if you burn a cd backup of a game cd

[wit>trope]

like you are allowed to do, if you lose the original game cd, will the burned cd backup still work? I mean if the game requires the game to have it in the drive, will it work? Could you install the game with the backup CD?

.... and if you lose/break the original game cd, could you make a backup of the backup and would the backup of the backup still work (install, be placed in drive for play)?

Or does this depend on the game?

Reason I ask is that some games go out of print and so I want to buy a backup copy of some that are favorites unless I can just burn my own

 

[Padma]

It depends on the copy-protection used on the CD, and the tools you have for making a backup.

For instance, "normal" cd-copy/backup tools will not make a working copy of the Civ3 disk. You need more "powerful" (e.g., pirating) tools to do that. But if you happen to have those tools installed on your system, the copy-protection scheme won't even let the game run, until you uninstall the tools.

 

[Dida]

Never heard of pirating tools, I should probably check into those.
But, always make back up copies, based on my experiences, CDs tends to go bad after a few years, if you don't make back up, you will lose the game.

 

[Speedo]

You'll need a tool like the excellent Alcohol 120%, which can defeat most copy protection programs. You'll also need to use a program like A-Ray which can scan a CD and identify the protection used so you can set up Alcohol appropriately.

Alcohol is 100% legal software which I use for 100% legal activities. You *could* use it to pirate software, but you would have go out and get a crack, unless the game doesn't require a CD-key or any kind of activation.

For instance, "normal" cd-copy/backup tools will not make a working copy of the Civ3 disk. You need more "powerful" (e.g., pirating) tools to do that. But if you happen to have those tools installed on your system, the copy-protection scheme won't even let the game run, until you uninstall the tools.

I'm a bit doubtful of this. The only copy protection I know of that does anything like this is Starforce (which is essentially a virus), but CivIII vanilla is before the time of Starforce.

I will scan and check it when I get home, but I doubt that it's something that can't be defeated. If it does happen to be Starforce, then my CivIII disk will be going in the trash (though I'm tempted to to use the opportunity to file a lawsuit).

 

[nonconformist]

Starforce is unaduterated junk.

 

[GrandAdmiral]

My CIV3 conquerors cd went bad. I left it in the cd tray for too long and the inner ring of the cd tray made a ring in the middle of the cd. Basically the cd could not install the game but it could be used to play it. I had bought CIV3 and both expansion packs the day they came out so after tech support told me to buy the game again I reinstalled with a backup copy and just used the original to play. I actually didn't know the discs had copy protection when I backed them up but the copy works for installation and playing and I never uninstalled the tools. I sure it probably has to do with the copyprotection not having anyway to recognize tools made or updated after the game was produced.

 

[Thrawn]

I'm a bit doubtful of this. The only copy protection I know of that does anything like this is Starforce (which is essentially a virus), but CivIII vanilla is before the time of Starforce.

Call of Duty:United Offensive refuses to run if Clone CD is installed. I had this problem when I bought cod:uo, uninstalled Clone CD and away I went, killing nazis.

 

[Padma]

You'll need a tool like the excellent Alcohol 120%, which can defeat most copy protection programs. You'll also need to use a program like A-Ray which can scan a CD and identify the protection used so you can set up Alcohol appropriately.

Alcohol is 100% legal software which I use for 100% legal activities. You *could* use it to pirate software, but you would have go out and get a crack, unless the game doesn't require a CD-key or any kind of activation.

For instance, "normal" cd-copy/backup tools will not make a working copy of the Civ3 disk. You need more "powerful" (e.g., pirating) tools to do that. But if you happen to have those tools installed on your system, the copy-protection scheme won't even let the game run, until you uninstall the tools.

I'm a bit doubtful of this. The only copy protection I know of that does anything like this is Starforce (which is essentially a virus), but CivIII vanilla is before the time of Starforce.

I will scan and check it when I get home, but I doubt that it's something that can't be defeated. If it does happen to be Starforce, then my CivIII disk will be going in the trash (though I'm tempted to to use the opportunity to file a lawsuit).

Vanilla Civ3 didn't have this "feature". Conquests reportedly does. I don't recall the copy-protection system it uses, but I am certain it is not Starforce. Alcohol, while perfectly legal, is one that seems to be detected, and "disallows" the game to run.

In any case, copy-protection like this is not the way to go, for these companies. All it does is encourage more pirating, because "I love the game, but I can't read the CD! "

FWIW, I can't play Conquests right now, because it thinks I have some debugger installed. PTW plays just fine, though....

