How Are You Dealing with Trade Now That the Patch Broke It?

[Manifold]

The motivation is gone when you only play against yourself

 

[Acken]

I'm impressed some of you managed to reach the 1000s of hours
I'm just waiting to see if they can salvage it with an expansion since approx. 1month after release.

 

[cranium1]

I just started my first real Civ VI game and found this bug. So I headed over here to check. It's bad that this passed through QC but its unacceptable that it's not been fixed yet!

 

[blackbutterfly]

An early relic could be bought for a luxury and give or take 10 gpt.

Actually you can even buy works of art for 1 gold if the AI is friendly/neutral. They charge more the more aggressive they become.

IMO it may not be as broken it may seem at first glance. Since the Summer '17 patch the AI pursue science more aggressively so thy don't value art so much. That's fine. In the past Culture victory was too hard and took the longest.

As for the AI trading you a city for a joint war, well I've never got more than 2 cities in games using this method. In fact when you do the cities are on distant continents. (I've been playing huge+ maps recently). I don't think it's game breaking. (What people have posted is the AI might look like it will agree to trading away its entire empire and works of art but it won't actually agree to the trade. That's a bug but again not game breaking IMO).

 

[oedali]

As for the AI trading you a city for a joint war, well I've never got more than 2 cities in games using this method. In fact when you do the cities are on distant continents. (I've been playing huge+ maps recently). I don't think it's game breaking. (What people have posted is the AI might look like it will agree to trading away its entire empire and works of art but it won't actually agree to the trade. That's a bug but again not game breaking IMO).

Why should the AI give away cities to go to JW in the first place? Doesn't make any sense. Especially in the early game first 50 turns where it cripples them (which is exactly what happened in my game)

 

[Forster]

I've never had the ai offer a city except for peace deals where it cedes cities that I already captured. BTW, the ai seems to be making all trade offers with I can not accept. I accidently clicked on what would make this work and it comes back acceptable. When the ai makes an offer and the choice show it can't be accepted try asking what will make the deal work. See if that solves the problem for you.

 

[Victoria]

I don't think it's game breaking.

I attack a civ and take one city, they have 6 left. I ask for peace including all 5 of their cities and they agree...
I do not have to rush my theatres, build them in my own good time and fill them with a pittance of change
You can play the game, you can even ignore these.... but they do break the game.

 

[oedali]

I attack a civ and take one city, they have 6 left. I ask for peace including all 5 of their cities and they agree...
I do not have to rush my theatres, build them in my own good time and fill them with a pittance of change
You can play the game, you can even ignore these.... but they do break the game.

Yes, exactly what I mean. This is why I had to stop playing the game after this patch. How can you just ignore this.. only way would be to artificially "force" yourself not to take the deal, like you offer peace they want give you 5 cities and their entire treasury and you are like "no that's too much, let's just make peace I don't ask anything else in return." Or they are willing to give you the same to go to joint war, and you say "no that's too much, let's just go to joint war I ask nothing in return out of the goodness of my heart".

Diplomacy and making deals and profiting from war/peace is such an important part of the gameplay for me. When it's not functioning properly (or at all, in this case) it is a game breaker

 

[blackbutterfly]

I attack a civ and take one city, they have 6 left. I ask for peace including all 5 of their cities and they agree...

Seriously?! I've never encountered this
The only time the AI ever gives up their empire is when I've decimated their army and pretty much captured all of their cities.

 

[Tech Osen]

Slightly related: open border agreements. I never open my borders to the AI because they'll often swamp your lands with units making it impossible to move your own. But the AI doesn't understand the value and risks of open borders at all. They will give them away for a handful of gold, making it easy to scout out their lands and gives a big boost to tourism. Even when I'm clearly going for a culture victory civs that have chain denounced me for centuries will open their borders for 1gpt and at most a single digit sum.
One sided open border agreements should only be possible in peace deals and demands IMO. In normal deals they should only agree to it if it's both ways (after they fix the mass invasion thing that is...).

 

[oedali]

Slightly related: open border agreements. I never open my borders to the AI because they'll often swamp your lands with units making it impossible to move your own. But the AI doesn't understand the value and risks of open borders at all. They will give them away for a handful of gold, making it easy to scout out their lands and gives a big boost to tourism. Even when I'm clearly going for a culture victory civs that have chain denounced me for centuries will open their borders for 1gpt and at most a single digit sum.
One sided open border agreements should only be possible in peace deals and demands IMO. In normal deals they should only agree to it if it's both ways (after they fix the mass invasion thing that is...).

I agree. Plus they always give open borders for 1 gold the first turn you meet them. And after that usually changes to 1GPT

 

[Slip de Garcon]

Seriously?! I've never encountered this
The only time the AI ever gives up their empire is when I've decimated their army and pretty much captured all of their cities.

I came looking for this thread really to post the odd thing that happened to me last night. China attacked me when I wasn't well prepared, but I managed to neutralise their incoming forces, was just starting to get ready to go on the offensive, and just thought I'd see what I could get for peace.

2 of their 6 cities.

When all I had done was kill their invading army, and hadn't set a foot on their territory.

I can only assume (if there is any logic to it) that the AI sometimes hates war weariness and will do almost anything for peace.

I have no shame - I took the deal.

 

[Art Morte]

I came looking for this thread really to post the odd thing that happened to me last night. China attacked me when I wasn't well prepared, but I managed to neutralise their incoming forces, was just starting to get ready to go on the offensive, and just thought I'd see what I could get for peace.

