HOF Questions and Answers Thread

Sun Tzu Wu · May 3, 2009

Mesix said:
When a Major Gauntlet is played on Diety level, it is even easier to spot the results from the first update since they are detailed on the HOF update for every player brave enough to take on Diety. I don't think think this is much of a problem. There is still a whole update for better times to be achieved. Sure, the players have a target to shoot for from the first update, but they still have no idea what the results have been sice the update. Keeping the status quo is also an incentive for a potential 1st place finisher from the early update to continue playing to improve his/her time.

Most Major Gauntlet players know that any Game they submit before the first update will be published in the HOF Tables (assuming it is one of the 10 best in its category) and to a lesser extent the HOF Ad Hoc Query (top 50 in this case).

Although I've never tried it, there's the possibility of playing a Major Gauntlet game though to its completion prior to the first update, but submitting it only after that first update. Thus, the Game's win Date or Score will not be revealed until the second update/End of the Major Gauntlet.

Sun Tzu Wu

Denniz · May 3, 2009

All the games from each update are listed on the Updates tab of the Statistics page. So they would always be there if nowhere else. Way to much interference with the normal HOF to protect those published gauntlet games. Best to hold off submitting until after the update like Sun Tzu Wu mentioned.

Sun Tzu Wu · May 3, 2009

Denniz said:
All the games from each update are listed on the Updates tab of the Statistics page. So they would always be there if nowhere else. Way to much interference with the normal HOF to protect those published gauntlet games. Best to hold off submitting until after the update like Sun Tzu Wu mentioned.

Thanks for the Correction. I didn't consider the Updates tab of the Statistics page as a means of getting information on Games in an Active Major Gauntlet.

Submitting a Game with a really good Date/Score before the first update of a Major Gauntlet could also demoralize your Competitors. So, I don't necessarily agree that holding off until after the first update is always the best option. (However, it is the only option if you want your Date/Score hidden until the Major Gauntlet ends.)

Sun Tzu Wu

AndrewN · May 8, 2009

OK, I have a question, the requirement is for a 4000BC save, but can you provide a save when you have moved the units and settled your capital? Basically I am creating start positions but I am not using map finder so I want to have a quick look round the starting position before keeping the start, i.e. move the warrior/scout and (maybe) settle the capital so I can see what is revealed.

Mesix · May 8, 2009

AndrewN said:
OK, I have a question, the requirement is for a 4000BC save, but can you provide a save when you have moved the units and settled your capital? Basically I am creating start positions but I am not using map finder so I want to have a quick look round the starting position before keeping the start, i.e. move the warrior/scout and (maybe) settle the capital so I can see what is revealed.

I am interested in the answer to this question too. I try to save over a previous starting save immediately, but if I move before I save, I usually hunt down the 4000 BC autosave for the initial file when submitting. If moving the settler before the initial save is allowed, it would make life easier.

Robert Smith · May 8, 2009

Mesix said:
I am interested in the answer to this question too. I try to save over a previous starting save immediately, but if I move before I save, I usually hunt down the 4000 BC autosave for the initial file when submitting. If moving the settler before the initial save is allowed, it would make life easier.

But I'm sure u r using HOF

Correct me if I'm wrong but why not check the Create Staring Save option on HOF 3 tab and then you submit that file (this is a save before you start to move, the autosave in auto folder is similarly to the file created by HOF-mod)

pegasus28 · May 8, 2009

Hi everyone! My first HOF post and unfortunately it is to share my painful experience, hopefully for the benefit of others.

From my experience do not restore from backup! (unless you are a tech wiz)

Basically a power cut during a game slowed the performance drastically (got the "your computer is lower than spec" message for the first time. Thinking a file curruption had occured I tried uninstalling and reinstalling CIV4 & BTS only to run into the dreadded Vista problems loading mod 3.17 that I had at the begining. Then I had the bright idea of restoring from backup and thought that all the problems will go away.

But no, the backup does not keep all files, and BTS cannot be started. Did some frantic non-tech-like deletions, copy and pastings and managed to mess things up even more (won't bore you with the details...not that I can remember everything as well)

Now I cannot start or reinstall BTS as it is "already to mod 3.17" even though I deleted every CIV file I could find. I think I will have to restore to factory settings and start all over agin. I am open to any suggestions from the tech wizzes on this forum.

....this may be a sign that I have been playing CIV too long and should get back to work..

Denniz · May 8, 2009

pegasus28 said:
Now I cannot start or reinstall BTS as it is "already to mod 3.17" even though I deleted every CIV file I could find. I think I will have to restore to factory settings and start all over agin. I am open to any suggestions from the tech wizzes on this forum.

