Infinite City Sprawl 03 - Divine

[qwertz]

first of all a screenshot of our financial advisor at 825BC:

We are running +1 at 100% gold slider. Also more than 50% of our expenses are coming from our units. As the barbarians have quite some cities ATM, they aren't too aggressive, so I decided that we have enough cities and military ATM. (Not that one can have enough cities/units, but we simply couldn't pay for them).


on the first turn, a trade with Pascal:

Not very fair, but he was the only AI without IW, so I saw no harm in giving it to him.

We switch to OR immediately.

I founded just one more city, 3W from Delhi and sent two workers to start prechopping the forests for the AP.


Delhi got the temple and was running the priest since then.
Bombay started to build some missionaries to convert our two newest cities.
As our two workers were busy with chopping and our land is still quite unimproved I built two more workers.
We are heavily relying on the whip so I built some granaries too.


Otherwise not much happened in the first several turns, expect:

The guy-from-the other-side-of-the-world wants us to stop trading with our only friend. I ask him what he did he , but he didn't want to tell me.


and than, in the 625BC we get the GP

and Pascal isn't even building the AP:

we bulb theo and enter the medieval era:

we immediately start the AP
unfortunately no one is willing to trade maths, so I decide to start chopping the forest anyway. With the OR bonus this is still 25 /forest.
At the end of my turn set, we still have few forests for chopping and we should be able to finish the AP within maybe 10 turns.


As suspect Lincoln captures the barbarian city

I think we have an important decision to make ATM; Pascal and Lincoln are boxing us in more and more. So I think we have two options ATM:
-Build some settlers and get the spots we can still get, build an army and get the barbarian cities that are still left, totally cripple our eco and hope we can recover somehow.
-build up our eco, research paper and try to get UoS.


also what GP do we want next; a prophet for the shrine would be nice, but we could also try to get 2 scientists for philo – paper

 

[qwertz]

@ ZPVCSPLFUIFDPEF, mysty: sorry I didn't see your posts before playing

 

[mystyfly]

@ ZPVCSPLFUIFDPEF, mysty: sorry I didn't see your posts before playing

... as expected... No big deal, nice turns.

Comments on the save:
- There are 2 barb cities left: Yue-Chi and FurCity. Yue-Chi is off grid and should be razed. We can use the settler (due in 1) to resettle 3E of vijay. The other city we should try to raze and resettle asap. I think Delhi should build 1-2 chariots (helped by bombay) to raze those cities and regrow. Once size 4 or 5 we can train another settler and 2pop whip it (for furcity). We should be able to support them, we have lots of riverside tiles (not worked atm..)

- We should try to run scientists asap. I'd prefer to get another GP before the GSs to build a shrine. To keep us well away from bankruptcy and help spreading conf. If we hire a scientist we'll get a GP in 19 instead of 30 (together with the priest). I hope we can hire 2 scientists + 1 priest as soon as possible as we need to bulb philo, paper and DR.

- AP looks nice. We can still gain a couple of hammers from forests out of the BFC.

- We need that stone city to accelerate USak and SM.

- My view mid-term summarized: Delhi should whip another settler (2 with the one under construction) to seal off pacal and get us some more cities. To regrow Delhi should build chariots (forget barracks). Try to get Delhi off settler + military duty ASAP (helped by chopping) to run as many specs as possible. If we spawn GSs, bulb philo and paper, if it's a GP build the shrine, for gold, religious spread and priestslots (If we get the 2 GSs, only run priests to avoid another scientist).


Roster:
mystyfly
r_rolo1
ssmage
Ralph_Jackson
qwertz - just played
ZPVCSPLFUIFDPEF
Ralph, do you have a disc yet? If so, go ahead, otherwise I guess you won't be able to get one until monday so I'll play saturday evening/sunday morning, followed by ZPV... on sunday evening, then Ralph sometime next week.

 

[ssmage]

Nice set, qwertz

Manitenice on diety this bad, 4 city and running all gold. X_X
Very hard times ahead.

 

[qwertz]

@mysty: sounds like a plan

Some more thoughts:
-we could try to get monarchy from a trade, if we than switch to caste when we don't need slavery, we could make Delhi to a quite powerful GPP.
-we could also use caste to run a merchant or three in our new cities to help supporting our expansion
-where should we put our in ATM? We still aren't sure if we are going to self-research paper or bulb it. Researching paper and bulbing it later is quite a waste, but we still shouldn't delay it too much.

Nice set, qwertz

Manitenice on diety this bad, 4 city and running all gold. X_X
Very hard times ahead.

Yeah indeed, IMO the hardest thing on deity is getting enough good city sites early without totally crushing your eco or at least keeping the AI from getting those sites.
However I think the map type is helping us a lot here.

 

[mystyfly]

^^ I believe now that selfresearching paper is the way to go (seeing our (atm) slow GPP in Delhi). Delhis should run as many priests as possible to build the shrine (+3 slots) to get another GP to burn on DR. Then we can run as many merchants and sci's as we like/needed. Adopting CS clearly helps there.

