Lack of Later Era Units??

[Magil]

I can live with fewer tiers, if there is another unrevealed mechanic which enhances units over time. Can we still expect mechanics that are not revealed and mentioned yet?

We know that it's possible to combine same-type units into corps and armies but as of now I don't think anyone knows exactly how it works.

 

[Kouvb593kdnuewnd]

There is civic cards which may give boost to your units then used.

 

[stealth_nsk]

I can live with fewer tiers, if there is another unrevealed mechanic which enhances units over time.

That would negate the whole idea of units living reasonable longer.

i have a question to those complaining about lack of units - which speed you're playing on? IMHO, on Standard Speed Civ6 number of tiers seems just right.

 

[Hakan-i Cihan]

We know that it's possible to combine same-type units into corps and armies but as of now I don't think anyone knows exactly how it works.

Thanks for the answer, but I did knew that already. I meant could there be a mechanic related to units (or any mechanic) which wouldn't be even mentioned yet. Would it be marketingwise smart to not mention of some mechanics which will be in the game? I mean the hidden agendas and unstacking cities were mentioned "abusivly" in the marketing/interview videos.

 

[Hakan-i Cihan]

i have a question to those complaining about lack of units - which speed you're playing on? IMHO, on Standard Speed Civ6 number of tiers seems just right.

I play Marathon and sometimes modify it to play with even slower speeds.

That would negate the whole idea of units living reasonable longer.

Definitly not, well at least not as what I have in mind. It should enhance the whole line and you don't need to upgrade the unit. See it as global promotions gained for the whole line, but way less powerful as compared to a unit upgrade.

 

[Matthew.]

One thing to consider, whether we like it or not: Most of the focus will be on the first half of the game. That is just how it is, it is what people first see and play and that is what they wanted polished. If there are any holes or gaps, they will be filled in later with DLC.

 

[stealth_nsk]

I play Marathon and sometimes modify it to play with even slower speeds

Well, it explains the problem

 

[gfeier]

There IS a rifleman unit in Civ VI. It's called the ranger and it is listed as a recon unit. It requires rifling and is listed here:

http://well-of-souls.com/civ/civ6_units.html

 

[King Jason]

There IS a rifleman unit in Civ VI. It's called the ranger and it is listed as a recon unit. It requires rifling and is listed here:

http://well-of-souls.com/civ/civ6_units.html

That's a guess.

 

[gfeier]

That's a guess.

Yes it is. Do you have a different guess? if so, what?

 

[King Jason]

I don't, but don't tell someone that something is confirmed when it isn't.

 

[gfeier]

Arioch lists it on his page. If you check out rifling in the tech tree, the only icon there is a coonskin cap which certainly implies a fast, rifle-armed scout-type unit. It may just be a place-holder, but I'm fairly sure that something like it will appear in the game.

 

[King Jason]

Arioch lists it on his page. If you check out rifling in the tech tree, the only icon there is a coonskin cap which certainly implies a fast, rifle-armed scout-type unit. It may just be a place-holder, but I'm fairly sure that something like it will appear in the game.

I'm well aware where the information is coming from. It's still just a guess.

Just 'cause something end's up on Arioch's site doesn't mean it's correct. He does a good job, but he's also wrong plenty, too.

 

[gfeier]

I find it very hard to believe that there is no unit between musketmen and infantry, so I really expect we will see some sort of rifleman. We'll find out in due course.

 

[Metecury]

In looking through some old press releases it would seem that the corp/army combo is set to kick in during the Napoleonic period... Which probably means they cut riflemen and will keep the atrocious harquebus design used as the generic musketman... In re-reading the IGN May 11th article it would seem like the author called musketmen riflemen. I hope I'm wrong about this and they just haven't finished adding in the midgame units. It wouldn't prevent me from playing, but it sure as heck would make me skip as much of the midgame as possible to avoid the eyesore...

Apparently the read coat unlocks at military science which would hint at a later gunpowder unit popping up around then.

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

During WW2 the core infantry still used rifles invented before WW1, so generally WW2 infantry didn't differ that much from WW1 infantry. Assault rifles were rare yet.

Depends on how you define 'assault rifle' - the British BREN and the American BAR were both fully-automatic weapons that could be fired while moving and were issued at the squad level: the BAR was adopted in 1918, the BREN in the 1930s.

