Khmer is OP.

[earlofbrigand]

Massively overpowered for what they have done in real life. There's no way they should be able to stand toe to toe with China.. ever.

 

[Vargas1]

Massively overpowered for what they have done in real life. There's no way they should be able to stand toe to toe with China.. ever.

That's...sort of the point of the game, isn't it? It would look awfully different if civ abilities were based on how dominant the civs were in real life.

 

[Hellenism Salesman]

Massively overpowered for what they have done in real life. There's no way they should be able to stand toe to toe with China.. ever.

I can understand the want for historical accuracy, but...

America starts in the ancient era. Massively unrealistic for when they started in real life. There's no way they should be able to stand toe to toe with Sumer... ever.

Canada has tundra bonuses despite being most of their country being in taiga. Massively incorrect for their location in real life. There's no way they should occupy the same terrain type as Russia... ever.

Infantry uses Oil for maintenance. Massively unrealistic for their weaponry in real life. There's no way they should use the same resource as tanks... ever.

...and I think you get my point.

Civ is based in history, yes. It follows the historical progression of eras, yes. But it is not a history simulator. It is an alternate history simulator. There are inaccuracies, yes, but that's part of the appeal, isn't it? I know I wouldn't have nearly as much fun with Civ if I couldn't watch reverse history scenarios like Persia conquering Macedon or colonial Vietnam.

A civ's power level isn't supposed to reflect anything about their debatable real-life power level. It's just supposed to be the abilities that tie into their historical background while being the most fun. If one civ is ludicrously overpowered in comparison to the others, that's a balancing issue, not a historical one. The devs' vision for the game is to have a roster of equally-powered civs... they're not going to make one stronger than another for the sake of debatable historical significance.

 

[PSG]

Massively overpowered for what they have done in real life. There's no way they should be able to stand toe to toe with China.. ever.

It's about the potential of a civ rather than how "successful" a civ has been.

On a side note has anybody else tried out Tundra Khmer?

 

[agonistes]

Russia has been considered the top civ (or very near it) since the game came out...

Possible. But I recall a few top ten lists early on that ranked Russia pretty low - or much lower than they deserved.

 

[Zaarin]

Canada has tundra bonuses despite being most of their country being in taiga. Massively incorrect for their location in real life.

To quibble, most of what Civ6 calls "Snow" is Tundra and most of what Civ6 calls Tundra is Taiga (complete with forests).

There's no way they should occupy the same terrain type as Russia...

I mean, they're roughly the same latitudes, and the majority of Russians, like the majority of Canadians, don't live in the tundra or even the taiga.

 

[Hellenism Salesman]

I mean, they're roughly the same latitudes, and the majority of Russians, like the majority of Canadians, don't live in the tundra or even the taiga.

Ah, maybe not. But I needed a comparison for comparison's sake.

And out of the two of them, it somehow feels much more applicable to call Russia the land of the harsh, cold tundra, rather than good old Canada, even if it truly doesn't fit either of them.

 

[Zaarin]

Ah, maybe not. But I needed a comparison for comparison's sake.

And out of the two of them, it somehow feels much more applicable to call Russia the land of the harsh, cold tundra, rather than good old Canada, even if it truly doesn't fit either of them.

I agree with your post in spirit even if I quibble with the details.

 

[Menocchio]

I mean, they're roughly the same latitudes, and the majority of Russians, like the majority of Canadians, don't live in the tundra or even the taiga.

If only! Saint Petersburg lies at a latitude of just under 60 degrees, and Moscow at 55 degrees. In comparison, Toronto is at 43 degrees latitude, and Vancouver 49 degrees. The vast majority of the Canadian population lives well away from anything you could call taiga, as opposed to the opposite for Russia. For all the hardy winter stereotypes and lumberjack-isms, most Canadians live in quite fair agricultural regions where even grapes can grow.

 

[Zaarin]

If only! Saint Petersburg lies at a latitude of just under 60 degrees, and Moscow at 55 degrees. In comparison, Toronto is at 43 degrees latitude, and Vancouver 49 degrees. The vast majority of the Canadian population lives well away from anything you could call taiga, as opposed to the opposite for Russia. For all the hardy winter stereotypes and lumberjack-isms, most Canadians live in quite fair agricultural regions where even grapes can grow.

I freely admit geography is not my best subject, but in my defense I did say roughly the same latitudes.

 

[PSG]

I am thinking that they gave Canada the tundra farm ability because of their extensive use of hot houses but Manitoba is their true bread basket.

 

[Menocchio]

I am thinking that they gave Canada the tundra farm ability because of their extensive use of hot houses but Manitoba is their true bread basket.

"Last Best West" (the name of Wilfrid Laurier's ability in-game) was a program to entice immigrants to central Canada, more or less a similar incentive to the American Homestead Acts. Of course, as frigid as Alberta and Saskatchewan can be, by and large these Laurier-era immigrants settled in steppe-like prairies which support agriculture well despite a short growing season. As it turned out, though, most of the people who took up the promises of the Last Best West were Volga Germans, Ukrainians, and Poles - not exactly the Anglo-Scottish cohort the government was hoping for.

 

[PSG]

"Last Best West" (the name of Wilfrid Laurier's ability in-game) was a program to entice immigrants to central Canada, more or less a similar incentive to the American Homestead Acts. Of course, as frigid as Alberta and Saskatchewan can be, by and large these Laurier-era immigrants settled in steppe-like prairies which support agriculture well despite a short growing season. As it turned out, though, most of the people who took up the promises of the Last Best West were Volga Germans, Ukrainians, and Poles - not exactly the Anglo-Scottish cohort the government was hoping for.

There is a reason why it's called "Edmondchuk"..... It's very odd driving up through Montana into Calgary.

 

[MarigoldRan]

"I've played this game for a long time. There's no way you can have this much. If you're getting 100 science per turn and 150 faith per turn in classical, there's no way you can have the military."

-Roman player after going all in and losing against Khmer with work ethic.

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

While I would love for this to be true, I need more than simple quotations to believe this is real. Do you have any evidence to support that this happened? Any screenshots?

 

[MarigoldRan]

Should have taken it. But no. The irony is that the host banned Russia, Hamm, Australia and Kupe. But DIDN'T ban Khmer or work ethic.

 

[Vargas1]

Didn't you make the same post about how OP Khmer was a few weeks ago? And had plenty of counterpoints raised in that post? I guess if you're in a game that's banning certain civs, then Khmer might make sense to put on the ban list - they're definitely in the upper-tier of civs. But for MP I wouldn't put them dramatically above Aztec, Babylon, Brazil (sacred path + work ethic lol), Ethiopia, Korea, Portugal, Russia, Vietnam, Zulu in terms of power.

 

[Archon_Wing]

Yea they should really ban work ethic.

Not sure how it's been nerfed.

Khmer is pretty good anyways.

 

[Vargas1]

Yea they should really ban work ethic.

Not sure how it's been nerfed.

Khmer is pretty good anyways.

Work ethic should just apply to standard adjacencies - mountains, natural wonders, and trees. That would make it useful but not overpowered. Where it’s broken is applying to terrain adjacencies - sacred path or dance of the aurora, Australia’s bonus for breathtaking, Khmer river bonus, etc.

 

[Archon_Wing]

Work ethic should just apply to standard adjacencies - mountains, natural wonders, and trees. That would make it useful but not overpowered. Where it’s broken is applying to terrain adjacencies - sacred path or dance of the aurora, Australia’s bonus for breathtaking, Khmer river bonus, etc.

Probably simpler to make 50% of adjacency.

And also buff the other beliefs.