Should I play another set before ZPVCSPLFUIFDPEF does this evening?

 

[qwertz]

the problem is that "as many priests as possible" is equal to 1 ATM. maybe we should try to get OB with HC/pascal and hope they will spread some religions to us, so we can build another temple.

 

[mystyfly]

the problem is that "as many priests as possible" is equal to 1 ATM. maybe we should try to get OB with HC/pascal and hope they will spread some religions to us, so we can build another temple.

I know that and that's why I suggested running a few scis (or merchants) to get the first GP faster which gives us 3 more slots. In case we get a GS we can bulb philo, which will get us another religion.

 

[mystyfly]

I just couldn't resist...

Played 15 turns, 375BC - 1AD

(1)
We're merely puny

(2)
We have a chariot and an archer near Yue-Chi while Pacal aproaches with 2 chariots and a sword. I try my luck and force my chariot to attack. It wins! (and instantly is @ 10xp)

(3)
I find that Bombay didn't finish its courthouse, seems qwertz cancelled it. A note would've been nice... I hope not many hammers have been lost...

I also gift priesthood to Mehmed. Not that it changes anything (no diplo+..)

IBT
Honey comes by (no)

(4)
Make this deal (he wouldn't give more gold)

(6)
Beg sailing from lincoln and he accepts We now have some more trade routs (also with linc who built the GLH) and finally have copper connected to delhi

We were almost late in settling Varanasi

Made this deal (which can be cancelled on t1 of next players set)

(10)
Get lucky again and pop silver

I have 3 chariots and an archer near furcity and linc has some units. He suicided 1 or 2 and has a sword left. Hamm has a chariot there as well. I decide to try my luck again. 2 (unpromoted) chariots die, doing no harm. The C3-Chariot however kills one archer. I keep my fingers crossed that the AI doesn't keep the city if it takes it.

(11)
Lucky again

(14)
Pacal founds taoism. Guess where its holy city is?

BTW one turn to go on the AP

(15)
wOOt!!!

---

Shot of our capital

Of our empire

Advisors:

---

- Civics: We're still in Despotism/Barbarism/Slavery/Decentralizatioin/Organized Religion. I didn't switch to HR as no city is at happy cap (but soon). I also don't see a need for CS just yet. Probabely after Delhi grows some more pop.

- Diplo: Since OR is Sury's favourite civic he's pleased, so is linc. Every AI besides Hamm (cautious) is annoyed.
I strongly suggest switching to NSR and Pagaism (low upkeep!) for 5 turns. Also adopt HR while you switch.

- We should try to hook up as many ressources as possible to trade away. We can get a better price for rice I'm sure (you should be able to cancel that in 1t) and we can also trade away other ressis. We can also trade away silver as we don't really need the happiness. We've got lots of units that can produce happiness with HR.

- Finances: At 0% we make +20gpt so no problem there despite 2 new cities. Reasons are trade routs (sailing!) and a couple of courts (2 or 3) as well as the silver pop. We're fine and can found more cities. One should be near that iron (6E of Delhi) and one near stone (3N6W of Delhi). Once Varanasi's borders pop (soon) I'd also OB with Pacal.

- Vijay needs culture buildings badly, partially to gain its pigs back (this will be hard) and we probabely might be able to eventually flip Izamal (tao holy city doesn't produce culture due to pacal's state religion. I don't count on it but by the looks of it, if we're fast we might manage it.

- A GP is at the current pace (2 scis 1 priest) due in 5. Chances for GS are already 19% so probabely fire 1 or 2.

- Also note that buddhism spread in Varanasi. So we have another rel,igion within our cities.

- Also a number of wonders have been built. Linc got the MoM and Hanging gardens, SoZ was built, GL, Parth, Chicken Pizza (pacal) and probabely more (can't check turnlog. Why is that?? I got another CTD...)

- We should also try to make use of OR and build lots of temples/monasteries. You can build workers, settlers and military while we're in pagaism. BTW I also captured a worker when razing Yue-Chi.

Hope that's all. So far most has worked according to plan


Roster:
mystyfly - just played
r_rolo1
ssmage
Ralph_Jackson - on deck (please tell us how things stand!)
qwertz
ZPVCSPLFUIFDPEF - UP NOW

View attachment ICS3 AD-0001.CivBeyondSwordSave

 

[qwertz]

nice job bringing our eco back on foot . Those TRs and the silver really help a lot.

about the courthouse; I really saw no need for the courthouse at bombay as the upkeep was <2/turn. sorry for no notation, but AFAIK the decay for the buildings starts after 50 turns, so there is no problem with loosing the

 

[mystyfly]

about the courthouse; I really saw no need for the courthouse at bombay as the upkeep was <2/turn. sorry for no notation, but AFAIK the decay for the buildings starts after 50 turns, so there is no problem with loosing the

I'm pretty sure decay begins after 10turns. I agree with courthouse being not needed there but we should've invested a hammer or two after 10 turns. When I built it it cost ~3gpt IIRC so still no real need to finish it. BTW I put one turn into it, switched to settler, forest chop came in, settler whipped for 2pop and the overflow was enought to finish the court in 1t

2 keywonders down, 2 to go!

