Is Chicago's handgun ban working?

Originally posted by Neomega

I think every person who thinks it is right to take a piece of peoples lives away because they have a problem with spirngs, chemicals, metal tubes, lead, and hammers deserves nothing short of having their own freedoms taken away. ?

Why don't you call it by its proper name ? A GUN ! Or would you have us refer to anthrax as 'just a few chemicals cobbled together too' ? The thing about guns is that they tend to take more than just 'a piece' of people's lives away.

Originally posted by Neomega

So do I take pleasure in the deaths? Did I even say that? No. So you can take those words back out of my mouth, that you placed just to make your own little argument sound good.

I take pleasure in seeing the gun control argument fail miserably. Now how about a refund to all the people who have been fined and sent to jail for asserting their second amendment right?

The definition of gun control arguments failing by your logic is people getting killed by guns anyway. You take pleasure in gun control arguments failing, so you necessarily cause people to think that you don't mind people getting killed. The logic is inescapable.
You simply cannot wish that the arguments for gun control are proven wrong - you can only argue that the 2nd amendment is more important than what may happen because of it.
 
Here in my state, we have some of the LEAST restrictive gun laws, open carry without permit, cheap and easily obtained concealed carry permits, gun shows, etc.

And even though we had that little bit with the sniper here a couple of weeks ago, the state's crime rate is still one of the lowest in the country (just a couple of years ago, it WAS the lowest, and then it creeped up to like 49th).

Not to mention, we have one of the highest gun ownership rates in the us.
 
Originally posted by jack merchant

You simply cannot wish that the arguments for gun control are proven wrong - you can only argue that the 2nd amendment is more important than what may happen because of it.

No, it is the gun control people who wish their argument is proven right. So too do the right to bear arms camp. I have been watching Chicago on this (and a couple of other constitutional issues) for a while, and have been enraged by the actions of the control freak city council.

So where are all their arguments about a safer Chicago now? It still sucks. Except now responsible adults are being thrown in jail for asserting their second amendment rights. So it sucks even more.

I do wish foir gun control arguments to be proiven wriong, so we can get the love peace and utopia leftists to shut up, and quit trying top control how people enjoy themseleves.
 
The only thing Chicago proves is that in a city where anyone can move in or out and enforcement is impossible, a gun ban won't work. The same argument may apply to the entire USA, I don't know. But enforceability is quite different from desirability, and the fact that people like this can get their hands on a gun in a city like Chicago proves diddly squat about the desirability of gun control.
However, it does provide a lurid illustration of what happens when people like this can get access to guns. But who knows, he might have enjoyed himself :rolleyes:.
 
Originally posted by jack merchant
But enforceability is quite different from desirability,

One is realistic, one is idealistic. One requires laisez faire "live and let live" freedom, and one requires "big brother knows better" totalitarianism.
 
Originally posted by Tassadar
Gun ban will never solve this kind of human's madness, why ?

If its not a gun, then it could be a chainsaw, or a molotov coctail, or a 5 feet scytes, or an artisanal flamethrower.

When you are crazy enough to kill poeple, anyway is good.

It's a lot easier pulling a trigger and letting a bullet do the dirty work than comminting to cutting or slicing someone up.

Most of those other weapons require you to really mean it.
 
Originally posted by Neomega


One is realistic, one is idealistic. One requires laisez faire "live and let live" freedom, and one requires "big brother knows better" totalitarianism.

The point is a gun ban could not work in a single city - whether it could work across a country is another matter.

But the point of gun control advocates is not "big brother knows better" totalitarianism - that's a pretty blatant misrepresentation.
But if preferring not to have nutcases like this get easy access to guns and kill people makes me a totalitarian, then that's what I am. Others can keep their 'freedom' to get shot as far as I'm concerned.
 
Originally posted by jack merchant
The only thing Chicago proves is that in a city where anyone can move in or out and enforcement is impossible, a gun ban won't work. The same argument may apply to the entire USA, I don't know. But enforceability is quite different from desirability, and the fact that people like this can get their hands on a gun in a city like Chicago proves diddly squat about the desirability of gun control.
However, it does provide a lurid illustration of what happens when people like this can get access to guns. But who knows, he might have enjoyed himself :rolleyes:.
yeah quite right. chicago is a crappy example for this issue. there is no gun control. you could just drive out of the city, buy a gun and drive back in. that's pretty stupid. gun control can't be half arsed. and your second amendment is outdated and quite silly :) unless you're worried about the king of england walking into your house and pushing you around :D
 
Originally posted by bobgote
unless you're worried about the king of england walking into your house and pushing you around :D

Not so much the Queen of England as the FBI or ATF a la Ruby Ridge or Waco.
 
ruby ridge? care to enlighten us non americans JR? Was that the Montana episode where they shot the mother and the kids were hold up armed?

if not I can always shoot you *dallas reference*
 
Ruby Ridge was Idaho. The Montana episode you reference is Jordan, Montana, another infamous case of government overreaching. Ruby Ridge was a prequel to Waco - government agents surrounding a gun happy family instead of nabbing the alleged culprit in a less violent, but possible manner. The government ended up killing the man's wife.

My nick has triple meaning, one of them being a reference to JR Ewing since I am from Dallas. Try to shoot me and I'll give you the same treatment that my town gave JFK - knocking the Im off your nick.
 
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