LK60 - Slow moving civ

[Rubberjello]

Preturn. Immediately declare war on the Hittites and invade in to the Mountain South of Hattusas and towards Tarsus. I don't think we need to worry about flips as our people are "Disdainful of the Hittites' culture"
Thank you (whoever) who built the Trebuchets! They allow more flexibility in attacking.
In an historic moment for Country, Our foot soldiers plod across their first (but certainly not the last!) foreign border and capture one worker.

IT. Hittite M.I. attacks our poor, outdated Enk Warrior aaaaannnnnnnddddd

LOSES! BWahahahahahahahahahahahaha! Golden age for us.

360 AD (1) Our gold jumps up to 120 per turn. An M.I., Pike, and Marketplace completes. I reshuffle around procuction and squares to better take advantage of the Golden Age. Drop Lux to 20%. It was kind of bloody- we lost 3 M.I. vs 4 pikes, but we got:

We got an intact barracks and only one resister. I can upgrade all our other units this turn with Leo's discount-o-rama.
We capture Tarsus with no losses and get a very nice bonus -

Dyes instantly go to all our cities. (2 workers) captured also.

370 AD (2) Healing turn. More unit moving towards the front. Resistance ends in our two new cities, and Libraries (culture) are started. Ugarit should be our next target (Incense), and it would cut the Hittite empire in half.
Strategy Question for the group: We can certainly afford to buy some techs now, but do we want to hold off and see what we can get out of the Hittites when they only have 2 cities left?
To be continued...

 

[Aggie]

to our warmonger RJ

 

[LKendter]

Thank you (whoever) who built the Trebuchets!
Your welcome. I had at least enough to let our stacks get a defensive bonus. We will still need more.


I reshuffle around procuction and squares to better take advantage of the Golden Age.
Well I wouldn't argue with some Cathedrals...


We can certainly afford to buy some techs now, but do we want to hold off and see what we can get out of the Hittites when they only have 2 cities left?
If we get a few techs we may get a 2 for 1 possibility. If we buy anything, it would be to expose more of the tech tree

 

[T-hawk]

We definitely want to take all of the Hittite cities except one, then take pointy-stick techs. Buying a few techs should be possible with the Golden Age income. I'd say to try and buy up to Education, to expose the fairly expensive and brokerable techs of Astronony and Banking. (Did the Hittites ever temporarily begin construction on Copernicus?)

 

[Rubberjello]

This was probably the most fun SG turn I've had in a long time.

380 AD (3) The Ottomans finish the Sistine Chapel. No Hittite counter-attacks. Starve down two occupied cities a bit. Change some build orders to Cathedrals as our Military should be able to handle the Hittites as is (considering they are also getting a pounding from the English and the Mongols. We buy Theology from the English for 198 gold and 22 gpt. Naturally everybody has Education and Printing Press. Hold it! The Mongols don't have Education. We've almost caught up with the laggards! [dance] Buy Education from the Chinese for 43 gpt. (Interesting, The English have no Iron!) Poop! The leaders all have Banking and Astronomy. We try for our first 2-fer in a long time. The Mongols will give us Invention for Education plus 20 gpt. As expected, everyone knows gunpowder. I stop the deals for a little while to build back up some money. (Still making 86 gpt)

390 AD (4) The Chinese finish Copernicus. A Hittite galley is spotted approaching our SE coast. Stage 12 M.I. and 2 Pikes on a Mountain South of Uraite, which should get us another Iron and 2 Incense.

400 AD (5) Lose one M.I. to an attacking Hittite M.I. The Chinese start Shakespeares? Are we really that far behind? Take out a Barb encampment in the Marshes. We capture Ugarit from 3 Pikes, a wounded M.I. and a Longbow with the loss of only one M.I. We also capture 3 workers. 5 M.I. and a Pike are staged outside of Kadesh.

