Maniac SG Discussion Thread
- Thread starter ToddMarshall
- Start date
Charis
Realms Beyond
Ridgelake and Skyfish are probably right. Since there also a lot of changes with air power and naval warfare that occur later on, I'm thinking that OBC plain-Babs Spaceship would be the way to go, Std or small size. For turns, if you were still asking, 20 for first round due to our one-city-ness would be good.
Charis
PS Good deal Matt
Charis
PS Good deal Matt
ToddMarshall
Maniac - Stellar Wingman
Well, that's good because I'm not going to have bloody time to do it anyway. 
. meldor finally responded in pm and said he'd be back saturday evening. Ill be moving saturday and early sunday so I'll start it up sunday evening. Everyone has until then to put their 2 cents worth in. Looks like its a normal old Babs space race setup. Any comments or suggestion for tweaks to the rules need to be in by sat night. Ive revised the rules just a bit, mainly because I had a couple test runs that looked completely hopeless w/o these options.
When we can declare war:
1) VS a civ that has a city boardering our capital, or is at least closest to our capital and touching boarders with our "core" we may declare war at any time IF it is being done as part of the core expansion. The first time we declare on a particular civ in this way, we may accept alliances from other civs IF we do it on the turn we declare. ROP's may be made IF they are made as a part of the alliance deal (so that the instant the alliance dies they die too). For this first war we may do whatever we want to that civ for 20 turns, afterwhich we must make peace. We should be prepared to take whatever cities we need from a civ in one war if at all possible (its allways been easily possible in my testing). Reason for this change is to allow for a little "pointy stick" research. In a couple of my tests we fell HOPELESSLY behind w/o this.
IF we have to declare war on a civ a second time for core expansion, we can NOT get alliances and MUST make peace as soon as they'll talk to us after we have reached our objective.
After we complete the Apollo Project and have discovered Fission we may declare war on a civ IF it is the only feasable way of obtaining a needed space ship part resource (Aluminum, Uranium or Rubber). Razing and colonizing is the prefered. If the only feasible way to get the resource is to capture a city, then we are alowed to. Those cities may build ONLY the following buildings and never any units: Temple OR Colosseum (to expand boarders for flip prevention or to bring the resource in range), walls, and Civil Defense.
And last, If appears we are HOPELESSLY behind on our ship, we may declare war on our leading rival for the purpose of razing the capital or denying aluminum or uranium. No alliances allowed, we have to do this on our own, and we have to make peace as soon as we have crippled their ship building ability.
MPP still allowed, but we may not attack enemy units on their territory if we declare via this triggering.
If war is delcared on us, we can still do our worst to whoever declares on us, and we may make alliances and rop's riders with anyone as long as its done the first turn after war is declared on us.
Scoring: THREE points for keeping our capital the #1 city in the world at all times after its temple is built.
One point for for each part we finish ahead of our closest rival (maximum 3 parts), only if we dont declare "spaceship sabotage" war on anyone.
TWO points for not having to declare war on anyone as a "spaceship sabotage".
One point for conducting all our wars "alliance free."
One point for avoiding all RB "dastardly" actions other than war declarations.
Only Mod element remaining will be the map size (90 x 90) with 7 civs. I will generate a map in the editor but will only look at the minimap (ill cover up most of the screen to prevent spoiler info as much as possible) to make sure we are on a real pangea with all civs on the same landmass. Since I won't know which start is ours or any real terrain info it should be negligable to none info wise. IF when I load it up we have a horrible starting spot, ill just rinse and repeat. All map settings will be "small map" except its actual size.
Turns will be 20 turns for the first round (you can take 10 if you want, but are allowed 20), 10 turns after that.
All other rules/settings remain as originally posted.
How's this sound?
. meldor finally responded in pm and said he'd be back saturday evening. Ill be moving saturday and early sunday so I'll start it up sunday evening. Everyone has until then to put their 2 cents worth in. Looks like its a normal old Babs space race setup. Any comments or suggestion for tweaks to the rules need to be in by sat night. Ive revised the rules just a bit, mainly because I had a couple test runs that looked completely hopeless w/o these options.When we can declare war:
1) VS a civ that has a city boardering our capital, or is at least closest to our capital and touching boarders with our "core" we may declare war at any time IF it is being done as part of the core expansion. The first time we declare on a particular civ in this way, we may accept alliances from other civs IF we do it on the turn we declare. ROP's may be made IF they are made as a part of the alliance deal (so that the instant the alliance dies they die too). For this first war we may do whatever we want to that civ for 20 turns, afterwhich we must make peace. We should be prepared to take whatever cities we need from a civ in one war if at all possible (its allways been easily possible in my testing). Reason for this change is to allow for a little "pointy stick" research. In a couple of my tests we fell HOPELESSLY behind w/o this.
