"Hi, my name is Ahmed and I want to be a suicide bomber"

[Winner]

oh come now I can read just fine, you claimed China's cultural traditions were inferior to the west...

No, you're just wrong.

Because I see that people here are sometimes unbearably obtuse, I have to explain it for the sake of clarity:

The question Han.Bar. asked consisted of two parts:

what was the chinese reform? and why are the Islamic societies desperately fighting against the more advanced civilizations ?

I replied in two paraghraphs, each containing an answer to one question:

Deng Xiaoping's (I hope this is the correct English spelling, in Czech, it is completely different and I am sure neither has anything in common with the real Chinese name of that guy ) reforms that introduced market economy into China.

I don't know, maybe because they realized, that their cultural traditions are inferior and their society cannot compete with the West and others.

So now I expect your apologies

you were not talking about the Islamic world as you yourself stated they failed to reform and in your last comment you claimed "they" (China) reformed because they realized "that their cultural traditions are inferior"

how is that jumping to conclusions?

see how easily ad hominem attacks can backfire...

and do tell us what cultural traditions have to do with technological, economic, and industrial reform?

Now that you see how wrong you were, let's move on:

cultural traditions are critically important. The Western individualist culture and its dynamism was a prerequisite for the industrial revolution. That's why it didn't happen in China, for instance, though China had been more advanced than Europe for all of its previous history.

Islamic culture is not compatible with modern capitalist and liberal society. That's because the Islamic culture is simply a copy of 7th century Arabian traditions and customs, which were estabilished in Islam as the most perfect way of life that can't be made better.

In order to modernize, you have to make reforms, but these reforms go against the principles of Islam as a religion, that's why they find it so hard to make them and that's why they're lagging behind civilizations, that are able to change.

 

[CartesianFart]

In order to modernize, you have to make reforms, but these reforms go against the principles of Islam as a religion, that's why they find it so hard to make them and that's why they're lagging behind civilizations, that are able to change.

I wouldn't say all of the Muslim world are lagging behind defintively.There are some patches of great advances in United Arab Emirates,Indonesia and other places that equal in merit of what constitute "civilization" in a modern sense.

As long as the poor stagnate and do not grow in posterity of economical opportunities then the extreme dogma of Islam will continue to effect and attract and take hold to the destitutes.

 

[Winner]

I wouldn't say all of the Muslim world are lagging behind defintively.There are some patches of great advances in United Arab Emirates,Indonesia and other places that equal in merit of what constitute "civilization" in a modern sense.

As long as the poor stagnate and do not grow in posterity of economical opportunities then the extreme dogma of Islam will continue to effect and attract and take hold to the destitutes.

The stronger the Islamic culture is, the more bacwards is the nation. Of course, some of them had hell of a luck when they (well, British, in fact) found they're sitting on huge reserves of oil.

If there wasn't oil in the Middle East, entire region would be totally unimportant - something like a great theme park for tourists, who would like to see what the world was like in the Middle Ages.

 

[MamboJoel]

Winner, what are you trying to prove ? What is your conclusion ?

 

[Winner]

Winner, what are you trying to prove ? What is your conclusion ?

I think it is pretty obvious.

 

[Revolutionary]

So now I expect your apologies

for someone such as you who throws insults at others wanting an apology is assuming

you have no one but yourself to blame for that misunderstanding, you talked about one subject then in your last statement changed to another without even mentioning the name of your new subject, poor writting on your part...

 

[Trajan12]

The stronger the Islamic culture is, the more bacwards is the nation. Of course, some of them had hell of a luck when they (well, British, in fact) found they're sitting on huge reserves of oil.

If there wasn't oil in the Middle East, entire region would be totally unimportant - something like a great theme park for tourists, who would like to see what the world was like in the Middle Ages.

OMG I've never heard anything more true recently.

 

[Cannae]

I talked about Islamic cultural tradition, which is inferior and unable to cope with modern world.

inferior in comparison to what? I am also asking who gets to decide what's inferior and what's not?

 

[Trajan12]

inferior in comparison to what? I am also asking who gets to decide what's inferior and what's not?

It is legally backwards, technologically backwards, contributionally backwards,(besides oil) this culture of Islam is failing miserably.

Compared to western culture, Islamic culture is inferior.

 

[C~G]

Ah, the Supremacy complex.

Maybe you should start a new club.
There are quite bit volenteers on board.

I could very well say that the credibility of people in such club claiming Islam being this or that about other issues as well is reaching very rapidly zero.

I guess africans are backwards too and african-americans live still in ghettos so they must be backward too.

 

[Atlas14]

It is legally backwards, technologically backwards, contributionally backwards,(besides oil) this culture of Islam is failing miserably.

Compared to western culture, Islamic culture is inferior.

I tend to think it is more the Islamic theocracies and governments that are inferior, not their culture.

 

[Trajan12]

Africans and black Americans do none of the insane things found in sharia. At least we can grasp the concept of justice.

Also there are no entire countries based on african american law. Africa, is backwards. African americans live relativley comfortable lives compared to people in Africa and the Middle East. We contribute to American society, economy, Islamic law and culture only harms. Not a fair comparison.

 

[Winner]

inferior in comparison to what? I am also asking who gets to decide what's inferior and what's not?

It is objectively inferior, because it can't deal with modernity.

 

[Winner]

Ah, the Supremacy complex.

Maybe you should start a new club.
There are quite bit volenteers on board.

I could very well say that the credibility of people in such club claiming Islam being this or that about other issues as well is reaching very rapidly zero.

I guess africans are backwards too and african-americans live still in ghettos so they must be backward too.

Thank you for your bright insight, it is actually very useful.

 

[Atlas14]

It is objectively inferior, because it can't deal with modernity.

The Amish aren't modern. Is there something inherently inferior about being less "modern"?

 

[Cannae]

It is objectively inferior, because it can't deal with modernity.

and who decieds what's modern? honestly

 

[Trajan12]

and who decieds what's modern? honestly

Islamic law, is not modern by any standard. For example, rolling homosexuals down hills and burying them alive.

 

[Winner]

and who decieds what's modern? honestly

Not who, but what - success. We can measure it by the efficiency of the economy, by the living standard, technology and by hundred other standards.

 

[Atlas14]

Islamic law, is not modern by any standard. For example, rolling homosexuals down hills and burying them alive.

But under a government change, to say something more democratic, such bigotry would not be accepted. The problem does not originate in Islam, but in the tyrannical leadership. Muslims in America do not have the same problem as those in the Middle East, because we have a superior government, not because the Middle Easterners have an inferior culture.

 

[Winner]

The Amish aren't modern. Is there something inherently inferior about being less "modern"?

Yes. Civilization, as I perceive it, should constantly seek an improvment, advance. If you stagnate, you're less civilized, in my opinion. That's the main difference between civilization and barbarism - civilization builds, invent, create new things and ideas. Barbarians just live, without making any real progress. That's what happened to Islam.