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Jon Shafer leaves Firaxis!

Discussion in 'Civ5 - General Discussions' started by Windsor, Dec 21, 2010.

  1. Adhesive86

    Adhesive86 Warlord

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    For me, they desperately need to move away from the superficial Civ Rev style approach (others can probably articulate that better, but you know what I mean).

    Apart from the fact that I personally don't like it, the economics sucks.

    Here we have one of the largest and most ardent fanbases of any game. I, like many others, would have paid 5x what I did for Civ 4 for quality DLC content additions and this would provide a massive revenue stream from core gamers. MY investment would probably work out really really cheap - since I have no problem spending £50 on a night out, this seems personally reasonable to spend the same amount on content which i can play regularly.

    Instead, we have a series which was already towards the top of the popular charts attempt to be dumbed down in a 'populist' move which likely didn't really get too many more sales and also turned off the existing fanbase from paying for lots of additional content.

    Firaxis/2k, if you are listening... get that deep playing feeling, 1 more turn feeling back, and you'll find that this is a better way to drive your revenues. £5, 5Euro, $7 or whatever is not alot of money to pay out many times over for content which is provided for a deep game that we love to play. However, 'casual' gamers do not want to pay for this stuff. And hardcore gamers refuse out of principle when the game is dumbed down.

    I read somewhere that WoW gets most of its revenues from the 10% most harcore gamers. Whilst we'd obviously all prefer things to be free, most of us would happily pay more for a quality, deep 'hardcore' game, than have to put up with Civ Rev/dumb/whatever. This still works out as a cheap hobby... my girlfriend cost me over £100 on drinking, eating, going out last night. I could have every civ invented DLC for that, forever ;)
     
  2. Babri

    Babri Emperor

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    First they fired some members in Firaxis & now Shafer leaves. Interesting... :hmm:
     
  3. Pouakai

    Pouakai It belongs in a museum. Moderator

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    I honestly wouldn't be suprised if this is because of the constant 'Gar I hate ciV!!!' Comments.
     
  4. fantsu

    fantsu Prince

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    After these last few months I'm already calmed down from the fact that I spent $50 to this game, now I'm waiting civ6 and I really don't care where this game goes.
    I see this as an great opportunity for Firaxis to create something new and get an fresh start.


    What is even more bothering is that now people feel pity for Jon and the Firaxis. They don't realize that is only the first step on a long road of punishment they should receive after the release of ciV. All the mistakes must be explained, and the perpetrators must be found and treat like they deserve.
     
  5. SammyKhalifa

    SammyKhalifa Deity

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    See, this is what I mean. You have absolutely no idea what was actually happening behind the scenes. For all any of us know, Jon was championing the cause of making the game better for all of us and was shot down at every turn. For all we know he grew tired of being handcuffed by the distributor and decided to leave.
     
  6. fantsu

    fantsu Prince

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    Nah, no-one of us does. ;)

    Sometimes you need one turn of Anarchy!!! to get things go in the better way.
    :)
     
  7. bryanw1995

    bryanw1995 Emperor

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    I have a buddy who is a computer programmer and around jon's age. I think that it's very likely that he had significant conflict with upper management and decided that he would take a very large reputation hit if he didn't leave. many here already complain about him, but in my experience it's much more likely that 2k was pushing him to adhere to an arbitrary time schedule and he was pushing to make the game "finished" or at least "more finished". I think that the patch has improved a lot of areas, I just hope that they don't radically change the game now that he's gone.
     
  8. Gismo

    Gismo Chieftain

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    As long as we don't know who is taking over it's hard to say if this helps CiV to become what most expected it to be from the start.

    However, this makes me feel hope again.
     
  9. SuperJay

    SuperJay Bending Space and Time

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    Really??

    You honestly believe that a talented developer like Jon would toss over years of experience at a studio like Firaxis because some people on an Internet forum got mad about a video game??