IF we have to declare war on a civ a second time for core expansion, we can NOT get alliances and MUST make peace as soon as they'll talk to us after we have reached our objective.
After we complete the Apollo Project and have discovered Fission we may declare war on a civ IF it is the only feasable way of obtaining a needed space ship part resource (Aluminum, Uranium or Rubber). Razing and colonizing is the prefered. If the only feasible way to get the resource is to capture a city, then we are alowed to. Those cities may build ONLY the following buildings and never any units: Temple OR Colosseum (to expand boarders for flip prevention or to bring the resource in range), walls, and Civil Defense.
And last, If appears we are HOPELESSLY behind on our ship, we may declare war on our leading rival for the purpose of razing the capital or denying aluminum or uranium. No alliances allowed, we have to do this on our own, and we have to make peace as soon as we have crippled their ship building ability.
MPP still allowed, but we may not attack enemy units on their territory if we declare via this triggering.
If war is delcared on us, we can still do our worst to whoever declares on us, and we may make alliances and rop's riders with anyone as long as its done the first turn after war is declared on us.
Scoring: THREE points for keeping our capital the #1 city in the world at all times after its temple is built.
One point for for each part we finish ahead of our closest rival (maximum 3 parts), only if we dont declare "spaceship sabotage" war on anyone.
TWO points for not having to declare war on anyone as a "spaceship sabotage".
One point for conducting all our wars "alliance free."
One point for avoiding all RB "dastardly" actions other than war declarations.
Only Mod element remaining will be the map size (90 x 90) with 7 civs. I will generate a map in the editor but will only look at the minimap (ill cover up most of the screen to prevent spoiler info as much as possible) to make sure we are on a real pangea with all civs on the same landmass. Since I won't know which start is ours or any real terrain info it should be negligable to none info wise. IF when I load it up we have a horrible starting spot, ill just rinse and repeat. All map settings will be "small map" except its actual size.
Turns will be 20 turns for the first round (you can take 10 if you want, but are allowed 20), 10 turns after that.
All other rules/settings remain as originally posted.
How's this sound?
meldor
Deity
I am back. The game sounds good.
ToddMarshall
Maniac - Stellar Wingman
I am back from moving but about 4 hours later than expected and 10x more exhausted than expected. I'll get this one underway tomorrow night. Sorry for the delay.
ToddMarshall
Maniac - Stellar Wingman
Charis
Realms Beyond
Looks like a decent starting position, although as uber as high food would be. With a low #cities, an extra lux to sell is nice, although it might take forever for AI to get roads in place.
Ridgelake, I'm kinda hoping it's lake not ocean Higher food, and we're on a confirmed pangaea. I would probably move the worker onto the ivory right next to the water and see if it's 1 food (ocean) or 2 (lake), then decent where settler should go. We'll likely want to shift the settler to avoid wasting the bonus shield, and to make sure we're on fresh water (perhaps SW to river ivory). (Growing past 6 while building a wonder is very nice)
As far as what wonder, maybe you were thinking ocean for Colossus, but assuming we're going to be capturing a lot of initially small cities, Pyramids or Temple of Artemis would be great. And with the ivory and low wonder cost, Zeus would be great too. (I think Sirp's open SG game with one city for a long time built Pyramids and then got set up to go to war)
I would pop that hut before making a warrior btw (first build a worker might not hurt).
Charis
Ridgelake, I'm kinda hoping it's lake not ocean
Higher food, and we're on a confirmed pangaea. I would probably move the worker onto the ivory right next to the water and see if it's 1 food (ocean) or 2 (lake), then decent where settler should go. We'll likely want to shift the settler to avoid wasting the bonus shield, and to make sure we're on fresh water (perhaps SW to river ivory). (Growing past 6 while building a wonder is very nice)As far as what wonder, maybe you were thinking ocean for Colossus, but assuming we're going to be capturing a lot of initially small cities, Pyramids or Temple of Artemis would be great. And with the ivory and low wonder cost, Zeus would be great too. (I think Sirp's open SG game with one city for a long time built Pyramids and then got set up to go to war)
I would pop that hut before making a warrior btw (first build a worker might not hurt).