Can you uninstall using the control panel? Uninstalling and re-installing from scratch seems like the only way to get your install back to the way it was.

ori · May 8, 2009

@pegasus28:
you probably missed some files - look in the spoiler for a list of stuff that needs to go

Spoiler complete reinstall guide :

pegasus28 · May 8, 2009

Thanks for your replies Denniz & ori

I will try over the weekend and let you know.....

I am getting CIV withdrawls already

Ozbenno · May 8, 2009

Robert Smith said:
But I'm sure u r using HOF Correct me if I'm wrong but why not check the Create Staring Save option on HOF 3 tab and then you submit that file (this is a save before you start to move, the autosave in auto folder is similarly to the file created by HOF-mod)

This is the best option, or using the 4000BC file generted by MapFinder but any file from 4000BC is acceptable.

Sun Tzu Wu · May 8, 2009

AndrewN said:
OK, I have a question, the requirement is for a 4000BC save, but can you provide a save when you have moved the units and settled your capital? Basically I am creating start positions but I am not using map finder so I want to have a quick look round the starting position before keeping the start, i.e. move the warrior/scout and (maybe) settle the capital so I can see what is revealed.

The start file must be the first turn of the Game, before any moves are made.

Please note the following quote from the HOF page:
http://hof.civfanatics.net/civ4/rules.php?show=submission

Submissions

There are two files we must have:

The start file (generally 4000bc). This is the first turn. Simply save the game before making any moves.

Furthermore, if the start looks promising, you must pursue it for a minimum of 30 minutes before saving it again to resume later.

Please note the following quote from the HOF page:
http://hof.civfanatics.net/civ4/rules.php?show=disallowed

Session length

We recommend that you aim to play sessions of at least half an hour in duration. Submissions with play sessions less than half an hour risk rejection.

Happy Hunting!

Sun Tzu Wu

Sun Tzu Wu · May 8, 2009

pegasus28 said:
Hi everyone! My first HOF post and unfortunately it is to share my painful experience, hopefully for the benefit of others.

From my experience do not restore from backup! (unless you are a tech wiz)

Basically a power cut during a game slowed the performance drastically (got the "your computer is lower than spec" message for the first time. Thinking a file curruption had occured I tried uninstalling and reinstalling CIV4 & BTS only to run into the dreadded Vista problems loading mod 3.17 that I had at the begining. Then I had the bright idea of restoring from backup and thought that all the problems will go away.

But no, the backup does not keep all files, and BTS cannot be started. Did some frantic non-tech-like deletions, copy and pastings and managed to mess things up even more (won't bore you with the details...not that I can remember everything as well)

Now I cannot start or reinstall BTS as it is "already to mod 3.17" even though I deleted every CIV file I could find. I think I will have to restore to factory settings and start all over agin. I am open to any suggestions from the tech wizzes on this forum.

....this may be a sign that I have been playing CIV too long and should get back to work..

To completely remove BtS, you may need to remove its Registry entries as well. Run regedit.exe and check for keys named "Fiaxis Games", "Sid Meier's Civilization 4", "Sid Meier's Civilization 4 - Beyond the Sword" and "Sid Meier's Civilization 4 - Warlords". I see entries for these keys in HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE/SOFTWARE and one for each patch applied. I wasn't able to find any others in other areas of the Registry, but I didn't look real hard.

I'm not sure whether removing all Civ4 registry entries would be required before re-installing, but I don't see how it could hurt.

You probably will want to remove Vanilla Civ4 and Warlords too.

Sun Tzu Wu

ori · May 8, 2009

Sun Tzu Wu said:
To completely remove BtS, you may need to remove its Registry entries as well. Run regedit.exe and check for keys named "Fiaxis Games", "Sid Meier's Civilization 4", "Sid Meier's Civilization 4 - Beyond the Sword" and "Sid Meier's Civilization 4 - Warlords". I see entries for these keys in HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE/SOFTWARE and one for each patch applied. I wasn't able to find any others in other areas of the Registry, but I didn't look real hard.

I'm not sure whether removing all Civ4 registry entries would be required before re-installing, but I don't see how it could hurt.

You probably will want to remove Vanilla Civ4 and Warlords too.

Sun Tzu Wu

I would advise against editing the registry unless you know what you are doing - however if you do:
the install keys unfortunately are hidden in the installshield keys for these games and do not reference the game (though they do reference the patch version), they are:
CFBCE791-2D53-4FCE-B3FB-D6E01F4112E8 (Vanilla)
3E4B349F-10B5-4586-9D99-489A90A8B228 (Warlords)
32E4F0D2-C135-475E-A841-1D59A0D22989 (BtS) and occur twice in the registry each.

