Immortal Shadow Game

[Tobiyogi]

Here is a WB save from the starting position. Barbs lose their techs during conversion.
I will play on Bat Mod as usually.

 

[Araius]

We got copper lads

Spoiler :

Decided to chop the forest 1N then 1NE and then farm wheat... turns out that's a mistake since there's copper there.
Went two workers just to see how it would play out
Played to turn 24 and my second worker has just come out

Spoiler :

Is it better to work the copper or the spices in this case?
I mean... lots of warriors are nice but being size 1 kinda sucks

 

[sampsa]

Probably work copper to build 2 warriors, then start putting into settler, switch back to warrior and grow to size 2 when wheat is done. Chop settler at size 2.

 

[Gumbolt]

5H tile. You can build settler till wheat is farmed? Mean time chop into settler? Warriors are good too for fog busting.

Be interested to see how this works.

 

[Tobiyogi]

Spoiler Turn 22 :

2 warriors out with one chop, copper is improved, wheat will be next. Will probably finish the 3rd warrior and then go settler at size 2. I don't want the 2nd worker right now even if spice farm would not be that bad, forgot that it yields 2....

 

[Araius]

Well, I got a warrior out. Had to work spice for one turn otherwise AGI came in two turns. Oops
Going to start producing the settler at size two. Wondering where the best second city site is so I can send the warrior to fogbust

Spoiler :

Is it north cow... or south cow?
Also, was it a better idea to go for the wheel before AH? Not being able to hook up cities with roads while having two workers is kinda painful

 

[sampsa]

Land is horrible... Probably no biggie which one you go first, since you should be going settler-settler anyway. I think AH first is better than wheel.

 

[Tobiyogi]

Spoiler Strategy :

Mehmed is defenseless, plus we do not have really great land so I think some axes are needed.

 

[Gumbolt]

Yes this start looks great for a rush. Normally there is a 8-10 tile rule. Plenty of forest here. With 2 workers and a barracks that could work well.

 

[Tobiyogi]

Perfect conditions, yes. 2 workers are minimum but i don't want to delay axe production so i don't build a 3rd one atm.

Edit: @Gumbolt 8-10 tile rule means....? Distance to your victim? Or minimum number of tiles that should have a forest?

 

[Araius]

Now on turn 44 after settling at the northern cow (I just love commerce man)
Made a spice farm pretty much the turn I settled and then got my two workers straight onto the cow
There is a barbarian warrior who is trying to psyche me out at the top of the map with his combat I promotion, I don't appreciate it
Probably going to build a few warriors and then chop and axe or two for exploration and defence

Spoiler :

Wondering where the best city site is near the south cow
I could settle directly SW of it so I can work it immediately while also having both gems in BFC. Downsides are no 2 health from river, though I am expansive so ehh and also harder to defend since it's further out
Settling on the plains hill is the best defensive option and gives 1H immediately, but loses 1 gem
Settling south of the plains hill I'm also thinking of

 

[Tobiyogi]

i prefer the ph hill, don't mind if i lose one gem, these are for later anyway, and it's possible that a foreign civ claims the southern ones with culture even when they are in the bfc,
settling on the ph is closer, can share 2-3 cottages with the capitol, gets +1H

 

[Araius]

Played to T57

Spoiler :

Hooked up the copper forgetting that I can't build warriors anymore . Hoping that another AI gets iron so I can generously give them copper for a few turns
Can see three possible city sites atm. Clams, Deers and (another) cow
Probably settling the cow to deny Mehmed from having it
Aztecs fairly closeby to the west
Chopping granaries ASAP after pottery because the food situation is godawful
If I get 6 cities (albeit crap ones) I can treb up after engineering right? Mehmed is looking like he wants to party
What's the cutoff for an immortal axe rush?

 

[Gumbolt]

Can I ask what your plan is here?
Are you rushing an Ai or expanding?
Why are you building all these roads? Rivers connect resources. The roads to the cows were wasteful.
Same for farms. You should of been chopping forest and get your army up.

If your going war mode every worker should be chopping axes. On a map like this whipping isn't very viable. Ideally you want 2 cities full out producing 10-11 axes.

If you build granaries you are merely delaying any dow.

 

[Araius]

I'm expanding. I don't typically rush the AI early so I have no idea how many units I'd need
Yeah... I've not been great with my workers. I built that road since I was waiting for the borders to expand and that worker couldn't really do much else in the immediate area I don't think. I know the cow is worthless right now as a resource don't worry
I've been building axes since I can't build warriors, just trying to get some growth

 

[Tobiyogi]

I think a clear decision must be taken early on, "axing" or "rexing"
For axing, two cities work well, a settler for a 3rd city would be too much of an investment.
I personally find very painful not to build fast granaries and libraries with such a great leader we have here, but those buildings won't help. War is war, and peace is peace.
Don't have a lot exp. with axe rush neither, will see how it works out.

 

[lymond]

Proximity of AI matters as well.. I've not opened a save and only see some dude to the E with GW, but still seems a bit far for an axe rush. If that is Mehmed, he has highest Unitprob as well.

Note: If you don't know already, AIs will tell you what their best unit is currently when you open the dialogue. You might have to do it several times to get the right message.

ugh..this land is super crapola

 

[Gumbolt]

If your not doing a rush you have built way too many. With great wall his city will have a lot of culture. So 50-60% defences. If it's on a hill that will make things harder. Have you got open borders to scout?

Mehmed only has archers. Question is how easy will it be to take with unpromoted axes? You may need 3-1 units?

I think you have lost focus here.

 

[Tobiyogi]

At least, in my game, TGW has been built by someone else. Is not necessarily better for me, because that would mean less expansion, maybe archers for him.

I will definitely go for axes, have already begun to built them. He is not really close, could need some roads, but also need the chops. I wonder if one EXP granary each would benefit me to make 1 whip once in a while bearable (in-between the chops). Whipping axes with 29 OF is just too good.

 

[Gumbolt]

Need to be size 4. I guess with double production speed it helps. 30H in return for a unit whipped with 29OF. That could work. Downside is regrowth would be slow. If you left it near to end might work better? Axe rushes on higher levels can always be a gamble. Pending how many units you lose on the capital. I figure 10-12 at least here unless you catch him when a settler leaves the capital.