Charis
Pyramids would be superior to Artemis as we have cheap temples being the Babs. Plus Artemis expires IIRC.
I still say that the extra income from the Colossus will be huge for keeping up in tech. That outweighs the additional food from a lake, especially considering a harbor will get you the same food and will provide more secure trade routes. And looking at that start, we will be shield poor versus food poor once we are in republic.
Its all a matter of discussion anyway. Once Maniac moves the first worker, we will know which option we have.
I still say that the extra income from the Colossus will be huge for keeping up in tech. That outweighs the additional food from a lake, especially considering a harbor will get you the same food and will provide more secure trade routes. And looking at that start, we will be shield poor versus food poor once we are in republic.
Its all a matter of discussion anyway. Once Maniac moves the first worker, we will know which option we have.
Good points Ridgelake.
I agree with the points you made re the Colossus and a harbor.
If I was playing this game solo I would move the settler due west "4 on the numkey pad" hoping the water is salt. If it is, found there on the ivory. Leave the worker on the starting tile and start mining that BG.
Of course if the water is fresh then moving the settler to that tile looks pretty stupid.
Probably should move the worker first..............
I also agree with Charis in that we need to pop that hut before building a warrior, (Assuming founding doesn't pop it which it wouldn't settling due west of start).
Just my 2 cents worth.
Matt (hoping that water is salt.)
I agree with the points you made re the Colossus and a harbor.
If I was playing this game solo I would move the settler due west "4 on the numkey pad" hoping the water is salt. If it is, found there on the ivory. Leave the worker on the starting tile and start mining that BG.
Of course if the water is fresh then moving the settler to that tile looks pretty stupid.
Probably should move the worker first..............
I also agree with Charis in that we need to pop that hut before building a warrior, (Assuming founding doesn't pop it which it wouldn't settling due west of start).
Just my 2 cents worth.
Matt (hoping that water is salt.)
ToddMarshall
Maniac - Stellar Wingman
My plan is to build the Colossus if we can. However, my experience in C3C is that the AI is now UBER agressive at going after this wonder. Like, its been the FIRST wonder in EVERY game I've played. Conversely, the AI is not very fond of the Oracle anymore. I had one game where the GREAT WALL got built ahead of it (no kidding). My emperor game (I might post this somewhere if I ever get my other comp working. It would be a great read, especially watching all those modern age barbs sacking American colonies) I had the dreaded Colossus/Copernicus/Newton combo and I was an actual research power. I seriously doubit we can pull this off at this level.
The one wonder we could use the most though is The Great Library. I did have one test that we were ok w/o it BUT I got to pointy stick 5 diffrent civs and had Zeus.
Anyway, Im going to move the worker up the river to make sure we don't miss any cows/wheat, then likely move the settler due west. This keeps all the BG in range after the initial expansion, and plains are better than regular grass anyway (less turns to irrigate than to mine). AFTER the city is founded, I'll pop the hut. We can't build settlers, but maybe we can pop one to merge into the capital
If your praying for resources, pray we have either iron or coal near. If we have neither we are about sunk as I can't see how we afford both at steam. That's never happened in a test yet (allways had iron), but it could. If we don't have Aluminum or Uranium, we can cope, but no rails *shudder*.
OK, off to start it.
Edit: can't keep you in suspense. The water is salty. But we have ANOTHER grass game forest NW of the one in the teaser, and only 4 costal squares, one of which has a fishie
The one wonder we could use the most though is The Great Library. I did have one test that we were ok w/o it BUT I got to pointy stick 5 diffrent civs and had Zeus.
Anyway, Im going to move the worker up the river to make sure we don't miss any cows/wheat, then likely move the settler due west. This keeps all the BG in range after the initial expansion, and plains are better than regular grass anyway (less turns to irrigate than to mine). AFTER the city is founded, I'll pop the hut. We can't build settlers, but maybe we can pop one to merge into the capital
If your praying for resources, pray we have either iron or coal near. If we have neither we are about sunk as I can't see how we afford both at steam. That's never happened in a test yet (allways had iron), but it could. If we don't have Aluminum or Uranium, we can cope, but no rails *shudder*.
OK, off to start it.
Edit: can't keep you in suspense. The water is salty. But we have ANOTHER grass game forest NW of the one in the teaser, and only 4 costal squares, one of which has a fishie
