How often do you *not* get easy access to copper

[KentuckyJared20]

I'm probably the most inexperienced player on this site, I've only completed at most 5 games due to varying things, but whenever I play a game no matter what map (though I always play on either continents, custom continents, or terra) I rarely have copper. I always seem to have Iron, and rarely do I have either, marble, stone, or elephants. Just a quick question though, around how many cities do you all have around 0 AD?

 

[mariogreymist]

I'm probably the most inexperienced player on this site, I've only completed at most 5 games due to varying things, but whenever I play a game no matter what map (though I always play on either continents, custom continents, or terra) I rarely have copper. I always seem to have Iron, and rarely do I have either, marble, stone, or elephants. Just a quick question though, around how many cities do you all have around 0 AD?

That depends heavily on what my strategy for the game is, and what the land looks like. Sometimes I will have so much good land around me that I will just keep expanding until my economy crashes, other times I'll settle key sites to secure my territory and focus on development of what I have rather than expansion. It depends on the game too much for a simple, one-size fits all answer.

Perhaps if you tell us what kind of game you play (are you a peaceful wonder builder, or a warrior? or something else?) I could be of more help. And then tell us how many cities you generally have at that time, and maybe we can help.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

I'm probably the most inexperienced player on this site, I've only completed at most 5 games due to varying things, but whenever I play a game no matter what map (though I always play on either continents, custom continents, or terra) I rarely have copper. I always seem to have Iron, and rarely do I have either, marble, stone, or elephants. Just a quick question though, around how many cities do you all have around 0 AD?

Usually 7-9. 6 is a minimum extreme, 12-15 are upper bounds on normal speed for me.

That's for Immortal and below...on deity getting more than 6 is pretty hard, getting 10 impossible on most maps.

 

[KentuckyJared20]

That depends heavily on what my strategy for the game is, and what the land looks like. Sometimes I will have so much good land around me that I will just keep expanding until my economy crashes, other times I'll settle key sites to secure my territory and focus on development of what I have rather than expansion. It depends on the game too much for a simple, one-size fits all answer.

Perhaps if you tell us what kind of game you play (are you a peaceful wonder builder, or a warrior? or something else?) I could be of more help. And then tell us how many cities you generally have at that time, and maybe we can help.

I play either continents, custom continents, or terra maps, standard size on normal speed. I almost always go for the space victory, but sometimes I try to go for either conquest or domination. I always play as the American civ (and not because of the Navy SEALs), I just click one of the 3 leaders too. All of my games have been on Warlord. Usually whenever the game says "Sire our civilization is in great need of expansion!" is when I build a settler. I probably play like the biggest noob ever, as I don't understand most of this game and just select techs randomly. So any tips are gladly taken and appreciated!

 

[bestbrian]

I play either continents, custom continents, or terra maps, standard size on normal speed. I almost always go for the space victory, but sometimes I try to go for either conquest or domination. I always play as the American civ (and not because of the Navy SEALs), I just click one of the 3 leaders too. All of my games have been on Warlord. Usually whenever the game says "Sire our civilization is in great need of expansion!" is when I build a settler. I probably play like the biggest noob ever, as I don't understand most of this game and just select techs randomly. So any tips are gladly taken and appreciated!

Have you read through the articles in the War Academy? Sistuil's Beginner's Guide is highly reccommended. Also, go to the Strategy Forum and check out some of the walk throughs; you can learn alot from those.

Happy Civing.

 

[mariogreymist]

I play either continents, custom continents, or terra maps, standard size on normal speed. I almost always go for the space victory, but sometimes I try to go for either conquest or domination. I always play as the American civ (and not because of the Navy SEALs), I just click one of the 3 leaders too. All of my games have been on Warlord. Usually whenever the game says "Sire our civilization is in great need of expansion!" is when I build a settler. I probably play like the biggest noob ever, as I don't understand most of this game and just select techs randomly. So any tips are gladly taken and appreciated!

I'd say TMIT's answers serve fine for this kind of game. You want at least seven by 0AD. While it's easy to follow the advice of the popups, it's generally not the kind of advice that's going to get you ahead of the AIs.

 

[Calouste]

A good pillaging longbow camped on an iron hill will have +25%(hills) +25% (archery unit in hills) +50% (guerrilla II) and will defend at strength 12 before counter promos or fortification.

Between that and mobility, such a setup can be lethal, especially to humans who don't have the AI bonuses to stock each city with 3+ archers a piece and still field something else. Attacking those things on hills is like attacking grenadiers on the open field...in 200 AD X_X. They of course lose all that if they are attacking instead but for the choke role they're devastating.

On difficulties where the AI hasn't chopped everything yet (or against foolish humans or just very large amounts of land), woodsman II swords also enjoy an incredible boost in the forest. Again, you're looking at +50% (terrain) and + 50% (woodsman II), making them very obnoxious to attack there. A combat I shock axe attacking such a unit is 5+5(.1)=5.5 (axe) vs 6+6(1-.75)=7.5 (sword)! Anything else attacking will do miserably. Swords are a little better on city attack and cheaper than longbows, but unlike hills forests can be chopped.

