Is this the end of liberalism?

[gay_Aleks]

It seems they have enough WMDs to shoot themselves in the foot for the last 12 years.

 

[abradley]

It seems they have enough WMDs to shoot themselves in the foot for the last 12 years.

If you say so.

 

[gay_Aleks]

I don't see any other explanation for Trump.

 

[Rashiminos]

'Trump, sponsored by Disney Presidential Services.'

 

[gay_Aleks]

You're laughing, but one day Walt Disney will emerge from his cryogenic chamber, and he'll say.

"Good. Good. My dream is done."

 

[aelf]

I like how this thread is going.

Anyway, end of liberalism? Sure, bring it. Either a more radical left-wing would take its place or reactionary forces would dominate for a while and ensure a huge backlash that would be liable to create a more radical left-wing.

Doubt liberalism is ending, though.

 

[BvBPL]

4 pages and we have not discussed what actually happened. That's what happens with an OP with nothing other than YouTube videos without any explanation I suppose.

Yale sent out an email asking people to not dress up in, basically, racist costumes for Halloween. They specifically cited blackface, for instance. Since many colleges have been embarrassed by stupid kids dressing up in pretty offensive Halloween costumes before. Then, another professor complained about that email and sort of said hey kids are kids let them be offensive if they want, and anyway does it really matter? (Paraphrasing). And that set the campus on fire apparently.

I think it's warranted on the one hand to sort of roll your eyes at Yale's "please be nice kids" memorandum, while on the other hand be upset that a professor flippantly characterizes costumes like "blackface" as sort of "all in good fun, young kids make mistakes" stuff.

This would be an actually interesting topic to discuss. Pity that the topic would have to be split from its own thread in order to be discussed.

The proliferation of threads that have been started with initial posts bare of much else other than quotes from others or videos is a frustration. It leads, not inevitably but frequently, to threads that might be about interesting topics to die on the vine. People who start threads have a responsibility to this community to provide some form of discussion points within the thread.

 

[Synobun]

it's okay to be gay, you know.

Absolutely. I don't think fear of being watched in the bathroom is tied to sexual orientation, personally. I'm mostly just trying to highlight that abradley's reason for not wanting uni-gender bathrooms is a little ridiculous and is made much more clear when pressed on, given that his justifications are just sarcastic retorts.

This thread, in general, is doomed to fail as it has no clear direction yet possesses a deep bias against an entire demographic. The most I can muster here is nitpicking silly convictions by the people posting within it.

 

[Hygro]

Here's why you don't mandate universal gender inclusive bathrooms: nightclubs. Straight-people meat market nightclubs.

For all other venues, including even bars and about-the-music dance clubs, who gives a [poo]

 

[Synobun]

Here's why you don't mandate universal gender inclusive bathrooms: nightclubs. Straight-people meat market nightclubs.

For all other venues, including even bars and about-the-music dance clubs, who gives a [poo]

Is that really a deterrent, though? I don't think people looking to bang are going to care about the sign on the door very much.

 

[Hygro]

Is that really a deterrent, though? I don't think people looking to bang are going to care about the sign on the door very much.

I don't know what you mean so let me clarify: the purpose is to have a recharge-and-regroup spot for you and your homeys. The women get the same. This division is generally respected. Sometimes a girl ends up in the guys' bathroom. Usually no one cares.

 

[Synobun]

I don't know what you mean so let me clarify: the purpose is to have a recharge-and-regroup spot for you and your homeys. The women get the same. This division is generally respected. Sometimes a girl ends up in the guys' bathroom. Usually no one cares.

Sorry, I took your comment as discouraging people sexing it up in the club bathrooms. Meat market and all that jazz. Cool beans. I'm not opposed to uni-gender or gender segregated bathrooms, either/or are acceptable to me. As such, I don't have a particular opinion about your clarification since I'm indifferent to which way the wind blows on that front.

 

[sophie]

Sorry, I took your comment as discouraging people sexing it up in the club bathrooms. Meat market and all that jazz. Cool beans. I'm not opposed to uni-gender or gender segregated bathrooms, either/or are acceptable to me. As such, I don't have a particular opinion about your clarification since I'm indifferent to which way the wind blows on that front.

As someone who's cleaned bathrooms for a living: bring on the unisex bathrooms. Urinals are disgusting and a pain in the ass to clean. Women's bathrooms don't have enough stalls. Hell converting both sides to unisex makes cleaning during busy hours WAY easier.