Sun Tzu Wu · May 9, 2009

ori said:
I would advise against editing the registry unless you know what you are doing - however if you do:
the install keys unfortunately are hidden in the installshield keys for these games and do not reference the game (though they do reference the patch version), they are:
CFBCE791-2D53-4FCE-B3FB-D6E01F4112E8 (Vanilla)
3E4B349F-10B5-4586-9D99-489A90A8B228 (Warlords)
32E4F0D2-C135-475E-A841-1D59A0D22989 (BtS) and occur twice in the registry each.

Backing up the Registry before editing it may be prudent.

So these Installshield keys also have to be removed as well, before the these programs will re-install properly.

When the Civ4, [Warlords], and BtS are re-installed, these keys should added in precisely the required locations in the Registry.

There are many applications that will not re-install correctly without removing all their registry entries (especially the keys that say what version of the program is installed and the installer will not allow a down-grade!). This is surprisingly true of many Microsoft utility programs.

In my opinion, the Registry was the worst idea Microsoft ever implemented as an integral part of its operating systems. A wonderful single point of failure for malware to target. It's fragile enough without malware being present.

Sun Tzu Wu

unclethrill · May 9, 2009

ori said:
I would advise against editing the registry unless you know what you are doing - however if you do:
the install keys unfortunately are hidden in the installshield keys for these games and do not reference the game (though they do reference the patch version), they are:
CFBCE791-2D53-4FCE-B3FB-D6E01F4112E8 (Vanilla)
3E4B349F-10B5-4586-9D99-489A90A8B228 (Warlords)
32E4F0D2-C135-475E-A841-1D59A0D22989 (BtS) and occur twice in the registry each.

I agree to tread lightly in the registry but as the voice of experience, removing the keys manually is the only choice here.

Mesix · May 9, 2009

Sun Tzu Wu said:
In my opinion, the Registry was the worst idea Microsoft ever implemented as an integral part of its operating systems. A wonderful single point of failure for malware to target. It's fragile enough without malware being present.

Sun Tzu Wu

I think Microsoft OS is malware. Especially Vista.

AndrewN · May 9, 2009

Ozbenno said:
This is the best option, or using the 4000BC file generted by MapFinder but any file from 4000BC is acceptable.

Sun Tzu Wu said:
The start file must be the first turn of the Game, before any moves are made.

There seems to be a difference of opinion here. As Ozbenno is a HOF staff member I am inclined to accept his word on the matter but it would be nice for a bit of confirmation.

Sun Tzu Wu said:
Please note the following quote from the HOF page:
http://hof.civfanatics.net/civ4/rules.php?show=submission

I did read the page in question, but in my opinion it didn't make the position perfectly clear which is why I asked for the confirmation of the rules.

Sun Tzu Wu said:
Furthermore, if the start looks promising, you must pursue it for a minimum of 30 minutes before saving it again to resume later.

Oh yes, I played one of the starts for about 4 hours and then 2.5 (until 3am) and it looks very promising, so with no disrespect to you, Sun, I hope you are wrong

Denniz · May 9, 2009

AndrewN said:
There seems to be a difference of opinion here. As Ozbenno is a HOF staff member I am inclined to accept his word on the matter but it would be nice for a bit of confirmation.

We would prefer that you provide the start file before performing any actions. People want to see the start the way it was. I guess you could classify providing a starting save after moving and settling as being slightly rude. Occasional rudeness can be forgiven. Habitual rudeness tends to have conseqenses.

We provide a Create Start Save feature, as mentioned, and Civ4 creates an inital autosave. Those don't help with with manual regenerate but how much effort is it to hit Ctrl-S before moving? All you have to do is remember to rename it if the game is a keeper. Is that really too much to ask?

AndrewN · May 9, 2009

Denniz said:
We would prefer that you provide the start file before performing any actions. People want to see the start the way it was. I guess you could classify providing a starting save after moving and settling as being slightly rude. Occasional rudeness can be forgiven. Habitual rudeness tends to have conseqenses.

We provide a Create Start Save feature, as mentioned, and Civ4 creates an inital autosave. Those don't help with with manual regenerate but how much effort is it to hit Ctrl-S before moving? All you have to do is remember to rename it if the game is a keeper. Is that really too much to ask?

Thank you Denniz. I apologise if my next submission is rude, it will not happen again. Had I not played one of the starts and it seemed promising I would have started again.

I have not played with the HoF mod much, basically for both this and the GOTM games I am using it as it came out of the box. I will endeavour to learn the functionality that has been provided.

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