 

[ssmage]

The courthouse was my , sorry

Anyway, get in line, myst!! no stealing turn sets!!!
Nice getting the confu AP

After paper, we need currency for markets/trade routes, so i would go currency(trade for it)/maths(also trade)/DR/Edu/Philo/lib-take nat/PP/Gun/RP/Rifle or Currency(trade)/maths(trade)/DR/PP/RP/edu/gun/rifle/nat.
The Latter is my favorite, as getting lib first will be very hard.

We gotta run the top of the tree, and back trade con/MC/Machine/engie/fendi/gulids/banking.

If we get a GS, bulb Edu, right?

 

[mystyfly]

^^ Techwise I say:

Tech Paper > CS (hopefully trade) > Philo (trade or bulb) > Edu(bulb) > Lib (eventually bulbed, nationalism. Only tech lib if we have a chance ) > PP (bulb, on the way trade for machinery hopefully) > Banking (trade) > RP > Rifling.
This techpath is very longterm but an attempt to get a better overview.

Once we get a GP, bulb DR

Maths, Currency and calendar should be easily obtainable via trade (we really need to be in NSR for 5t).

We gotta run the top of the tree, and back trade con/MC/Machine/engie/fendi/gulids/banking.

If we get a GS, bulb Edu, right?

Yes and Yes. But GS bulbs philo and paper first.

 

[Zherak_Khan]

Just dropping by to tell I'm reading the thread and like what I'm seeing. I'm somewhat surprised to see you more or less sticking to the variant-handicap - grid is good for settling, but I doubt you can afford mass-razing later on.

Good luck, I'm done with four out of six exams and will free for the summer with new computer somewhere around tenth of June. I will probably not jump in on your game, except as a lurker, but I think I'll probably end up doing some more ICS-SGs, either retries at Deity or just some more complicated variants. Lategame ICS is such a pain.

 

[r_rolo1]

it's me already? :suicide:

Ok, got it and will play tomorrow ( hopefully... exams are closing ). Thoughts to my turnset?

 

[ZPV]

I have gotten back earlier than expected, and can pick it up this evening.

It looks like I have missed a lot, so I'll post a got it and some comments later today

 

[r_rolo1]

Ok, not me then ( saw mysty play and assumed it was me )

My big question is how we use the GP that we get here: remember that we want the SM and that we don't have exactly the monopoly of Theo.... the good ol'bulb vs shrine stuff.. If a AI gets DR before us we can say byebye to SM IMHO.....

 

[mystyfly]

Ok, not me then ( saw mysty play and assumed it was me )

I'm sorry for the confusion and the stolen turns Just had to see whether we get the AP. My set wasn't far away anyway

Considering the construction of SM/USak: Both need stone for double speed which we should get. Vijay, 3N of Delhi, and Agra all have quite a number of forests to be chopped (6,6,7). Maths + stone produces 45 hammers each, both wonders cost 550 hammers. 6 forests are 270 hammers, that's nearly half the hammers needed.

My big question is how we use the GP that we get here: remember that we want the SM and that we don't have exactly the monopoly of Theo.... the good ol'bulb vs shrine stuff.. If a AI gets DR before us we can say byebye to SM IMHO.....

I rarely see the AIs persue DR before lib (that's on immortal). Pacal went kinda religion crazy (judaism, christianity, taoism) so he might've gotten enought and will research another way. I'm all for shrine, for money and slots. C'mon with 1 or 2 priest slots we won't get another GP in a desirable time.

edit: I suggest trading col and theo for everything we get.

 

[ZPV]

OK - got it

@quertz, mystyfly
Nice work bulbing theo and building AP

@Team
I am thinking of:

-settling the stone site ASAP

-starting UoS in Vijayangara (after builing a Conf Monastery for the +)

-trying to rip off the AIs in blatantly unfair trades.

I agree with building a shrine, but I would fire the scientists and grow the capital instead.

If we get a GS I will assess the situation and most likely sit on him (it will only be a few turns). If he comes out squashed I am sorry .

I will check here and play in a few hours.

 

[mystyfly]

-settling the stone site ASAP

I think ironcity (IIRC 3E of delhi) has to be settled first to avoid lincold from settling our cities. But stonecity should be founded soon.

-starting UoS in Vijayangara (after builing a Conf Monastery for the [too lazy to insert smilies...] + )

Definitely.

I agree with building a shrine, but I would fire the scientists and grow the capital instead.

Fine with me. Also increases the chance of GP.

I will check here and play in a few hours.

As I see it everything is discussed, feel free to play.