2 of their 6 cities.

When all I had done was kill their invading army, and hadn't set a foot on their territory.

I can only assume (if there is any logic to it) that the AI sometimes hates war weariness and will do almost anything for peace.

I have no shame - I took the deal.

Nah, that's not it. You could do this in Civ5, too, if I remember correctly. The AI's peace deals are solely (I think) based on their calculations of their military strength vs yours. Even when they don't see all your units, they know your military strength (it also can keep them from attacking you if you're strong enough). The AI also throws pretty much all its units at you when it goes to war. So, you can simply decimate their army in easy defensive warfare and then get a hugely favorable peace deal, even if you've never set foot in their territory. It's stupid, but that's the way it is.

 

[Tech Osen]

It's stupid, but that's the way it is.

Sorta sums up civ diplomacy.

 

[Shorlin]

Nah, that's not it. You could do this in Civ5, too, if I remember correctly. The AI's peace deals are solely (I think) based on their calculations of their military strength vs yours. Even when they don't see all your units, they know your military strength (it also can keep them from attacking you if you're strong enough). The AI also throws pretty much all its units at you when it goes to war. So, you can simply decimate their army in easy defensive warfare and then get a hugely favorable peace deal, even if you've never set foot in their territory. It's stupid, but that's the way it is.

Its one of my main problems with civ6 that taking cities, even through conquest, feels so damn unsatisfying. I think its down to 2 things:
1. no brakes on steamrolling the entire map. In civ4 you would eventually go bankrupt or your tech would grind to a halt and enemies will get superior military units, so you had to make peace and stabilise before going again. Similar in civ5 with global happiness. I prefer a series of smaller wars and steadily becoming more powerful than the endless steamroll in civ6.
2. It feels like a conquered city in 6 never becomes part of your empire. I think its to do with AI district placement, no turns of revolt, and same sized/instant borders. I really think all districts should be destroyed when a city captured, so you can start fresh and make it your own.

When I take a city I want to feel the power of my empire slowly expanding, to be honest in civ6 all I feel is mild irritation at the added micromanagement

 

[Art Morte]

Its one of my main problems with civ6 that taking cities, even through conquest, feels so damn unsatisfying. I think its down to 2 things:
1. no brakes on steamrolling the entire map. In civ4 you would eventually go bankrupt or your tech would grind to a halt and enemies will get superior military units, so you had to make peace and stabilise before going again. Similar in civ5 with global happiness. I prefer a series of smaller wars and steadily becoming more powerful than the endless steamroll in civ6.
2. It feels like a conquered city in 6 never becomes part of your empire. I think its to do with AI district placement, no turns of revolt, and same sized/instant borders. I really think all districts should be destroyed when a city captured, so you can start fresh and make it your own.

When I take a city I want to feel the power of my empire slowly expanding, to be honest in civ6 all I feel is mild irritation at the added micromanagement

I almost never "steamroll the entire map", it's just not a style I like, but maybe there should be more brakes on it than just war weariness - or it should be greater in some cases.

What would make waging wars a lot more enjoyable for my style of playing would be two things:

a) The AI deciding - based on military strength calculations, for instance - whether they're going to wage an offensive or defensive war. It feels stupid that if I declare war on the AI, it will send its units to my territory to attack me where it's usually easy to destroy them. The AI should sometimes just dig in in their own territory and defend.

b) The AI not giving such great peace deals to the human player unless they've already lost a city or two. You get cities and other stuff from the AI too easily without having to properly even attack them.

 

[UWHabs]

Its one of my main problems with civ6 that taking cities, even through conquest, feels so damn unsatisfying. I think its down to 2 things:
1. no brakes on steamrolling the entire map. In civ4 you would eventually go bankrupt or your tech would grind to a halt and enemies will get superior military units, so you had to make peace and stabilise before going again. Similar in civ5 with global happiness. I prefer a series of smaller wars and steadily becoming more powerful than the endless steamroll in civ6.
2. It feels like a conquered city in 6 never becomes part of your empire. I think its to do with AI district placement, no turns of revolt, and same sized/instant borders. I really think all districts should be destroyed when a city captured, so you can start fresh and make it your own.

When I take a city I want to feel the power of my empire slowly expanding, to be honest in civ6 all I feel is mild irritation at the added micromanagement

Yeah, once you take a city, it's just a "okay, one down, X to go" type of feeling. There's no reason that I would need to stop and regroup (unless if my troops need to heal), and the city is just... there. It's yours, but it's not yours.

I don't think all districts should be destroyed, since it's not like the Germans had to rebuild all of Paris when they captured it, or when the Allies captured it back. But I think the fact that it just flips to your side is still wrong. I think if you have to deal with a resistance/occupation period, then at least mentally once that's over you get a better sense of "and now this city is mine to control".

 

[EpicWestern]

My current policy:

Never initiate a trade except for:

1. open borders
2. buy a spy back
3. Peace
- will never trade for extra cities and works in peace deals
- will never bargain for more extra gold (but will accept gold other civ offers)

Will accept trades other civs offer except when it involves extra cities in peace deals

 

[comatosedragon]

I simply have not played a game since the patch. I eagerly await the next one.

That's how I deal with it.

 

[UWHabs]

Don't abuse the AI. Like, I'm not getting money by winning my civ games, so there's nothing wrong with not abusing the system with stuff that's obviously broken.