easy to do. I reckon the following 8 civs would be the ones to go with:

Athens, Sparta, Macedon, Thebes, Lydia, Illyria, Thrace and then maybe either Corinth, Argos or Thessaly. Any ideas folks?

The map issue however, if true, may be a sticking point. This scenario is very much tied to the map that it comes with. Altering the map for MP would ruin many of the core dynamics of the scenario. Hope I'm wrong on this MP requirement.

 

[classical_hero]

I have a problem with the Trade House. As you can see it is not giving me the happiness bonuses.

Spoiler :

 

[Rambuchan]

Ah, that's because, for some weird reason, the Trade House is missing the "increases luxury trade" flag. I have now checked that flag on the Trade House for the patch. Thanks for picking that up.

 

[classical_hero]

Another problem I have is I have discovered kingship and I can't discuss ROP agreements with anyone. Unless anarchy has something to do with it. It should work since it ticked off, but it isn't working.

 

[Rambuchan]

Either Anarchy, or your lack of embassies.

ROP agreements are properly set for Kingship, so you shouldn't have a problem.

 

[classical_hero]

Normally you don't need embassies, so why is that need for this game?

Attic Swordsman has no description of what it is.

EDIT, there are a lot of pedia entries that are just from the basic game and thus eventually will need to be updated for the game. For example it says that fortresses come with construction when there is no such tech, but instead it is in Masonry.

 

[Rambuchan]

That absent swordsman entry got spotted ages ago and was fixed ages ago.

ROP is a diplomatic agreement. You always needed an embassy with another civ to engage in diplomatic agreements in the vanilla game. It's just a core requirement the game has. This scenario is no different, because it can't be.

Spoiler Diplomatic Agreements Entry from Vanilla Civilopedia :

#GCON_Agreements
Diplomatic Agreements
^
^
^When your civilization builds an $LINK<embassy=GCON_Embassies> in a rival's capital city, or when a rival builds one
in your capital, you can negotiate [Diplomatic Agreements] with that civilization. There are four kinds:
^
^
^{Military Alliance}
^You agree to declare war on a despised third party.
^
^
^{Right of Passage}
^You agree to allow his or her military units to move through your $LINK<territory=GCON_Territory> and use
your transportation network (roads and railroads).
^
^
^{Trade Embargo}
^An agreement that neither of you will $LINK<trade=GCON_Trade> with or [allow] trade with a third party.
^
^
^{Mutual Protection Pact}
^An agreement to declare war upon any civilization that attacks your partner.
^
^
^There is a fifth item that you can trade through your Embassies: {Communications}. These are
introductions to a third civilization you can grant or receive from a rival.

 

[Virote_Considon]

The game can already be played in multiplayer

 

[classical_hero]

I doubt that 31 players would be possible. Getting it down to 8 is much more manageable.

Perhaps I have been playing EFZI:2 too much, where they already have embassies establish.

 

[Cheezy the Wiz]

I downloaded this a few days ago. I have a great game going as Korynthos. Here's a screencap of the present situation, mid-way through the second era:

Spoiler :

As you can see, I have risen to become one of the major powers on the map. I conquered Mycenae early on, and tag-teamed Argos with Sparta, then went on to take down Athens and Euboea. My big rivals are Sparta, for power, and Thevai, for Tribute. Thebes has spread far into northern and central Greece, having put the early-game beat down on Phokaeis and Makedon (though not wiping either out), and filling a vacuum left by the collapsing Aetolian civilization. They are powerful. However, I sent a stack of doom to conquer their central territory. Thebes has three of the twelve temples (Ares, Zeus, and Demeter), so its capitulation will be a serious blow to their future, so long as I can consolidate it by securing the rest of Boeotia. I'm sure a little time will allow me to finish that task, but I greatly fear them bringing Sparta into the war on their side. Such an event would certainly be the end of my game.

I really enjoy how this mod is laid out, from the tiers of civilizations to the uniqueness of each tribe, and the excellently written civilopedia entries.

 

[PiotrG]

Chezy the Wiz on what difficulty level you play?

 

[Cheezy the Wiz]

I normally play on Monarch, but Ram advised lowering the difficulty by one or two points for Corinth, so this game is on Regent.

 

[Rambuchan]

Cheezy - Very fine work there, Strategos. Any idea yet what victory you might go for?

As you plan, I too would be looking to take out Thebes next. It's the obvious option really and capturing those three Great Temple Wonders would be a real asset. Depending on how advanced they are, they may well start building stuff like the Sacred Band or their league assets and then they will be much tougher, though still doable.

Totally agree with you about the threat from Sparta. Every single game I have played of Hegemon, without exception, I just crap my pants at the prospect of war with Sparta. I see them looming with stacks on your borders in the screenie and that's how they run tings. The fear. It's not just the fact their units are so formidable, it's the sheer number of them they amass that makes them so intimidating. That said, I have been engaged in wars with them (as Athens, Thebes, Macedon, Phocis, Aetolia and a few others) and have manage to survive them. In each of those they have always managed to capture at least one city, but I have then managed to turn the tide / block them off / do something to somehow come out from those wars better off. Control of the Isthmus, where you are located, has always been crucial in those conflicts with Sparta. I'd be wary of striking alliances with other southern Greeks against them. Those allies usually get gobbled up. But getting someone like Lydia involved might be beneficial.

 

[Cheezy the Wiz]

Cheezy - Very fine work there, Strategos. Any idea yet what victory you might go for?

I'm actually more concerned with denying other people victory, but I suppose I'm close enough geography-wise to try for Hegemonic (not visible are colonies on Lesbos, Samothrace, Milos, and Zakinthos). I feel like it's in the spirit of the mod to go for that my first time, lol.

As you plan, I too would be looking to take out Thebes next. It's the obvious option really and capturing those three Great Temple Wonders would be a real asset. Depending on how advanced they are, they may well start building stuff like the Sacred Band or their league assets and then they will be much tougher, though still doable.

This was my thinking as well. I would have ideally built up more, but I saw the situation running away from me - they are increasing their tech lead, producing wonders before I even have the techs for them, and getting bigger than me faster than I can grow. It was now, or never.

Totally agree with you about the threat from Sparta. Every single game I have played of Hegemon, without exception, I just crap my pants at the prospect of war with Sparta. I see them looming with stacks on your borders in the screenie and that's how they run tings. The fear. It's not just the fact their units are so formidable, it's the sheer number of them they amass that makes them so intimidating. That said, I have been engaged in wars with them (as Athens, Thebes, Macedon, Phocis, Aetolia and a few others) and have manage to survive them. In each of those they have always managed to capture at least one city, but I have then managed to turn the tide / block them off / do something to somehow come out from those wars better off. Control of the Isthmus, where you are located, has always been crucial in those conflicts with Sparta. I'd be wary of striking alliances with other southern Greeks against them. Those allies usually get gobbled up. But getting someone like Lydia involved might be beneficial.

I fought a very early war, pre-bronze age, with Sparta, and won a handsome war chest and some techs from them. I've gone out of my way to avoid war with them so far, including signing a RoP agreement and signing disadvantageous trade agreements. I hope these combined will keep their hordes away from me.

 

[classical_hero]

A suggestion I have is make the Agora when you get the luxury bonuses and not the Trade House. I think the Trade House is far too early to have this bonus.