410 AD (6) Gahhh! The English have Cavalry! And they stole Kadesh right out from under us. There goes one of our Incenses. Another Hittite city to the West is razed also this turn. They are down to 4 cities, and since we took their last Iron, they are going to be toast agains the English Cavs. The good news is that we have our trading routes open again to the rest of the world. We trade our new source of Iron to the English for Banking, Spices, and 250 gold. We trade Banking and Silks to the Ottomans for Astronomy. We give the Mongols Silks, Banking and 365 gold for Gunpowder and Printing Press. Everybody knows Chemistry and Democracy. The Hittites might not survive long enough for any pointy-stick tech deals. We have 1 Silk left to deal, but no one is offering much for it.

420 AD (7) Our pike survives a Longbow attack next to Aleppo and promotes to Elite. This may be a stupid move - but I build a colony on the Incense so I can drop the Lux rate down to 10%. Income increases by 30 gpt. We must rush culture in Ugarit to keep away the English from all the goodies lying around there. We capture Aleppo from 3 Pikes and 1 Longbow, losing only one M.I. I switch over all Cathedral builds to Banks. (Forgive me, Lee, but T-Hawk will vouch for me that I am a true "Capitalist" )

430 AD (8) Some Mongol Knight units show up in the west, smelling the death throes of the Hittites. I rush a settler in Hattusas and a Library in Ugarit.

440 AD (9) Hurry Library in Tarsus. Our first Banks start completing. Our forces hurry forward towards the last Hittite towns. They are willing to talk peace now, and will give up most of their techs, including our much-needed Chemistry.

450 AD (10) The Mongols are racing across our lands towards the Hittites. We capture Harran, but it was a bloodbath as we lost 3 M.I. doing it. (Vs 3 Pikes). Only two Hittite cities left. We have access to a Gems source now (not hooked up yet), so the Hittites kindly gave us Iron, Saltpeter, and 3 Luxes. A settler is on the way North to settle in an open area between the English and us. We could use a few more settlers to fill in some other areas, but I don't want to build them from our core during a Golden Age.

If we can get Chemistry from the Hittites and leave them with one city, then we could still get back into the tech race somewhat. We are making +183 gpt right now at 9-0-1, with some more Banks due soon. We are almost equal to both the Mongols and the Ottos, but China is way, way, ahead of everyone, with England clzose behind (I think). The good news is England is at war with China.

The Game (450AD)

 

[Aggie]

Great turn RJ

No AI's in the Industrial Age yet? If so, then we can use our free tech as a true slingshot being only a couple techs behind.

I vote for banks, libraries and universities. We are scientific and should make full use of it imvho.

I like the colony. It gives us more hapiness for a few turns at least. That should compensate the worker (slave?)

 

[LKendter]

I switch over all Cathedral builds to Banks. (Forgive me, Lee,
No forgiveness needed - it is still and infrastrucuture push. My goal was to not waste of GA just pumping out military. I never thought we could get to banks this soon.


LKendter
Rubberjello
Hotrod0823 (currently playing)
T-hawk (on deck)
Aggie

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.

 

[hotrod0823]

Nice Job RJ!

I've got it and may play late tonight.

Hotrod

 

[T-hawk]

This was probably the most fun SG turn I've had in a long time.

I was already thinking "Since TH5?"...

(Forgive me, Lee, but T-Hawk will vouch for me that I am a true "Capitalist" )

Yup.

We try for our first 2-fer in a long time. The Mongols will give us Invention for Education plus 20 gpt.

I called it Good trading to pull it off, and very nice with a three-fer-iron as well.

The worker colony is fine too. Although that reminds me that we might want to look for a worker farm now with rails approaching. Or just aggressively skim workers from size-12 cities.

 

[Rubberjello]

Thanks all for the congrats! Yes, the colony was a slave.

Originally posted by T-hawk
This was probably the most fun SG turn I've had in a long time.

I was already thinking "Since TH5?"...

Yep. I think you are right!

 

[hotrod0823]

LK60

450 AD (0): Excellent progress on the War with the Hittites. I see we have 2 more embassies to build will try to get them sooner rather than later. Checking build orders and don't make any changes. Considering a courthouse in Isin over a temple but have time to decide. Looking for a 2 fer I find 1 that may be more than that. I buy Democracy from England for 98gpt 150gold and silks. Democracy to the MOngols for Chemistry, Monarcy and 5 gold. Democracy and 3 gpt to the Ottomans for Metallurgy. WE are now behind China by Physics, Chivalry, Free artistry and Military Tradition and England by Chivalry and MT. Ahead of the Monogols by Metallurgy and on par with the Ottomans. Running Min science on Economics but I think we can get it if we build a few cheap univeristies soon.