The major difference between 'WWI' infantry and the infantry of the post-mid-1930s was the addition of all the other weapons to the old rifles. At the beginning of WWI, the average infantry battalion (French, British, German) had 2 - 8 machine-guns total, and no other weapons except the bolt-action magazine rifle. By the beginning of WWII that same battalion had 27 - 36 automatic weapons in the infantry squads (automatic rifles in British and US Armies, light machine-guns in German, Soviet or French), 6 - 12 heavy machine-guns, 12 - 36 50 or 60mm mortars, 6 - 8 75 or 81/82mm mortars, and in the German and Soviet armies, 37 or 45mm antitank guns and 75 or 76mm light guns in the regimental units.
It was this Heavy Weapon firepower that made a huge difference between 1914 and 1939, not the type of rifle carried.

So, if we see Musketmen as those with Firelock musket and Infantry as those with Magazine rifle, we cover most of the firearms history. Also, the transition from one to another appeared during the second half of 19th century and matched switch from colorful uniforms to khaki with helmets. This looks like the biggest gear break since the mass adoption of firearms.

I agree that this would be the best of a really bad historical/gaming bargain, but that doesn't mean I'm ready to settle for it. At the least, we should get the Late Renaissance Pike and shot units (tercios, Swedish brigades, Nassau's battalions) with the matchlocks, the flintlocks that have and are providing so many of the Unique Units (Swedish 'Caroleans', British Redcoats, French Imperial Guards, American Minutemen, just for starters), the Magazine Rifle infantry and the WWII infantry. For one thing, each of these has a distinctively different 'look', from the dull cloth and metal helmets/breastplates of the pike-and-shot matchlock men to the bright coats, tricorns, bicornes, shakoes or kepis of the flintlock period, to the 'semi-dull' period of the smokeless powder ( though khaki is not universal: French were wearing the dark blue coat and red trousers right up to 1914, and the US Army didn't lose its 'Indian-fighting blue' uniform until after 1901: there's still room for color!)

One thing that might solve the problem of Too Many Units, Not Enough Tech Tree - which I can see looming in Civ VI, based on the published pictures of the truncated Tech Tree, is to have 'Promotions' to get new units and unit graphics without requiring specifically new Technologies.

Example: The Matchlock musket requires new Technology: gunpowder. The flintlock requires new Technology: something like Precision Metalwork to manufacture the 'firelock' for each musket.
BUT the conversion to blackpowder rifles requires no technology: rifles were being built in the Renaissance, it's just before the 'Monroe Effect' (look it up!) was discovered, the rifle wasn't practical on the battlefield. That chemical-physics discovery, coupled with Factory production, made it possible to supply rifles and try to use exactly the same tactics (see the American Civil War for how well That turned out!). That could be a simple 'Promotion' which allows you to spend X Gold per unit to convert to black powder rifles, and change the graphic on each unit from shako-wearing red/blue/white/green-coated flintlock fusilier to kepi/pithhelmet/pickelhaube-wearing rifleman.

Then, the magazine smokeless powder rifle requires new Chemical Technology of smokeless powder, but that is an outgrowth of Dynamite and Artificial Fertilizer development, so could be 'folded in' with one of those more general Technologies, and result in the khaki/feldgrau/olive-drab infantry of the twentieth (and late 19th) century.

Which would then be 'Promoted' by a card labeled, say, Stormtroop Tactics or Infantry Firepower which allows you to combine Machine-gun and Magazine Rifle units into Infantry - with a graphic change to the WWII-type uniform.

This would not be inconsistent with the Tech-Civics interaction already in Civ VI: I have only seen parts of the Civics Tree, but I immediately noticed that some units from the Tech Tree in Civ V, like Caravans, are now available through the Civics Tree - let's extend that to the gunpowder and other combat units.

Come to think of it, I haven't seen any part of the Civic Tree for the post Renaissance period - maybe that's exactly what they've already done...

 

[Kouvb593kdnuewnd]

It would just become to meassy to have every military development represented in the game. Civic cards will have a big influence on your combat strength. It also help nations that are a little behind on science and culture to not get overrun by keeping gaps between military techs.

 

[Haig]

Remember, that tech screen wasn't supposed to be shown, it's clearly work in progress, some techs are completely empty and they miss all the parts where tiles, districts and stuff gets more yields and +1 bonuses.

So for example the Rifling tech can have these yields, like a musketman getting a strenght increase.. or maybe a whole new unit beside the Ranger.

 

[Quoth the Raven]

Civ5 had too many especially in modern and above. Dont mind cutting some of them for a more consistent system.

I disagree with this. I liked the number of units in Civ V BNW. You didn't have to build many of the units, but they were there if you wanted to build them. The nature of frequently upgrading units is consistent with real life nations constantly upgrading their military equipment to get the edge in combat. Variety is always better.

 

[Acken]

Variety is always better.

Thats where i disagree and think mods are perfect to add extra units for people liking extra units for immersion rather than metagame relevance.