Jobs & Homeless

[MaXimillionZero]

• How will massive cities work with unemployment, will there be enough scalable sources of employment available?
• How will specialists be counted?
• Why is this mechanic even necessary when limited tiles and specialist slots (except with certain civics) already limit the amount of people who can work in a city?
• Can you pull it off in a way that will be transparent and fun to play, not just to code?

 

[Hydromancerx]

I saw this in the civpedia. This this already implemented? Or did someone just make it in advance?

 

[Faustmouse]

I THINK this may refer to the early Coal Powerplant that "employs" one citizen.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Hmm interesting.

EDIT: Found the code.

<iNumPopulationEmployed>1</iNumPopulationEmployed>

I wonder what determines the population. If its by the city size number or what.

 

[Nimek]

This tag and pedia page comes from Affores AND times. I think that was his project that he didnt finish.

 

[Sgtslick]

Unemployment (+) = + and -

Not Enough Workers (-) = - and -

I particularly like the - for not enough workers, perhaps certain buildings require a certain level of employment (like wonders & high hammer costing buildings). Or even just an increase in the - penalty for certain things that require a large labour force to pull off. Either way this property would definitely fit nicely in the industrious trait

 

[Thunderbrd]

Hmm interesting.

EDIT: Found the code.

<iNumPopulationEmployed>1</iNumPopulationEmployed>

I wonder what determines the population. If its by the city size number or what.

This would be quite different to what you're intending here in that it takes an actual population and sets it to working the building thus taking it away from the pool of specialists/tiles worked available to the city.

 

[bill2505]

can i ask something. how are you going to add homeless without adding my idea about population flamability like

 

[Hydromancerx]

This would be quite different to what you're intending here in that it takes an actual population and sets it to working the building thus taking it away from the pool of specialists/tiles worked available to the city.

Which population? The actual population or the city size population. Such as If A city is size 5 would 1 mean it uses 1 of 5 or one of thousands of people?

 

[Thunderbrd]

Game population. If you have a city of pop size 5, 1 of those population pts are dedicated to working the building that you built that uses that tag to 'employ' 1 population. Your proposed mechanic would be coming at things from a differing angle I think, not incompatible, just different. A lot of use of this tag could be helpful in reducing the volume of GPs and city effectiveness perhaps.

 

[Hydromancerx]

So do you think more buildings should have this tag? Also it says if it lacks enough population it will shut down. Hows it determine which building? Or do ALL buildings shut down if you do not have enough population?

 

[Thunderbrd]

Good question that last one. I don't know.

I'd say any building that requires a lot of workers could/should employ. In the early game it could be quickly imbalancing but later... probably not a bad idea to select some more. Maybe the Castle should employ one. Are the admin buildings employing yet? We'd discussed that before... don't think we ever came up with an answer on that.

I can see harbors using them. Again... anything that would employ a lot of people in general.

 

[bill2505]

Game population. If you have a city of pop size 5, 1 of those population pts are dedicated to working the building that you built that uses that tag to 'employ' 1 population. Your proposed mechanic would be coming at things from a differing angle I think, not incompatible, just different. A lot of use of this tag could be helpful in reducing the volume of GPs and city effectiveness perhaps.

yeah but city population that exist now is not the real population. and if you have buildings require jobs then you have to do that for all buildings to require jobs and there are too much building now for the vanilla population mechanic.
plus you will have the imbalance of a prehistoric buildin cost 1 while a industria one that employs thousands of men cost only 1 or two

 

[Faustmouse]

So do you think more buildings should have this tag? Also it says if it lacks enough population it will shut down. Hows it determine which building? Or do ALL buildings shut down if you do not have enough population?

Please don't!
I really HATE this tag and I NEVER build buildings that use it currently. If you add it to more buildings please make it optional. However, I do like the proposed idea with the properties.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Yeah the more I learn about this "code artifact" the more I think the property system would work better. I am just surprised I never noticed it until now.

 

[Thunderbrd]

I don't think its a suitable replacement for the property as you've proposed it, no. C2C does, however, have a lot of population in its cities, so I can see some select buildings using the tag. Just keep in mind, if used, it, as mentioned by others, would make that building have a very major detractor. So the building really has to be worth it.

 

[Koshling]

I don't think its a suitable replacement for the property as you've proposed it, no. C2C does, however, have a lot of population in its cities, so I can see some select buildings using the tag. Just keep in mind, if used, it, as mentioned by others, would make that building have a very major detractor. So the building really has to be worth it.

cough! Metropolitan Administration. cough! (though only when you need them to work the third ring, so I guess that's awkward since its game option dependent)

 

[Thunderbrd]

Since those admin buildings give a free specialist in return, I'd suggest making all of them take a population. I also have some further concepts as to how they could become absolutely necessary to have in your cities.

Ports, Airports, Marketplace buildings, Castles... anything that employes a lot of people should be considered for that tag. Of course, with consideration for usual population levels in the building's era.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

I really hate this fixation on population. The city I live in is the nation's capital but it is not very big. It has all these buildings you lot say can't be in a city the size it is!

I am already using the admin buildings as requirements in my mods because I reckon it is more the organizational level (and wealth) of the city not the population that determines what buildings it has.

 

[Thunderbrd]

I'm not talking about population requirements here. In your city, what percentage of the people there are employed to work at the airport? How many of them are thus NOT leading engineers, priests, merchants etc...? Seems to me, if nobody decided they would work at the airport, the airport would shut down. That's what the employing population mechanic can simulate and careful use of it can help to bring some balance back to C2C's lategame pop 200+ cities again.

I'm not a big fan of population requirements either because mostly what it translates to ingame are those 'holy crap how did I suddenly get all these new buildings I need to build?' moments. But I'm ok with it.