Kill Bill

[Enkidu Warrior]

Originally posted by superslug
While I don't think Tarantino's films exhibit racism towards Asians, his nonblack/white characters are a bit stereotypical.

All of his characters are stereotypical, that's just the nature of his films.

 

[Norlamand]

Curt this is the weakest argument you have ever offered (that I have seen or read). While I find the antics of Thurmans character silly, I don't agree with the racist claim. The most powerful martial artist in the movie was Chinese and clearly her superior at every turn. If Vivica A. Fox had held the starring role, rather than supporting, would you have still claimed it was racist?

 

[superslug]

Originally posted by Enkidu Warrior
All of his characters are stereotypical, that's just the nature of his films.

I disagree. I could relate to something deeper than stereotype about Michael Madsen's character in Kill Bill, as well as Uma Thurman's, as a former parent. Not all of his characters are stereotyped...but all of the Asians and some of the Blacks are...

 

[CurtSibling]

Originally posted by MrPresident
A film is a film is a film. You can't judge certain films differently because of where they happen to be made. A film can be racist if it is made in Hong Kong, Hollywood, or Bollywood. You simply have ducked out of the difficult question. What is the difference between what Tarantino is doing and what Jackie Chan is doing? Because the only difference I can see is that Tarantino is white (and therefore racist against Asians) but Jackie Chan is not (and therefore isn't racist against Asians).

Maybe you answered the question in a certain manner.

I previously made my opinion - if you don't like it, well tough cheese.

I don't leap up like the deferential peasant, just because
'MrWhiteCliff of Dover' wishes to run his own private version of 'Question Time.'

I don't answer on demand, just remember that - So be glad I am bothering now.

It is a movie for whites of the anti-Asian mindset, happy?

 

[CurtSibling]

Originally posted by Norlamand
Curt this is the weakest argument you have ever offered (that I have seen or read). While I find the antics of Thurmans character silly, I don't agree with the racist claim. The most powerful martial artist in the movie was Chinese and clearly her superior at every turn. If Vivica A. Fox had held the starring role, rather than supporting, would you have still claimed it was racist?

I had no idea my arguments were of such interest.

Anyway:
I assume Vivica A. Fox is black then?

Ow, I am really caught in the jaws of your fiendish moral quandry.....Not.

I would still level the charge that it is a Westerner put up against the 'evil' Asians.

 

[Norlamand]

Originally posted by CurtSibling

That about sums up the merits of your case. Case dismissed.

 

[Enkidu Warrior]

Originally posted by superslug
I disagree. I could relate to something deeper than stereotype about Michael Madsen's character in Kill Bill, as well as Uma Thurman's, as a former parent. Not all of his characters are stereotyped...but all of the Asians and some of the Blacks are...

OK, maybe I was being a bit simplistic. Uma's character is based on an established character from an old film ("the Bride"). Many of Tarantino's characters are heavily derivative of characters from old cult films. That is the nature of his films. This also leads in some cases to highly stereotypical characters.

 

[CurtSibling]

Originally posted by Norlamand
That about sums up the merits of your case. Case dismissed.

The "rolleyes" was a swipe to your shameless race card-playing.

I am a strong anti-racist - Hence the whole crux of my argument!

So I hope you don't dare you accuse me of racism!

 

[Norlamand]

Originally posted by CurtSibling
The "rolleyes" was a swipe to your shameless race card-playing.

I am a strong anti-racist - Hence the whole crux of my argument!

So I hope you don't dare you accuse me of racism!

My race card playing? Perhaps someone else here can help me remember who injected the race issue into this thread? Hmmmm.

I think you need to iron the wrinkles out of your tinfoil hat there my boy. Your reception is a bit off.

 

[CurtSibling]

*yawn*

Whatever.

You are obviously unwilling to entertain that movies project the writer or director's bias with them.

I suppose 'Passion of Christ' was made by an Atheist?

Sure it was -

 

[andrewgprv]

Curtsibling I would say that you are way off base here.

The arch villan and other villans are white.

It just so happens that the protagonist is white.

Other chracters happen to be asian or black.

I have only seen volume 1 but I think it protrayed a positive image of Japan. The whole movie is about a warrior's honor! Can we say Samuri?

 

[superslug]

Originally posted by Enkidu Warrior
OK, maybe I was being a bit simplistic. Uma's character is based on an established character from an old film ("the Bride"). Many of Tarantino's characters are heavily derivative of characters from old cult films. That is the nature of his films. This also leads in some cases to highly stereotypical characters.

I'm not saying Tarantino's characters are original by any means, they're really not. It's just in the case of whites and blacks, they're presented in slightly original ways. That tops Hollywood by a long shot, but it does nothing for the yellows, greens, greys, etc, etc, etc, etc....

 

[Norlamand]

Originally posted by CurtSibling
*yawn*

Whatever.

You are obviously unwilling to entertain that movies project the writer or director's bias with them.

I suppose 'Passion of Christ' was made by an Atheist?

Sure it was -

More evidence, less tripe please!

 

[CurtSibling]

@andrewgprv:

I can say 'Samurai'.

I would also say the target audience (being the USA) are unlikely to find fault with this movie.

Same as Private Ryan and U571 are seen as realistic historic documents in America also.

 

[CurtSibling]

Originally posted by Norlamand
More evidence, less tripe please!

I have made my opinion - based on my own to eyes.

If you have a problem with it, well - convince me otherwise.

 

[superslug]

Originally posted by andrewgprv
It just so happens that the protagonist is white.

Other chracters happen to be asian or black.

I respect Curt too much to seem like I'm jumping on his coattail, but I think he's got an interesting point. My take on it is that aside from Madsen, all the "bad guys" are minorities....black, Asian, women (Hannah), etc, etc...

 

[CurtSibling]

I am glad Superslug can see what I mean!

Looks like Political Correctness-fixation got to the rest of you, sadly.

 

[Norlamand]

I don't argue that Tarantino couldn't be anti-asian. I just disagree with you that this movie makes a convincing case. Without a clear pattern of offensive stereotyping or some other convincing evidence I would just say the movie is silly, not racist.

 

[CurtSibling]

You are fully welcome to say that.

And I say the movie is racist.

Where do we go from there?

 

[superslug]

Originally posted by CurtSibling
I am glad Superslug can see what I mean!

Indeed. I saw no genuine "bad guys" in Pulp Fiction, Reservoir Dogs or even Tarantino's little bit in Foor Rooms, but I didn't really spot anyone outside of Whites/Blacks with more than token dialogue either.