 

[GrandAdmiral]

Hmm thats really weird. I didn't know about this but I have had Alcohol 120% installed for a while and I play Conquerors. I think its pretty wrong though if a game doesn't work because of that. I would say they are crossing the line. It definatley would encourage users to run a crack as opposed ditching their favorite burning software.

 

[Speedo]

My copy of Civ3 Vanilla has Safedisk 2.40.010, C3Q has Safedisk 2.90.040.

I'll try it next weekend perhaps (I haven't had any version of Civ3 installed in forever) and if it doesn't work, I think I'll see if I can raise a stink.

I agree that this stuff is ludicrous, just makes me want to give companies the finger and run cracks. The one that's been pissing me off lately is KOTOR2. Even after you defeat the SecuROM protection on the disk, the damn thing scans your SCSI ports and refuses to run if you have emulated drives

 

[CruddyLeper]

like you are allowed to do, if you lose the original game cd, will the burned cd backup still work?

Depends on;-

1) What software and hardware was used to make the backup.

2) The copy protection (if any) of the game.

3) Whether or not the game freaks out if it sees copying programs on the machine.

EDIT: A CD lasting only 4 years? I've got CD-ROMs that are 15 years old and still playing strong. I look after them, keep them cased and shelved when not in use. I avoid touching them and give them an occasional wipe with a soft cloth if I do put a fingermark on them.

Various companies offer a service to take the scratches out of CDs - and they're pretty good, maybe 85-90% success rate. Cheap too.

Raindrops are bad for disks. Slightly acid, you see. And water can penetrate the glued join between the upper and lower plastic layers (the metal foil in the middle has the data on. It's supposed to be kept away from air).

 

[GrandAdmiral]

On that note don't forget to pop the disk in the microwave for a few seconds if you want to see that dark side of the force.

 

[Grisu]

just a note: I don't know about the american law, but according to the new stupid EU-law, tools that are capable of going around copy-protection like you mentioned are illegal....even if you only use them to make a backup-copy of your legally aquired game. how ridiculous is that?

 

[Padma]

KaeptnOvi: The EU got that from the US. More accruately, they passed that law under pressure from Microsoft, DIsney, the RIAA, and other companies/groups that have a vested interest in not letting you make any copies of any sort of anything that you own.

Copyright law today is a far cry from what it was originally intended to be.

@Speedo, et.al.: I don't know details about Civ3/PTW/Conquests copy-protection. I am just passing on what I have seen over time up in the Civ3 forums, especially Tech Support. It could be that it isn't the copy programs, per se, but rather the "virtual disk" that can be created.

 

[wit>trope]

I agree. Could you imagine for example Plato copyrighting his works in his time (assuming there was printing then)? Could you imagine Shakespeare copyrighting his? Etc. There's just something really wrong with it.

Thanks for everyone's help.

Would the company send a replacement disk if you sent them the broken disk?

I can't do that with one game though because the company no longer exists!

 

[nonconformist]

You can actually repair minor scratches at home (I haven't tried) with toothpaste, or metal polish, apparently (don't take my word for this).

 

[bky1701]

There are no ways to burn CDs with some types of copy protection (some come with the copy protection on them before the game is put on them), but there are still ways around that, like making an ISO then mounting it with daemon tools, never burning a CD at all. That’s how most illegal copies are made now.

 

[kcwong]

Just install the tools in another computer... or in Virtual PC.

Then you can make backups, and games will run since you don't have any "pirating" tools installed.

I personally never need them... I treat my CDs very carefully. I don't use paper envelopes - I always use a CD case. I don't leave CD lying around - they're either in a drive, or inside a case. And I take great care when picking them out of the drive and case.

The only CD I have that breaks is the vanilla Civ3 CD - the inner ring cracked. I made a copy before it's too late, and can use the copy to install - then use PTW or Conquest to play.

 

[CIVPhilzilla]

I've lost 3 games lately, Starcraft Brood War, Postal 2, and Sim City 4 Rush Hour. It sucks not being able to play them, just becuase of normal wear and tear on the disk.

 

[Ivan the Kulak]

I think if you are getting disk damage then you should buy a new CD-ROM drive. A CD drive should not damage your disks in any way. The only CD drive prob I've had is playing Diablo, which for some reason liked to keep the drive spinning constantly at a high speed. After awhile the drive went bad, it probably got overheated.

I have seen a couple of PCs at work that would leave marks on CDs, and the drives in them are probably junk. (or have been abused)