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Thunderbrd said:
Wow... Toffer thanks! Have you looked at the naval review thread? A big part of the hangup there is the models/animation.
Click to expand...

I'm aware of it but have only glanced at the thread, so don't know what exactly needs to be done. Anyway, you and sparth will have to direct me at what is most important to work on first. Sparth gave me this list, and that's what I'll work on unless something else is more important to C2C.(^^):

  • LLama Archer model. Its badly optimized and badly animated.
  • Then Bison Rider need changing rider model (he wear too much armor IMO) and models its to big (356kb). Giraffe Rider too.
  • All mammoth units should be changed to similar models liks Mammoth Rider. Mammoth Ballista and Bombard are riding on brown elephants now :/
  • Also Droid Tank model its too big (1.5 Mb!)
 
Just want to say Thanks to Sparth and Toffer for the face lift they are giving C2C while reducing the graphics load. Big +1 Guys! Job Well Done. :D

JosEPh
 
Reduced the polycount by 500 on the droidtank (about 30KB), improved UV map and added an improved idle animation.

Attachment


Edit: I know, sparth, the moment after you committed the last version I had to do this... ^^

Is the llamaarcher actually missing the rider? I only get two overlapping llamas and a giant arrow-holster in the sky when imported in blender...
 
The first iteration of the new LlamaArcher is now finished, size decrease: 608→144 KB per cultural variation of the unit.

Since I decided to make the armature from scratch, I'll have to figure out the mysteries of the kfm file format before I can complete the second iteration, that is full animation.

Edit: Attachments removed.
 
Toffer90 said:
I'm aware of it but have only glanced at the thread, so don't know what exactly needs to be done. Anyway, you and sparth will have to direct me at what is most important to work on first. Sparth gave me this list, and that's what I'll work on unless something else is more important to C2C.(^^):

  • LLama Archer model. Its badly optimized and badly animated.
  • Then Bison Rider need changing rider model (he wear too much armor IMO) and models its to big (356kb). Giraffe Rider too.
  • All mammoth units should be changed to similar models liks Mammoth Rider. Mammoth Ballista and Bombard are riding on brown elephants now :/
  • Also Droid Tank model its too big (1.5 Mb!)
Click to expand...
There's numerous new models we would need to complete the Naval Review. There's also a number of programming elements that need to be developed out to complete the vision as well.

I have not taken full stock of what models and such could be used for each proposed unit. Many current units will be changing roles and so between both needs, what would have to happen would be a complete audit of all the naval unit models based on the list of naval units, both proposed as new and ones to be edited.

This WAS one of the things on the forefront of my efforts until I started in trying to solve the absolutely endless string of bugs the mod possesses. That volume of bugs is so overwhelming it just strips the motivation completely, particularly since there are many which would require much better programmers than myself to resolve and without there being a better programmer than myself working on the mod since Koshling, AIAndy and Alberts2 apparently kinda gave up, the sense that my efforts would largely be a colossal waste by the time its all said and done means I'm finding it difficult to maintain motivation myself.

The biggest problems are in the AI and I could probably solve them. However, as Alberts2 observed as he started getting in and trying to resolve even one AI issue himself, the simplest fixes there are horrendously likely to create new issues that are even worse. The whole thing needs such vast overhauling that it will require a dedicated team full of programming talent and all agreeing on numerous base rule methods to address it properly. Either that or a great deal of determination from one or two. But again, there are some serious weird bugs I don't have the slightest knowledge of how to resolve or even what the problem really amounts to taking place that without knowing there are some with greater coding understanding working on the mod, I'm not sure its worth the effort.

But we can always keep ignoring the serious problems and work on the stuff we want to work on. It's frustrating to have put so much effort into the naval review only to have it mothballed due to so many outstanding issues to be resolved before I can justify further programming efforts to build in the effects intended for the navies. But there's a good number of months worth of modelling efforts to complete the project on that end and if someone was working towards it, I'd feel more compelled to try to match the efforts to get the programming side of it completed.