The above 2 examples are even more ridiculous if you're on hill forests/jungle.

I was thinking about something similar recently after reading a discussion about the usefulness of the Dun. Thanks to the free Guerilla I promotion, with Boudica you could with a little effort pump out Guerilla II/Woodsman II Musketmen. A small stack of these, say 3-4, could be send into your enemy land and pillage everything in forests or on hills and would be expensive to defeat due to the combination of extra defense and fast movement. And of course if you fortify these guys on a forested hill, they are as strong as a tank: 9 base strength + 50% forest + 25% hill + 50% Woodsman II + 50% Guerilla II + 25% fortify bonus + 10% Combat I = 27.9

 

[Calouste]

Ballista Elephant IIRC is the only unit that can force a specific defender to defend, instead of whatever has the highest defense value, probably spearmen or pikemen. Not only that, Elephants get a bonus against mounted, and most mounted units don't get terrain bonuses. Potentially this is really useful if you're facing a mixed stack with lots of mounted units and a few strong defenders like pikemen in the field, as these elephants can kill knights and possibly even cuirassiers thanks to that anti-mounted bonus.

The Ballista Elephant is an excellent unit for defensive warfare and counter attacks against stacks. It's 50% bonus gets applied to the base strength of the mounted defender. It basically means your enemies can say goodbye to any horse-based units (often the strongest unit in their particular era) unless they just want to feed you GG points. What basically happens is that normally a stack is protected by spearmen/pikemen, who protect the mounted units from elephants, and by mounted units (horse archers, elephants, knights), who protect the rest of the stack (macemen, catapults, trebs) from crossbowmen. If you throw ballistas in the mix, they take care of the mounted, and the crossbowmen with a bit of help from a catapult or two take care of the rest of the stack at 70-80% odds or higher.

Even against cavalry it can still work, a Str II Formation Ballista beats a StrII Cavalry. Of course it is not particularly useful at city attacks, but the traits and the UB of the Khmer are geared towards peacefully building large cities, not large scale offensive warfare.

 

[bestbrian]

I was thinking about something similar recently after reading a discussion about the usefulness of the Dun. Thanks to the free Guerilla I promotion, with Boudica you could with a little effort pump out Guerilla II/Woodsman II Musketmen. A small stack of these, say 3-4, could be send into your enemy land and pillage everything in forests or on hills and would be expensive to defeat due to the combination of extra defense and fast movement. And of course if you fortify these guys on a forested hill, they are as strong as a tank: 9 base strength + 50% forest + 25% hill + 50% Woodsman II + 50% Guerilla II + 25% fortify bonus + 10% Combat I = 27.9

Doesn't Gunpowder obsolete Walls?

 

[KentuckyJared20]

Thanks guys!

 

[Hsinchu]

I don't think gunpowder obsoletes walls... I think walls + castles don't work against your gunpowder units on your opponents yet, but i think your units still get full on. Gunpowder may obsolete Chicen Itza if my memory serves.

 

[Calouste]

Doesn't Gunpowder obsolete Walls?

No, Walls obsolete with Rifling. Attacking Gunpowder units are not affected by the increased defense of Walls (and Castles), but by the time Musketmen come around most cities have 40-60% cultural defense anyway. Walls and Castles keep their effectiveness against siege until Cannon.

 

[bestbrian]

No, Walls obsolete with Rifling. Attacking Gunpowder units are not affected by the increased defense of Walls (and Castles), but by the time Musketmen come around most cities have 40-60% cultural defense anyway. Walls and Castles keep their effectiveness against siege until Cannon.

Got it. Been playing LoR for awhile, and couldn't recall when Walls obsolete in base BTS.

 

[morchuflex]

...Been playing LoR for awhile...

Same here. LOR is great (though still a WIP). I won't play regular BTS anymore any time soon.

 

[Grey Fox]

All you need is mounted + espionage OR SIEGE + whatever. As TMIT stated earlier in the thread Longbows are nice. No real counter.

 

[blitzkrieg1980]

Yes. And espionage+siege+whatever is even better

It's a good thing catapults and trebs don't require stone, eh? Then again, you could always just launch cows.

 

[Grey Fox]

Stone is everywhere. I think the stone resource just represents a high quantity/quality source of stone type X.

Or you can do what the mongols did and hurl corpses over the walls

 

[blitzkrieg1980]

Sarcasm is difficult to express via text I had always kind of wondered what the deal was with the "stone" resource

 

[Grey Fox]

I knew you were sarcastic, but I wonder if they ever ran out of ammunition during a siege

Various types of ammunition were used with the trebuchets. Stone shots have already been mentioned, but they also used beehives, small stones burned into clay balls which would explode on impact like grapeshot bullets, casks of tar and oil on fire, dead animals for introducing plagues and diseases, and finally prisoners of war and spies. It was said that one knew when they had landed - when the cries stopped!!

 

[Silu]

It's a good thing catapults and trebs don't require stone, eh? Then again, you could always just launch cows.

How awesome would that be? "Trebuchet - 80 - Requires Stone or Cows"

Oh, and the attack animation graphics...