    Give the guy a bit more credit, and give your fellow Civ fans a little less credit. We're not THAT powerful.. :lol:
     
  10. bryanw1995

    bryanw1995 Emperor

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    soren johnson left firaxis about 16 mos after cIV released, only 3 months before bts came out. this could be a very bad sign for ciV, unless they have somebody waiting in the wings to keep the ship moving in the current (better) direction we might not see many more changes/updates/patches/expansions/etc. only good thing for you naysayers (and of course the rest of us as well) is that they could already be starting on civ 6. I think I'll call it ciVI. or maybe cVI.
     
  11. cccv

    cccv King

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    Dang, man, they didn't commit war crimes.

    Well, thanks for the patch, Jon. Will definitely be interesting to see what direction the xpacs take, if there are to be any. And I hope there's at least one more "big patch" after this, but we'll see.
     
  12. SammyKhalifa

    SammyKhalifa Deity

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    Haha, maybe. I think there are some pretty cool ideas in CivV and I hope they don't just pull the plug and instead just build, improve, polish. We'll see I guess.
     
  13. bonafide11

    bonafide11 Worker

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    I'm sure someone will step up and replace him and they'll continue to work on Civ V. There's still too much to add to the game (and money to be made) for them to just end it now.
     
  14. hardcore_gamer

    hardcore_gamer King

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    The link the OP gave outright states that he left on his own.
     
  15. Pouakai

    Pouakai It belongs in a museum. Moderator

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    Yes, but someone can say they chose to jump off a cliff, they don't mention the person holding a gun to their head.
     
  16. bryanw1995

    bryanw1995 Emperor

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    maybe you could take them all out with a candlestick in the library Dr Holmes. fortunately for them, they are not graded on how much you like/dislike them, but rather on sales #'s. sales have been good in spite of all the hate, so they'll be fine.

    I think I'll start a poll for who should be the lead for cVI.
     
  17. SuperJay

    SuperJay Bending Space and Time

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    This is a minor detail, but please don't refer to me as a "naysayer." Preferably not one of any homogenous, vague glob of players, either. Those don't exist, as much as we all love to categorize one another as "haters" or "fanboys".

    Going back to the news about Jon's departure... again, I wish him well and I hope he finds a place where he'll be successful in the future. And again: I don't think we should be too concerned with the private details of Jon's personal life. We're here to discuss the game itself, and what (if any) impact Jon's departure could have on its future.

    For better or worse, I think Jon's departure may be a setback to the ongoing development of Civ5. As much as he gets villified, his absence means having to fill the role of lead designer with another developer, one who (presumably) isn't as familiar with the design and development of Civ5 (as a software project) as Jon is. Whether you like Jon or not, I think it's hard to deny that his departure will leave a void that's going to be hard to fill with someone who has the same degree of understanding and familiarity with Civ5. In the long run, it could mean a new direction for Civ5, but in the short-term, it might mean a longer wait between patches or patches that are less robust. It may also mean AI fixes (to the degree those are even possible) take longer to get released.
     
  18. Jmyrm

    Jmyrm Chieftain

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    I haven't been playing Civ nearly as long as some of you guys in the 'old guard', i started with IV. I enjoyed IV, and reading what I have about earlier installments let me say this;

    I'm not going to comment on if this is good or bad, or the content of Jon's character. CiV tried something new, sometimes experiments don't work out and the old saying 'if it aint broke..." applies and in this case maybe it does. But how often can you go back to the well with the same product give or take a feature here and there? Would you really have bought civ5 if it was civ4 with cleaner graphics, and hexes instead of squares?

    The lovely thing about not having to deliver is you can be right about which features need changing and not be responsible for them. At least we got a new experience and weren't milked for the faithful fanbase we are, sold the same goods with a new package.

    Jmyrm
     
  19. Skwink

    Skwink FRIIIIIIIIIITZ

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    Three words: What the heck?
     
  20. shadowplay

    shadowplay (boss music)

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    I wish. :D
     

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