Still, without addressing SOME of the AI problems that I know exist, the game is pretty much doomed to be a frustrating play experience for anyone. And the whole effort is worthless to ME if I can't fix all of these multiplayer OOS errors as well, which is perhaps another year's worth of effort to conquer too.

After 3 years of working on the mod, to see so much still left to do to correct so many things, I'm starting to feel like I'm wasting a significant chunk of my life on this stuff.


All that said, I know the feeling is probably extremely temporary. After a month or two more of taking a break I expect I'll hear the calling to come back and attack all these problems with a vengeance again. Maybe there will come a time when I'm not working 50+ hours a week just to barely make ends meet and I'll feel like I have enough disposable time on my hands to have enough focus that I can actually resolve some of these terrifyingly complex issues we face.

Which is why if you do want to work on the naval units that still need modelling definition, I doubt it would be an effort made in vain. But the first step would be to take full stock of what we do have and what units those models would be assigned to so as to expose all the rest that need a new or adjusted model.

I found some great models online that it sounds like you could work with to reduce polycount, reskin, and give basic animation to. I would be more than happy to aid in the effort to find more and give some direction for each unit that needs defining.

All naval units in the naval review lineup can be found here! It might be necessary to create another page on this document and use it to track what models are being assigned to what unit to show where we don't have ones. The Naval Review thread has a lot of discussion between Hydro and I and some from Sparth discussing new models and what they would be assigned to.
 
@TB,
Even the Most Ardent Fans get tired after awhile. And the stress of RL can zap the will to do those things you would normally "love" to do. Life is just that way.

I wish I could simplify it for you but I can't. Sorry my friend.

JosEPh
 
Yeah I'm sorry you feel that way TB. I agree (and hope) that the feeling will indeed pass in time.

If there are AI (or other) unreported bugs that seem too complex for you to fix, I would advise you to try and forget about them.
(...after first making a list to dig out should a team of programmers ever materialize to tackle them...:p)

Please don't worry about the bugs making the mod frustrating to play. A mod currently in development is far and away the least frustrating type of game to play;). And of all mods in current development of all games, I think it's quite likely that C2C is the best! Impartially speaking it really is quite likely. You are wasting your life on Starry Night or Sagrada Familia!!!:D

We only want your spare time. We don't begrudge your absence working to put food on the table. (Just don't take up any other hobby okay...:p)
 
Sparth said:
Uploaded!
Waiting for more hehe :D
Click to expand...

LlamaArcher is now fully optimized, animated and adjusted for ethnic variations (only tested European and Native versions in game).

Figuring out custom animations was a b*tch btw. At least now I know what's what for the next unit in the line.

Edit:
The _FX version actually looks worse as the shading amplifies the fact that it is low poly by shadowing every flat surface differently (large flat surfaces and shading = blocky aesthetics). As far as I've read on the internet the FX version should actually perform better due to having a nif node that can't be created correctly (by modders) for unshaded models. I would personally skip the _FX version altogether or increase it's polycount. What do you think?

Edit2:
archer_arrow.dds & horsearcher_weapons_64.dds is no longer used by the llamaarcher model.
 
Toffer90 said:
The _FX version actually looks worse as the shading amplifies the fact that it is low poly by shadowing every flat surface differently (large flat surfaces and shading = blocky aesthetics). As far as I've read on the internet the FX version should actually perform better due to having a nif node that can't be created correctly (by modders) for unshaded models. I would personally skip the _FX version altogether or increase it's polycount. What do you think?
Click to expand...

Lets stick with one NIF per unit type. Less data is better :)


Toffer90 said:
Edit2:
archer_arrow.dds & horsearcher_weapons_64.dds is no longer used by the llamaarcher model.
Click to expand...

Ok tnx for hint, Ill remove them in next upload.
 
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