460 aD (1): Kish completed a bank starts a unverisity as a cath isn't needed yet. Ur is building a cath but doesn't need it with our new found luxuries so I swap to a university. Against my better judgement settle what may be a terrible flip risk city where the settler is positioned, can't do it hold off and move the settler back to the territory. We can use him later.

470 AD (2): China and England Make peace. Erech builds a courthouse starts a bank. Lose 3 MDI but capture Hattusha. Hittites are an OCC. Move the settler now that Hastings is under Chinese control there is less of a flip risk will settle next turn and rush a library.

480 AD (3): Ur completed a Univeristy starts a cath. Sumer a bank starts a Granary. Agade a courthouse starts a bank. Destry the last Hittite city. Found the town of Zabalam and start a library. Hurry Libraries in Hurran an Alepo for some culture on the English boarder. Research at 10% to get Ecomomincs in a mere 40 more turns.

490 AD (4): A Bit of unit shuffling. The rushed libraries complete start temples. We can afford Physics but can't get a decent 2fer. Instead I turn on research and Econ is due in 12 turns.

500 AD (5): Sumer builds a granary starts a university. Umma a bank starts a university. Bad-tibira a courthouse starts a library. China has ToG and starts Newtons.

510 AD (6): Kish builds a university startsa cath. Harran riots and gets a scientist. Econ is due in 9 turns. Rush the library at Zalabam.

520 aD (7): Lagash builds a bank starts a university. English start Magellan's. Navigation is known by Ottomans, China and England.

530 AD (8): We have extra dyes but no one will give a fair price. They offer WMs but are they worth anything to us? I hold off for now.

540 AD (9): Ur builds a cath and starts a worker peal. Short rush the university of Sumer via a courthouse.

550 AD (10): Ur pops a worker starts a Tebuchet. Sumer a university starts a cath. Bad=tibira a library starts a granary. English start Newtons and Ottomans start Bachs. BTW our golden age is over but I don't think we will see the effects until next turn and unfortunately it will make the run at economics all the more difficult. . I still think it is worth persuing. We have more gpt coming back in 3 turns and then we can restart research and try to get to econ first. If we do then we should have enough gold to trade econ for Physics, ToG and Magnetism to get to the next age and use our free tech to pick up any stragglers. I think we can get back to tech parity with the others if Economics comes through.

Here is the Save:

http://civfanatics.net/uploads6/LK60-550AD.zip

 

[Aggie]

If it were me to decide, I would use all my potential cash and gpt to advance to the next age and get that free tech (when the opportunity comes, which will be very soon). Even when Economics is not researched yet. The Ottomans are the other Scientific Civ and I'd say that we don't want to risk that our free tech is next to worthless...

 

[LKendter]

I buy Democracy from England for 98gpt 150gold and silks.
It isn't worth us having another revolution - especially in a game with a target of military win. Why did you buy this expensive goverment tech?

===================================

Destry the last Hittite city.
Did they have no tech to extort?

===================================

LKendter
Rubberjello
Hotrod0823
T-hawk (currently playing)
Aggie (on deck)

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.

 

[T-hawk]

Note that Hotrod resold Democracy for both Metallurgy and Chemistry. I'm guessing that Democracy cost less than buying those two techs; in other words, we gained money by buying Democracy. That does happen sometimes. And after that happened, I would be very surprised if the Hittites still had any techs up on us, so may as well eliminate them.

(Although, reading it again, I think we could've just bought Metallurgy and sold that to the Mongols for Chemistry? That would've been cheaper than buying Democracy. EDIT again: no, you can't resell Metallurgy for a tech that comes before it. )

I see it; got two RBC12 games to play first so probably won't get to this one till tomorrow.

I think it might be time to start a worldwide dogpile on China, especially since they made peace with England. Do we have any active deals with China? Should we attack them by sea, or sign RoPs with everybody inbetween?