 

[Hygro]

Nooooo I love urinals.

edit: meat market, not meat restaurant you bring 'em home/get brought home.

 

[abradley]

And a Left's view of "Is this the end of liberalism?".

MAY 2, 2014
The Intellectual Dead End of Liberalism
by PETE DOLACK
http://www.counterpunch.org/2014/05/02/the-intellectual-dead-end-of-liberalism/


The vacuous concept of the “third way” having degenerated into neoliberal idolatry, modern liberalism has reached its end. Sweeping pronouncements are ordinarily to be avoided, but the ongoing revelations of not only the Obama administration’s extraordinary spying campaign but Democratic Party leaders marching in lockstep with Republicans to celebrate it ought to be the coup de grâce.

{Snip}

The Obama Administration’s Record

Liberalism has ceased to possess ideas, however much individual liberals may yearn for alternatives. A partial list of Obama administration “achievements” makes for depressing reading:

*Not simply keeping the Guantánamo Bay gulag open but force-feeding prisoners (torture by any realistic standard).

*Stepping up the war against dissent through violent suppression of the Occupy movement organized by the Department of Homeland Security, waves of arrests and harassment of anarchists in the Pacific Northwest and harsh reprisals against government whistleblowers, among other offensives.

*Widespread collection of telephone calls.

*The gargantuan collection of personal information from online communications.

*A president arrogating to himself the right to unilaterally kill people anywhere in the world, without a pretense of legal procedure.

*A continual weakening of women’s fundamental rights to control their own bodies, often by making unilateral capitulations to Republican demands before negotiating.

*A total failure to reign in “too big to fail” banks and a total failure to prosecute any financial industry executive for the chicanery that precipitated the financial collapse of 2008 and the ongoing stagnation.

*Unquestioning acceptance of financial industry perspectives on economic matters.

*Elevation of corporate maximization of profits above all other human considerations, embodied in a steady stream of one-sided trade agreements, the most dangerous one yet the Trans-Pacific Partnership being negotiated in secrecy.

Let’s not pin this on the personality of one person. Each fresh outrage by the Obama administration is met by a shrug of the shoulders or outright support by Democrats. They are nearly unanimous in their approval of the National Security Agency. They are already united behind policies that exist, regardless of the ideology attached to them, to funnel ever more wealth upward. These two tendencies are not independent of one another.

There are various reasons that can be assigned as to the cause of the Democratic Party’s — and, thus, liberalism’s — steady march rightward: Dependence on corporate money, corruption, domination of the mass media by the Right, philosophical and economic myopia, cowardliness. Although these factors form a significant portion of the answer to the puzzle, an underlying cause has to be found in the exhaustion of North American liberalism. Similar to European social democracy, it is trapped by a fervent desire to stabilize an unstable capitalist system.

The political and intellectual leaders of liberalism believe they can discover the magic reforms that will make it all work again. They do have criticisms, even if they are afraid of saying them too loud, but are hamstrung by their belief in the capitalist system, which means, today, a belief in neoliberalism and austerity, no matter what nice speeches they may make.

The Right, on the other hand, ...

Looks like nobody's happy.

 

[JollyRoger]

I get confused by some of our resident righties. Sometimes they claim that liberalism is taking over and stealing their freedom and manhood. Then they turn around and say liberalism is dead. Can I get an explanation that doesn't involve 40 hours of Youtube of 300 pages of a book?

 

[abradley]

I get confused by some of our resident righties. Sometimes they claim that liberalism is taking over and stealing their freedom and manhood. Then they turn around and say liberalism is dead. Can I get an explanation that doesn't involve 40 hours of Youtube of 300 pages of a book?

Liberalism is stealing our freedom and manhood plus Liberalism is dying.

And on top of that, here's a 10 page cartoon download.

 

[JollyRoger]

We have had 40 page threads mocking that nonsense.

 

[useless]

I get confused by some of our resident righties. Sometimes they claim that liberalism is taking over and stealing their freedom and manhood. Then they turn around and say liberalism is dead. Can I get an explanation that doesn't involve 40 hours of Youtube of 300 pages of a book?

Ur-Fascism dictates that the "enemy" is simultainously all-powerful yet on the verge of constant defeat...

 

[Cutlass]

Liberalism is stealing our freedom and manhood plus Liberalism is dying.

And on top of that, here's a 10 page cartoon download.

Liberalism may have been critically wounded by conservatism, but they remain the only people who are fighting for freedom, rather than against it. Conservatism is inherently opposed to freedom. That's just what conservatism is.