 

[Rubberjello]

World-wide Dogpile? If we can afford it, yes. We will need every friend available because I sure wouldn't want to face many of their Cavs with just M.I. and Pikes - or even Muskets. (Did we hook up our Saltpeter yet?). They do need to be slowed down, certainly. But we need to get to the next age also (OUR age! The Infantry-Artillery age.)
In any event, I can't see a serious offensive against China at the moment, but I would love to be proved wrong!

 

[hotrod0823]

T-Hawk was right on I was able to use Democracy to get Metallurgy and Chemistry from the Ottomans and China.

I also think there is a real chance that Economics will come in even after the GA ends. We can use that to get the remaining techs. I don't think it is time yet to throw in the towel.

Salt hookup is in the works.

I buy Democracy from England for 98gpt 150gold and silks. Democracy to the MOngols for Chemistry, Monarcy and 5 gold. Democracy and 3 gpt to the Ottomans for Metallurgy. WE are now behind China by Physics, Chivalry, Free artistry and Military Tradition and England by Chivalry and MT. Ahead of the Monogols by Metallurgy and on par with the Ottomans. Running Min science on Economics but I think we can get it if we build a few cheap univeristies soon.

For 150 gold, 98gpt and silks to England 5 gold to Mongols and 3 gpt to Ottomans we got Democracy, Chemistry, Metallurgy and Monarcy. {4 techs for 101 gpt, 155gold and silks} I don't think just buying Chemistry and Metallurgy would be any cheaper but I may be wrong.

 

[T-hawk]

Inherited turn:

Why are several bunches of workers clearing jungles and forests right next to unimproved grasslands? I think I've had to take the to Hotrod for that in other games before, too.

Hattusas swaps to courthouse; no need for a temple now as its library has expanded borders. Ditto Tarsus and Ugarit and Hattusha.

Can we think about building a wonder? I think so. We aren't pushing hard on military production right now; we aren't going to go on the offensive with MDI against cavalry. Bach's would be very nice to have, Smith's is also a possibility, and Newton's isn't terrible either. Ur isn't the place to do it, as I don't know what the cascade's been doing lately and I don't want to get stranded without a prebuild. Umma will try for a wonder; it swaps to the Palace.

==========

Between turns, the Golden Age ends. 6 more turns to Economics although we can't sustain that rate...

560 AD: Between turns, China declares war on the English. OK, we don't need to start a dogpile. And China buys the Ottomans against England too.

580 AD: We have our gpt payments back. Moving the slider to 60% research will get us Economics in 2 turns (a gain of 2 turns from before.) I take out a loan of 300 gold from England so we can push research for these two turns.

600 AD: Economics comes in... and we've got a monopoly! Bold move by Hotrod that really pays off now.

First we sell it to China for Physics + 690 gold.
Then to Ottomans plus 535 gold for Magnetism.
Then to England plus Dyes plus 28/turn for Theory of Gravity.
Free scientific tech... Medicine. The Ottomans got that too. But we can still slingshot.
Medicine to China for 670g + Navigation + Music Theory.
Medicine to England for 70/turn which is full price.
Magnetism + Music + Economics to Mongols for Free Artistry + Military Tradition + World Map + a worker.

Nine techs in one turn. Hole? What hole? OK, we still trail by Chivalry. Research slams to 100% on Steam Power, due in 9 turns.

And between turns, Osman calls us up:

610 AD: Charge England 20/turn to renew Iron for their Spices.

Start aggressively peeling workers off size-12 cities, though we still need about three more metric buttloads of 'em for rails.

650 AD: That's all, folks. Map in next post.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads6/lk60-650ad.zip

 

[T-hawk]

Whatever wonder we can get in Umma will be useful. I'd probably prioritize Smith's first, followed by Bach's, then Newton's.

England is losing ground FAST. At least that means the territory will be nice and easy to capture from the Chinese and Ottomans when we get artillery. Till then, it's a very normal rails and factories buildup phase.

 

[LKendter]

LKendter (on deck)
Rubberjello
Hotrod0823
T-hawk
Aggie (currently playing)

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.

 

[Aggie]

Got it! I'll play this after RBC12A